Thoughts and opinions on career change pilots?

[bimmerphile]

This goes both ways. Don’t get me started on the retired 121 guy that now wants to fly corporate jets 91 but doesn’t want to throw bags or empty the lav or take out the trash or do some flight planning. All because he doesn’t “need the job.” And then undercuts guys that don’t want to fly 121 that are trying to make a decent living.

it’s not “both ways,” most of these were retired cops, firefighters, chiropractors, dentists, mechanics etc. You're describing the same person- someone with no skin in the game who has no reason to be invested in the job. people treat it differently when it puts food on the table

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

When I was a FO, I had CAs who were dangerous! They wouldn’t deice! They would fly super fast and crazy! They had bad attitudes! They were with pension plans the rest of us didn’t have! They were nepo babies! They thought they were God! I couldn’t wait to upgrade. I’d take the first upgrade I can get. I wouldn’t want to fly with these losers and couldn’t wait to be by own boss one day.


Now I’m Captain.


Let me tell you about this dangerous FO I had who was a contractor. Let me tell you about a crappy FO who couldn’t fly worth a damn that used to be a real estate agent. Man these second career FOs suck. They don’t know how to fly. No confidence and lack of skill. They should have stuck to their other day job.


Why can’t these FOs be like me? I wake up in the morning and show up at 8am for a 8am van. That’s not Corn Flakes I’m eating. That was Gold Flakes. Pure effin gold. It allows me to piss excellence every morning. Shiny and beautiful.

Except the contractor from Napa and the Real Estate agent from Sonoma were career change captains that I was asked to babysit by a 135 operator. The 8AM van guy was a captain at a 135 who berated me about not showing up on time at 8AM. I've been asked to tone it down but perhaps you could learn to read good?

 

[BrettInLJ]

Exceedingly positive from my perspective. But, of course, by the time I have exposure to them, there’s been some ‘filtering’.

The real pains in the rump are the influencer-types. No, no one asked about your skin regimen, how you eat healthy, what kind of protein shakes you suggest, “ooh, new epaulets, why don’t you take a photo when they’ve actually seen the sunlight” and I’m sorry, but most of the worlds ‘best/youngest/shortest/tallest/fastest’ (whatever) has already been done, focus less on how cool you think you are, stop avoiding reserve (because you over bid) and go work.

Uh oh... I just realized I'm a "double" career changer and recently gave out solicited advice on my skincare regimen (SPF moisturizers for the flight deck) on a certain Messenger group. Am I an influencer and I didn't know it? Am I one of THOSE? Do I need post walkaround videos on Tik Tok now?

@BEEF SUPREME As a CA at my regional I flew with a good number career changer FO's and there didn't seem to be any more or less "better or worse" ones compared to the non-career changers. Sorry your experience has been bad with a few that happened to be career changers. Of course, maybe because I am one too I just didn't notice.

 

[derg]

Did you make one of those “Hay guys, what’s up, people have been asking about…” intros?

 

[Ian_J]

Focusing on the positives here…

I’ve flown with some cool career changers. A bee keeper. A restaurant owner. A house flipper. Very cool stories and I appreciated their appreciation for this industry.

I’ve flown with some cool lifelong 121ers. I’ve learned so much about the history of the industry from them and cool stories about jets and props no one flies anymore.

I don’t know what military pilots are… they’re sort of a hybrid, but I’ve enjoyed talking with them too. I will say though, two Navy pilots on an augmented crew where I’m the third man out is insufferable. Navy pilots together are the absolute worst.

 

[killbilly]

Uh oh... I just realized I'm a "double" career changer and recently gave out solicited advice on my skincare regimen (SPF moisturizers for the flight deck) on a certain Messenger group. Am I an influencer and I didn't know it? Am I one of THOSE? Do I need post walkaround videos on Tik Tok now?

Did you get a commission from Amazon? Because the package arrived yesterday.

Focusing on the positives here…

I’ve flown with some cool career changers. A bee keeper. A restaurant owner. A house flipper. Very cool stories and I appreciated their appreciation for this industry.

I’ve flown with some cool lifelong 121ers. I’ve learned so much about the history of the industry from them and cool stories about jets and props no one flies anymore.

I don’t know what military pilots are… they’re sort of a hybrid, but I’ve enjoyed talking with them too. I will say though, two Navy pilots on an augmented crew where I’m the third man out is insufferable. Navy pilots together are the absolute worst.

I, too flew with a beekeeper! The guy was the biggest Eeyore CA you could imagine until I asked him about his beekeeping op and then he lit up like Vegas at Christmas. Fascinating stuff, actually. I learned a lot.

 

[BrettInLJ]

Did you get a commission from Amazon? Because the package arrived yesterday.

Not at all. Now can I interest you in some Roche Possay body lotion to protect your arms this summer while you check the spinny spin things and flippy flaps on your walkabout? Just use the discount code BrettsBesties2024 at checkout for 10% off. But first be sure to click that like and subscribe button down below.

 

[ppragman]

Why do you care so much about what dudes on the internet think of you? It seems to be affecting your mental health.

Very few of us post on a regular basis calling other members stupid. Pretty sure it’s against the rules here, but it’s kind of been the thunderdome in here in terms of moderation.

 

[ppragman]

As I alluded to in the “why are you here” post, it’s one thing if someone who is active in our community and people know who they are occasionally shows their ass, but people who post prolifically without really being part of out group is distracting and toxic. They’re literally here because they’re miserable and they want everyone else to be too.

this is a learned behavior

 

[Rosstafari]

It’s kind of weird reading this thread as a career changer.

Like you’re in a room where everyone is talking about you, unaware that you’re sitting *right there*.

 

[derg]

It’s kind of weird reading this thread as a career changer.

Like you’re in a room where everyone is talking about you, unaware that you’re sitting *right there*.

Reminds me of a social network I was on during some of the more 'protesty' times after the George Floyd killing.

"Well, you can always ask a black guy, one's right here!"

 

[ppragman]

Reminds me of a social network I was on during some of the more 'protesty' times after the George Floyd killing.

"Well, you can always ask a black guy, one's right here!"

<the white moderates that MLK decried>But... then we'd have to talk to him?</the white moderates that MLK decried>

 

[zmiller4]

It really is one of the only accounts that I really look forward to seeing posts from.

Holy crap how did I miss this guy.

“Slangin RJ iron as hard as it can be slangt…the Corn Sea is no place for the soft children of summer”.

Amazing.

 

[ASpilot2be]

Holy crap how did I miss this guy.

“Slangin RJ iron as hard as it can be slangt…the Corn Sea is no place for the soft children of summer”.

Amazing.

It really is the best thing on IG!

 

[Screaming_Emu]

It really is the best thing on IG!

You’ve seen the cat videos, right?

 

[FlyChicaga]

Did you make one of those “Hay guys, what’s up, people have been asking about…” intros?

Make sure you like and smash that subscribe button

 

[Kingairer]

As a mid-life career changer, some recent comments have me curious about the outside view of pilots that have switched over. Being on the inside of that group, I don’t have the perspective that y’all might have.


“…The aviation industry would be MUCH better with out the second career idiots coming over and talking about how they never have to work a day in their life nonsense.”

“…I've seen second career types come through aviation plenty of times and the only thing positive about them is that they retire quickly and go away. They are second as the worst person to work with only to trust funders.”

I'll be the contrarian here...When I think of career changers I flash back to my days as a young RJ captain before the hour requirement rules. We had plenty of career changers who went and threw 100K at ATP or some flight academy and were suddenly an airline pilot with 500hours a year or so later. Ill make a generalization, and say that these were some of the worst pilots I flew with.
Now days, the bar to employment is a little higher, at least with total flight time, and certainly by the time they reach the 2nd airline (major, ulcc etc etc), theyve moved on from career changer and are just another airline pilot.

 

[N826AW]

It’s kind of weird reading this thread as a career changer.

Like you’re in a room where everyone is talking about you, unaware that you’re sitting *right there*.

I thought the same thing. Can you imagine stumbling on this thread via Google while trying to make the career change decision?

 

[Screaming_Emu]

I'll be the contrarian here...When I think of career changers I flash back to my days as a young RJ captain before the hour requirement rules. We had plenty of career changers who went and threw 100K at ATP or some flight academy and were suddenly an airline pilot with 500hours a year or so later. Ill make a generalization, and say that these were some of the worst pilots I flew with.
Now days, the bar to employment is a little higher, at least with total flight time, and certainly by the time they reach the 2nd airline (major, ulcc etc etc), theyve moved on from career changer and are just another airline pilot.

I think it’s not so much a career changer issue as much as it is a lack of passion for the job. Whether it’s a well off career changer, delta daddy’s kid, or someone who has had the passion beaten from them over the years, it sucks working with people who don’t even want to pull their own weight.

One of the worst captains I ever flew with was a former enlisted coastguard guy. He’d disappear every leg to go strut the terminal in his uniform and show up right before door close to make a passenger facing PA. The first leg or two, he’d find everything done because I’m a team player. Sometimes you gotta run off and grab coffee or poop on a turn. But when it became clear it was going to happen every leg, I decided to disappear too.

Was voluntold to resign at Surejet for HR reasons, came to Atlas on the 767 for a while, heard he couldn’t handle being an FO again so he went to be a street captain at Piedmont.

Zero desire to do actual work, not open to the input from anyone else, was just there to feel important, but was always the first to bemoan “these young millennials don’t want to work…”

 

[Screaming_Emu]

It’s kind of weird reading this thread as a career changer.

Like you’re in a room where everyone is talking about you, unaware that you’re sitting *right there*.

I can see that, but I think it’s more that some of us need to work on our delivery.

The truth is that SOME career changers are awful (just like any other group) and if written and read correctly, this could be a learning experience for career changers on what attitudes to avoid.

Generally, most people who have had a life long love of airplanes and the passion that goes with that will be fantastic to work with.