My side of the story (Falcon F/O)

[Firebird2XC]

Yes, there were a couple because the FlightSafety sim in KSAT broke. They send me home and told me to finish me up in the airplane. I waited 4 weeks for the first call and had 1 hour of instruction in Pittsburgh. 5 weeks later they suddenly called me that I had a checkride the next day. So I had to do my checkride in the actual airplane in Pittsburgh with 1 hour of training over a 9 week period.

You're a scab. You're done.

Thanks for coming out- your career's demise will serve as a wonderful example to others.

Leave your ratings in whatever trash receptacle you find handy- you likely won't need them in the future.

Good luck with your future non-aviation endeavors.

 

[Kristie]

What? It matters. I think there's a massive difference between
knowingly crossing and flying out of ignorance.
He's still a scab by definition but I think it's important to know whether he's a scumbag scab or just a scab as a result of unfortunate circumstances beyond his control.

beyond his control....did you really just say that? everyone picks their battles, makes their choices....there was no choice there that was beyond his control.


and I have to admit, i'm very pleased that everyone (except for a few) participating in this thread is staying within the realms of our forum rules. I applaud your efforts to remain professional and courteous, no matter the circumstances, unlike the other forums. We really are a great community...let's keep that up! Thank you JCer's!


guys...we will keep the peace here...keep it civil, keep it professional.

 

[Componere lites]

They were doing rides in the plane in 2000 at CHQ?

Can Martin back this up?

Yes, there were a couple because the FlightSafety sim in KSAT broke. They send me home and told me they would finish me up in the airplane. I waited 4 weeks for the first call and had 1 hour of instruction in Pittsburgh. 5 weeks later they suddenly called me that I had a checkride the next day. So I had to do my checkride in the actual airplane in Pittsburgh with 1 hour of training over a 9 weeks period.

 

[subpilot]

Yes, there were a couple because the FlightSafety sim in KSAT broke. They send me home and told me they would finish me up in the airplane. I waited 4 weeks for the first call and had 1 hour of instruction in Pittsburgh. 5 weeks later they suddenly called me that I had a checkride the next day. So I had to do my checkride in the actual airplane in Pittsburgh with 1 hour of training over a 9 weeks period.

This story does not add up but I won't even go there.

 

[ThatOtherDude]

beyond his control....did you really just say that? everyone picks their battles, makes their choices....there was no choice there that was beyond his control.


and I have to admit, i'm very pleased that everyone (except for a few) participating in this thread is staying within the realms of our forum rules. I applaud your efforts to remain professional and courteous, no matter the circumstances, unlike the other forums. We really are a great community...let's keep that up! Thank you JCer's!


guys...we will keep the peace here...keep it civil, keep it professional.

I did say that. I know scheduling to be sneaky enough to mislead someone to do something they wouldn't otherwise want to do. I know the schedulers at Colgan try to pull some crazy and at times even illegal scams just to cover a flight.

Yeah he flew back. I can't blame him. His job was on the line.

I too appreciate this discussion but we as pilots need to be more united and support each other even if we screw up. It seems like some of you are just trying to crucify the guy. He's obviously sorry and if he crossed knowingly is still in question. And why would he stop flying when he came back? If he was a true scab he'd just keep on working.

Focus your criticizm and anger where it belongs...on management of both airlines.

It could happen to anyone of us but for a charter company who's always flying different call signs I can see it being easier. I'm surprised they didn't change the call sign. As a matter of fact there are probably charters flying spirit customers without knowing it.

Don't convict and sentence him before knowing for sure is all I'm saying.
There is a difference between what this guy did and some of some of the real scab scumbags a Continental.

 

[CirrusMonkey]

Deleted, nevermind....

 

[Rocketman99]

Yeah he flew back. I can't blame him. His job was on the line.

That is not an excuse! At that point he knowingly and willingly was scabbing!! There were plenty of ways to get out of it at that point. Hell he just came off two weeks of sick leave...what's another day? The brotherhood and singing kumbayah doesn't work when you cognizantly cross the line and scab, which is exactly what the return flight was. I can look past the first flight. There were enough mitigating circumstances to make it a plausible mistake. NONE OF THOSE EXISTED FOR THE RETURN FLIGHT!!!! Sorry. No sympathy here.

 

[kellwolf]

I think you also have to remember Onno didn't grow up in the US - so the intricate details of US employee/employer relations and the history of pilot strikes isn't something he is particularly knowledgeable of.

I highly doubt if anyone committed such a serious faux pas in any other country outside of the US, they'd say "Oh, don't worry about it." The lesson to learn from this is be involved in your career and know your surroundings. Not knowing how unions work in the US airline industry is akin to not knowing how your hydraulic systems work on your aircraft.

 

[Bumblebee]

I can look past the first flight. There were enough mitigating circumstances to make it a plausible mistake. NONE OF THOSE EXISTED FOR THE RETURN FLIGHT!!!! Sorry.

:yeahthat:

 

[Componere lites]

This story does not add up but I won't even go there.

I guess you must have been there, eh!

 

[TUCKnTRUCK]

I guess you must have been there, eh!

Question, do you still work for the company that "tricked" you into scabbing? I wouldn't. How does that speak for the rest of their operation? I be pretty pissed that they had marked my career such. I assume that they cut corners which the FAA might be interested in as well?

 

[ThatOtherDude]

That is not an excuse! At that point he knowingly and willingly was scabbing!! There were plenty of ways to get out of it at that point. Hell he just came off two weeks of sick leave...what's another day? The brotherhood and singing kumbayah doesn't work when you cognizantly cross the line and scab, which is exactly what the return flight was. I can look past the first flight. There were enough mitigating circumstances to make it a plausible mistake. NONE OF THOSE EXISTED FOR THE RETURN FLIGHT!!!! Sorry. No sympathy here.

Calling out sick at an outstation under these circumstances isn't an easy call to make. Stranding an airplane is what he'd be doing. He'd probably get fired. You can't fly home if you're "sick" either. It saddens me that you rather see him fired than to see him fly back. If I was on strike I'd want everyone's support too but I can't expect someone to put their job on the line for it. I say this as a proud union member.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

It saddens me that you rather see him fired than to see him fly back.

I'd rather see anyone fired than become a SCAB. One is correctable. One is not.

 

[Bumblebee]

I guess you must have been there, eh!

Listen, your story seems odd, and that is important because the whole initiation of your SCAB flight seems implausible. Now this seems implausible, as well.

I am curious why you are here...is it to try to repair your reputation?

I can tell you that the above quote doesn't do you any good.

 

[I_Money]

I am curious why you are here...is it to try to repair your reputation?

I believe Doug asked him to come and share his side of the story here -

 

[Kristie]

to give him a chance to explain his side of the story (to clarify)

 

[mikecweb]

I have NO dog in this at all. My only advice would be this guy owes JC and the members here nothing. If I were him I'd say his story to the Spirit guys. If they accept it fine, if not oh wells it's a mistake he'll have to live with. Every time you goto work you can make a mistake that you'll have to live with the rest of your life. This one he just happened to survive and has to live his consequences. If the Spirit pilots and aviation community as a whole can't forgive him than move on with your life. This messed up industry isn't worth the heartburn. Doesn't sound like aviation has done alot of good to this guy thus far so if this is his last job it won't be the end of the world.

But the baiting and then calling him a scab especially by those that aren't Spirit pilots is much like kids picking on the messed up kid in middle school.

 

[Bumblebee]

I believe Doug asked him to come and share his side of the story here -

to give him a chance to explain his side of the story (to clarify)

I want to know why HE wants to be here....

 

[mtsu_av8er]

I think you also have to remember Onno didn't grow up in the US - so the intricate details of US employee/employer relations and the history of pilot strikes isn't something he is particularly knowledgeable of.

Nobody cares about such things. he's IN the U.S. now, we're not in his world.

 

[CaptBill]

Onno, I will acknowledge up front that I don't know you. I appreciate your attempt to explain your side of what happened on this controversial issue and I will also give you some credit for a willingness on your part to accept some lumps for what you now clearly see as a bad decision.

Let me be clear about something - I work with some individuals that crossed picket lines and some of them are even nice guys. That being said, they are, and always will be scabs. It is something that can never be erased or atoned for. They exist in a world much like someone with a disability - they get by, but their co-workers all know who and what they are.

Here is my take on your situation. The current state of the airline industry has pilots on the brink - physically, emotionally and financially. Pilots have had it with management teams that have pushed things too far. Pilots are now starting to push back and the Spirit Strike may be just the start of things to come. Your decision to fly this flight at this particular time will likely cost you your career in mainstream aviation. Your timing was as bad as your judgment. Pilots will see you as a spineless pawn being told (or tricked) by management to screw your fellow pilots - and you did it. You also have the disadvantage (unlike the 83-85 Continental Scabs), of being one name on a list of two pilots who flew struck Spirit work. Your name will be remembered.

I think I have a reputation on this forum for reason and common sense - at least I hope I do. That being said, my advice to you would be to consider other non-aviation career options. I just don't see any meaningful way for you to salvage the predicament you find yourself in.

Perhaps others can find truth and the importance of character in your misfortune.

I wish you well in your weighty decisions ahead.

 

[Socal321]

That is not an excuse! At that point he knowingly and willingly was scabbing!! There were plenty of ways to get out of it at that point. Hell he just came off two weeks of sick leave...what's another day? The brotherhood and singing kumbayah doesn't work when you cognizantly cross the line and scab, which is exactly what the return flight was. I can look past the first flight. There were enough mitigating circumstances to make it a plausible mistake. NONE OF THOSE EXISTED FOR THE RETURN FLIGHT!!!! Sorry. No sympathy here.

He already scabbed and he knew it by that point. Stranding the flight would have been noble but he was already a scab. At the outstation, he had the choice of stranding the airplane and being fired with the hope that he might get some kind of deal with the Spirit MEC for a future interview(unlikely). Or to do the flight and keep his job. Just as they said in elementary school, the trick is early prevention.