CFI Initial Oral Passed!

ckoele17

Well-Known Member
A few days ago I successfully passed my CFI oral. I thought I would do a write up for everyone on here attempting the same thing in 2020. The oral was completed on 8/29/2020 and I am working on rescheduling the flight. Hoping to get it done within the week. Below is a full "gouge"

Examiner: Ed Verville
Date: 8-29-2020
KBTL


Oral: 5.0 Hours

Ed started with an FAA chart of airport markings and signs. He will go through it asking what each one means, and why they are on the airport surface. This includes what side of the runway or movement area you are on.

FOI

  • Talked about the definition of learning and how students learn
  • Laws of learning
  • Levels of learning (likes to see an example)
  • Scenario based training including characteristics of a good scenario as well as a good example
  • Aviation instructor responsibilities and CFI responsibilities (they are different)
  • Professional development as flight instructors and how we can continue our knowledge/education/ratings
  • How to renew a CFI certificate as well as the difference between renew and reinstate
  • How students forget information
  • Aids in retention
  • How can CFI’s help students retain information
  • Lesson planning
  • How do we prepare for a lesson plan with a student
  • Different training delivery methods
  • Computer based training and the aspects/positives that go along with that
  • Types of memory
  • Types of instructional aids
  • The difference between an informal and formal lecture

Runway Incursion Avoidance

  • This was pretty straight forward, I kept the CFI PTS open and made sure to cover every area talking about Runway Incursion Avoidance. Be sure to cover every area of the PTS as he wants you to “teach” this as a lesson to a student. During this section of the oral, I pulled up a taxi diagram for midway airport after covering the areas in the PTS, I briefed Ed on a taxi route and then gave him a mock clearance. He did simple things like not hold short of the correct runways or turn on the wrong taxiway. After this lesson he asked me things like threshold markings, elevation, and hotspots on the taxiway diagram. Hot spot information can be found through foreflight using the hotspot button.

Collision Avoidance

  • After runway incursion avoidance, Ed had me teach him a lesson plan about collision avoidance. He went off on a tangent about how Tenerife was the worst accident in history. After this, I made sure to cover every area in the CFI PTS in regards to my “lesson plan”. Be sure to include scanning at sections at a time, how the FAA states the “see and avoid” regardless if you are VFR or IFR. We then talked about scanning at night and how we use our peripheral vision. He asked about night scanning, as well as different illusions we might see during the day and at night when scanning. We closed the discussion with right of way rules.

Note: For these lessons, he wants you to teach him as if he were a private student. If you cover every area in the PTS, he will not have many questions other than simple things which are included above. If you need to, he is totally ok with you referencing the FAR/AIM as well as other FAA publications (PHAK, AFH, ETC). For each lesson I had pre-made lesson plans open which he liked and had no problem with. After FOI, it's free game other than google.

Principles of Flight

  • Be sure to know your aerodynamics
  • Talked about the four forces of flight in straight and level as well as in climbs and descents
  • Asked about how a wing creates lift. This includes Newton's laws and Bernoulli's principle. Make sure to draw out each and he wont have many questions about lift.
  • We then went into talking about angle of attack, critical angle of attack, and the lift to drag ratio.
  • Talked about types of stability (static and dynamic). We talked about which one is most desirable for small GA aircraft.
  • Later on in the oral, we discussed the phases of a spin as well as how we recover from a spin (I am including this section in the principles of flight)
  • Load factor and how it changes with weight
  • Looked over my weight and balance and had no questions regarding that
  • Talked about the cirrus and how it is not approved for a spin
  • Had questions about if a piper or Cessna were approved for spins
  • Talked about categories of aircraft (normal, utility, and aerobatic). This included the load factors of each

Closed the discussion of aerodynamics with why stall speed increases with weight, why load factor plays a roll into aircraft maneuvering, A Vg diagram for the cirrus, as well as simple questions like “how much would our stall speed increase if we were at 60 degrees of bank.” For this, he likes to see you reference the diagram in the PHAK and make your calculations accordingly.


FAR 61

  • We started out the conversation talking about the definition of cross country. This included private, instrument, and commercial. Be sure to know where this is in the FAR/AIM and the exact verbiage for each.
  • What kind of pilot certificates and instructor certificates are issued under Part 61
  • When a student pilot log PIC time
  • Talked about complex and high performance endorsements and why a private pilot might have a hard time finding them in the FAR’s (because it's under additional aircraft ratings)
  • The type of aircraft categories that can be placed on an instructor certificate
  • Asked if instrument time could be for a PPL could be counted if it was in a simulator (no because in the FAR it states that training must be done in a AIRCRAFT)

After this questioning and discussion, we then went into endorsements in detail

(For the endorsement section, I had a “cheat sheet” printed out for all the endorsements needed for each rating. I also listed verbiage based on the AC 61-65 and how I would write them in a students logbook. Ed had few questions as I was sure to cover everything.

  • Talked about the required endorsements for a student going on their first solo.
  • Asked about pre solo quizzes
  • Pre solo training requirements
  • Cross country solo endorsements and requirements
  • Private pilot practical test endorsements
  • All other practical test endorsements (three things needed to be stated… 61.39)
  • Asked about CFI record keeping
  • Talked about duration of a CFI certificate and how to renew once its gone
  • Motor vehicle actions and what I would do if a student came to me saying he had just gotten a DUI
  • Asked me to list off the aeronautical experience requirements by memory and then double check my work with the FAR
  • We closed the discussion with how to get a student who has a private single-engine to add a private multi-engine

This section was brief, however, be sure to know endorsements in depth and know where to find things in the FAR/AIM. Ed has no problem with you looking through, however, it makes it easier if you know where to find it.





Maneuver Lesson

Ed assigned me slow flight for the maneuver lesson. He left the room to get coffee and gave me 10-15 minutes to prepare for the lesson. He had me teach him as if he were a commercial student. He pretended to have a pretty good working knowledge of aerodynamics. Whatever lesson plan you are assigned. Be sure to give an overview and motivation/story to why it is important. Then cover what you are going to discuss. After that, dive into the lesson and teach it. Close with an overview of the key points and things to take away. Below is how I presented my information in detail.

Slow Flight

  • Overview

  • What slow flight is and the definition

  • Why slow flight is important

Then went into the content. This included defining slow flight, the relationship of power and flight characteristics (pitch for airspeed, power for altitude, power curve, as well as drag and types of drag in depth), maneuvering during slow flight, relationship of CG to flight characteristics and controllability, and sense and “feel” during slow flight

Then I went into how to fly the maneuver in depth including the pre maneuver flow, clearing turns, and common errors associated with slow flight per the Cirrus SR-20.

I concluded the lesson plan with a brief review of the main points, the commercial pilot ACS Skills Standards, and asked Ed if he had any questions. He had no comments and we moved on.

Random Questioning

  • Ed asked about the Cirrus interconnect system, and how it helps/hinders stall recoveries.
  • We talked about failures on the ground and in flight
  • Glide speed and ratio, take off performance, and why checklist are important
  • Ed went on another target about how he had an engine failure at 9000 feet in a Cessna and glided down to land.
  • Talked about the five stages of landing based on the PHAK
  • Difference between the PTS and the ACS
  • Talked about demonstration stalls and the situations a student could get into into each
  • Taught him about wake turbulence procedures, avoidance, and how wingtip vortices are formed
Ed had a lot of random questions at this point in the oral. Be prepared to talk about anything as he will change gears quickly. He did not have any problem with me referencing my notes at the point in the oral.

Spins

  • Talked about the phases of a spin
  • How do we get into a spin
  • How do we get out of a spin (included recovery procedures)
  • Talked for about 15 minutes about he aerodynamics in a spin and why the aircraft is not gaining airspeed and “stabilized”
  • Talked about the differences between a spin and a spiral
  • Asked about the recovery procedures for both
  • Then went into unusual attitudes and recovery procedures
  • Concluded the conversation with talking about why the Cirrus is not approved for spins
  • Talked about a forward slip vs a side slip and when we use each

Weather

  • We talked about weather charts for the rest of the oral. This included METAR’s, TAF’s, ARIMET’s, SIGMENT’s, and CONVECTIVE SIGMENT’s.
  • Ed then showed me multiple charts from aviationweather.gov and had me describe them. This included valid time periods, whether they were forecast, current, and features each described.
  • Talked about other random weather aspects such as downdrafts and thunderstorms


This concluded the oral portion of the CFI check ride with Ed. Throughout the oral, Ed had various questions on each subject to test if you knew what you were talking about and if you could teach it to a student. Overall, I would highly recommend going with him as he is easy to talk to and has a lot of great stories. The Oral portion ended in a pass. Due to poor weather, I will complete the flight on another day.
 
Wow, good job with the oral! Thanks for the very informative and comprehensive write-up. I like the way that your examiner approached the oral. It sounds like you got a very thorough, but common-sense kind of exam. Good luck on the flight portion.

Reminder: Taking the flight portion of a CFI checkride is like painting with Bob Ross ("The Joy of Painting"). There are no mistakes, just happy accidents. :) If you mess up a maneuver, just critique it, explain what went wrong, and explain how to correct it.
 
@ckoele17 ..... Congratulations. It's been a long time since my CFI. Did the oral and checkride in a Cessna 150 with a GADO guy in Jackson, Mississippi. 1 hour for the oral and 1 hour for the checkride.....nothing like you had. Good work.
 
A few days ago I successfully passed my CFI oral. I thought I would do a write up for everyone on here attempting the same thing in 2020. The oral was completed on 8/29/2020 and I am working on rescheduling the flight. Hoping to get it done within the week. Below is a full "gouge"

Examiner: Ed Verville
Date: 8-29-2020
KBTL


Oral: 5.0 Hours

Ed started with an FAA chart of airport markings and signs. He will go through it asking what each one means, and why they are on the airport surface. This includes what side of the runway or movement area you are on.

FOI

  • Talked about the definition of learning and how students learn
  • Laws of learning
  • Levels of learning (likes to see an example)
  • Scenario based training including characteristics of a good scenario as well as a good example
  • Aviation instructor responsibilities and CFI responsibilities (they are different)
  • Professional development as flight instructors and how we can continue our knowledge/education/ratings
  • How to renew a CFI certificate as well as the difference between renew and reinstate
  • How students forget information
  • Aids in retention
  • How can CFI’s help students retain information
  • Lesson planning
  • How do we prepare for a lesson plan with a student
  • Different training delivery methods
  • Computer based training and the aspects/positives that go along with that
  • Types of memory
  • Types of instructional aids
  • The difference between an informal and formal lecture

Runway Incursion Avoidance

  • This was pretty straight forward, I kept the CFI PTS open and made sure to cover every area talking about Runway Incursion Avoidance. Be sure to cover every area of the PTS as he wants you to “teach” this as a lesson to a student. During this section of the oral, I pulled up a taxi diagram for midway airport after covering the areas in the PTS, I briefed Ed on a taxi route and then gave him a mock clearance. He did simple things like not hold short of the correct runways or turn on the wrong taxiway. After this lesson he asked me things like threshold markings, elevation, and hotspots on the taxiway diagram. Hot spot information can be found through foreflight using the hotspot button.

Collision Avoidance

  • After runway incursion avoidance, Ed had me teach him a lesson plan about collision avoidance. He went off on a tangent about how Tenerife was the worst accident in history. After this, I made sure to cover every area in the CFI PTS in regards to my “lesson plan”. Be sure to include scanning at sections at a time, how the FAA states the “see and avoid” regardless if you are VFR or IFR. We then talked about scanning at night and how we use our peripheral vision. He asked about night scanning, as well as different illusions we might see during the day and at night when scanning. We closed the discussion with right of way rules.

Note: For these lessons, he wants you to teach him as if he were a private student. If you cover every area in the PTS, he will not have many questions other than simple things which are included above. If you need to, he is totally ok with you referencing the FAR/AIM as well as other FAA publications (PHAK, AFH, ETC). For each lesson I had pre-made lesson plans open which he liked and had no problem with. After FOI, it's free game other than google.

Principles of Flight

  • Be sure to know your aerodynamics
  • Talked about the four forces of flight in straight and level as well as in climbs and descents
  • Asked about how a wing creates lift. This includes Newton's laws and Bernoulli's principle. Make sure to draw out each and he wont have many questions about lift.
  • We then went into talking about angle of attack, critical angle of attack, and the lift to drag ratio.
  • Talked about types of stability (static and dynamic). We talked about which one is most desirable for small GA aircraft.
  • Later on in the oral, we discussed the phases of a spin as well as how we recover from a spin (I am including this section in the principles of flight)
  • Load factor and how it changes with weight
  • Looked over my weight and balance and had no questions regarding that
  • Talked about the cirrus and how it is not approved for a spin
  • Had questions about if a piper or Cessna were approved for spins
  • Talked about categories of aircraft (normal, utility, and aerobatic). This included the load factors of each

Closed the discussion of aerodynamics with why stall speed increases with weight, why load factor plays a roll into aircraft maneuvering, A Vg diagram for the cirrus, as well as simple questions like “how much would our stall speed increase if we were at 60 degrees of bank.” For this, he likes to see you reference the diagram in the PHAK and make your calculations accordingly.


FAR 61

  • We started out the conversation talking about the definition of cross country. This included private, instrument, and commercial. Be sure to know where this is in the FAR/AIM and the exact verbiage for each.
  • What kind of pilot certificates and instructor certificates are issued under Part 61
  • When a student pilot log PIC time
  • Talked about complex and high performance endorsements and why a private pilot might have a hard time finding them in the FAR’s (because it's under additional aircraft ratings)
  • The type of aircraft categories that can be placed on an instructor certificate
  • Asked if instrument time could be for a PPL could be counted if it was in a simulator (no because in the FAR it states that training must be done in a AIRCRAFT)

After this questioning and discussion, we then went into endorsements in detail

(For the endorsement section, I had a “cheat sheet” printed out for all the endorsements needed for each rating. I also listed verbiage based on the AC 61-65 and how I would write them in a students logbook. Ed had few questions as I was sure to cover everything.

  • Talked about the required endorsements for a student going on their first solo.
  • Asked about pre solo quizzes
  • Pre solo training requirements
  • Cross country solo endorsements and requirements
  • Private pilot practical test endorsements
  • All other practical test endorsements (three things needed to be stated… 61.39)
  • Asked about CFI record keeping
  • Talked about duration of a CFI certificate and how to renew once its gone
  • Motor vehicle actions and what I would do if a student came to me saying he had just gotten a DUI
  • Asked me to list off the aeronautical experience requirements by memory and then double check my work with the FAR
  • We closed the discussion with how to get a student who has a private single-engine to add a private multi-engine

This section was brief, however, be sure to know endorsements in depth and know where to find things in the FAR/AIM. Ed has no problem with you looking through, however, it makes it easier if you know where to find it.





Maneuver Lesson

Ed assigned me slow flight for the maneuver lesson. He left the room to get coffee and gave me 10-15 minutes to prepare for the lesson. He had me teach him as if he were a commercial student. He pretended to have a pretty good working knowledge of aerodynamics. Whatever lesson plan you are assigned. Be sure to give an overview and motivation/story to why it is important. Then cover what you are going to discuss. After that, dive into the lesson and teach it. Close with an overview of the key points and things to take away. Below is how I presented my information in detail.

Slow Flight

  • Overview

  • What slow flight is and the definition

  • Why slow flight is important

Then went into the content. This included defining slow flight, the relationship of power and flight characteristics (pitch for airspeed, power for altitude, power curve, as well as drag and types of drag in depth), maneuvering during slow flight, relationship of CG to flight characteristics and controllability, and sense and “feel” during slow flight

Then I went into how to fly the maneuver in depth including the pre maneuver flow, clearing turns, and common errors associated with slow flight per the Cirrus SR-20.

I concluded the lesson plan with a brief review of the main points, the commercial pilot ACS Skills Standards, and asked Ed if he had any questions. He had no comments and we moved on.

Random Questioning

  • Ed asked about the Cirrus interconnect system, and how it helps/hinders stall recoveries.
  • We talked about failures on the ground and in flight
  • Glide speed and ratio, take off performance, and why checklist are important
  • Ed went on another target about how he had an engine failure at 9000 feet in a Cessna and glided down to land.
  • Talked about the five stages of landing based on the PHAK
  • Difference between the PTS and the ACS
  • Talked about demonstration stalls and the situations a student could get into into each
  • Taught him about wake turbulence procedures, avoidance, and how wingtip vortices are formed
Ed had a lot of random questions at this point in the oral. Be prepared to talk about anything as he will change gears quickly. He did not have any problem with me referencing my notes at the point in the oral.

Spins

  • Talked about the phases of a spin
  • How do we get into a spin
  • How do we get out of a spin (included recovery procedures)
  • Talked for about 15 minutes about he aerodynamics in a spin and why the aircraft is not gaining airspeed and “stabilized”
  • Talked about the differences between a spin and a spiral
  • Asked about the recovery procedures for both
  • Then went into unusual attitudes and recovery procedures
  • Concluded the conversation with talking about why the Cirrus is not approved for spins
  • Talked about a forward slip vs a side slip and when we use each

Weather

  • We talked about weather charts for the rest of the oral. This included METAR’s, TAF’s, ARIMET’s, SIGMENT’s, and CONVECTIVE SIGMENT’s.
  • Ed then showed me multiple charts from aviationweather.gov and had me describe them. This included valid time periods, whether they were forecast, current, and features each described.
  • Talked about other random weather aspects such as downdrafts and thunderstorms


This concluded the oral portion of the CFI check ride with Ed. Throughout the oral, Ed had various questions on each subject to test if you knew what you were talking about and if you could teach it to a student. Overall, I would highly recommend going with him as he is easy to talk to and has a lot of great stories. The Oral portion ended in a pass. Due to poor weather, I will complete the flight on another day.

That sounds brutal!
 
That sounds brutal!
Honestly, for a CFI ride it sounds pretty normal / chill. ^_^

as well as simple questions like “how much would our stall speed increase if we were at 60 degrees of bank.” For this, he likes to see you reference the diagram in the PHAK and make your calculations accordingly.

This is a bit of a pet peeve of mine. The answer is "There is no such thing as stall speed, and if there were, angle of bank would have nothing to do with it."

Stall speed is an approximation based on angle of attack. There is no direct relationship between angle of bank and angle of attack. I can assure you that I have been at 90° of bank before and absolutely not stalled in any sense of the word. Teaching stalling as a function of speed blurs together multiple variables that we have direct control over, which have direct relationships to stall speed, and puts the blame on a variable we only indirectly control, which itself has only an indirect relationship to stall speed.

Teaching people this way kills people, and IMO we owe our students better.

This is just me on a soapbox, @ckoele17, so don't mind me. Nice work on your CFI oral, and excellent writeup.

-Fox
 
Honestly, for a CFI ride it sounds pretty normal / chill. ^_^



This is a bit of a pet peeve of mine. The answer is "There is no such thing as stall speed, and if there were, angle of bank would have nothing to do with it."

Stall speed is an approximation based on angle of attack. There is no direct relationship between angle of bank and angle of attack. I can assure you that I have been at 90° of bank before and absolutely not stalled in any sense of the word. Teaching stalling as a function of speed blurs together multiple variables that we have direct control over, which have direct relationships to stall speed, and puts the blame on a variable we only indirectly control, which itself has only an indirect relationship to stall speed.

Teaching people this way kills people, and IMO we owe our students better.

This is just me on a soapbox, @ckoele17, so don't mind me. Nice work on your CFI oral, and excellent writeup.

-Fox

I love this post so much. I end up burning a decent chunk of ground time with all my students explaining that “stall speed” is an indirect indication of AOA.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
Back
Top