Previous employer Pria abuse
- Thread starter M5000
- Start date
milleR
Well-Known Member
So we've got @Pilot Fighter a well known and respected member of this site giving you honest and objective feedback and then we have ... this response. As a "New Member" how, exactly, do you think this reads to the community to which you've reached out to for advice? If this response is indicative of how you face adversity then I'd suggest your story has some facets to it we're not seeing. Every argument has three sides after all.
Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
I wasn't defending a carrier, I was trying to make sense of your narrative. Your last flight before being fired was a failed check ride and you were surprised by a PRIA report?
Is English your native tongue? You must have missed my concern that carriers are losing black pilots because folks aren't supporting them by helping correct deficiencies before their careers are derailed. Not exactly a racist sentiment. Was somebody trying to help you ... before you turned a check ride into a pissing contest?
With regards to the host of this site, I trust that he can spot racism without your help.
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Beefy McGee
Well-Known Member
There are airline recruiters who visit this site who now know there is a former Martinaire pilot with a PRIA dispute and a possible pending lawsuit situation. They now know this pilot is really sensitive and has stronger than typical reactions to responses to online forum posts. The pilot may or may not have a valid concern about racism at a former employer but this pilot definitely jumps the gun on a forum where they asked for advice by overreacting and claiming race issues in that forum. The person then calls strangers names / insults them on the internet instead of reacting calmly to an online discussion.
Those are bad traits for a future employee who would be one of two people in the cockpit of an airliner with the responsibilities and stresses of the job. They are not traits I'd want in the other person on my flight deck. Someone with that much drama is likely to drag down an operation rather than improve it and is likely a waste of effort and resources to hire and train if down the road the drama leads to disruption and disturbance in the employee group.
Even with no name in the posts here, it's not too hard to put the info together when you see the resume, PRIA docs and such at the interview and figure out it's the person who must have been ranting on this website.
Those are bad traits for a future employee who would be one of two people in the cockpit of an airliner with the responsibilities and stresses of the job. They are not traits I'd want in the other person on my flight deck. Someone with that much drama is likely to drag down an operation rather than improve it and is likely a waste of effort and resources to hire and train if down the road the drama leads to disruption and disturbance in the employee group.
Even with no name in the posts here, it's not too hard to put the info together when you see the resume, PRIA docs and such at the interview and figure out it's the person who must have been ranting on this website.
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Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
This is my last post in this thread.
While some might see my comment about my daughter as a variation of the I have black friends cliche, I was trying to communicate something poignant and deeply personal, and failed.
If you are an old white guy and have a fourteen year old black daughter, her struggles and pain become your struggles and pain. I want her to live her best life so I have a bit of emotional equity in what's happening around us. So, I do assert a right to address racial issues but don't claim equal footing with others closer to the struggle.
There is no shortage of racism in our world. It is a poison. That said, the fight against racism isn't served by ambiguous claims of racism. In your case, it sounds like you gave up and didn't take advantage of an opportunity to resume your check ride. Your wounds appear to be self-inflicted, you didn't even give racism a good fight.
I sincerely wish you the best in your career.
statusseeker1
Well-Known Member
M5000- from your posts on this thread it’s evident you’ll need a serious attitude change to make it anywhere in this business. You may have gotten dealt a bad hand with your check ride, but you come off as arrogant and brash. Best of luck going forward.
USMCmech
Well-Known Member
Former Martinaire pilot here,
First off I believe that this is something the current management at MRA would pull. It has changed drastically since I was a pilot there.
OTOH the way you have presented yourself in this thread will definitely scare off any recruiters at the better regionals. If you are going to challenge a PRIA report, you need to have all facts ready and much more humble attitude. The fact that you and the CP had a dispute that lead to you quitting before busting a checkride/getting fired doesn’t reflect well on you.
First off I believe that this is something the current management at MRA would pull. It has changed drastically since I was a pilot there.
OTOH the way you have presented yourself in this thread will definitely scare off any recruiters at the better regionals. If you are going to challenge a PRIA report, you need to have all facts ready and much more humble attitude. The fact that you and the CP had a dispute that lead to you quitting before busting a checkride/getting fired doesn’t reflect well on you.
TUCKnTRUCK
That guy
I’m pretty sure that the POH/AFM and manual will just say land as soon as possible / or / forced landing checklist.
Engine fires in a turbine aircraft are generally not actually a fire if there isn’t a mechanical failure to accompany it. Usually fire on the outside is caused by something breaking on the inside. Most fire indications are bleed leaks or a bad fire loop. That being said If I was a check airman and gave one of the above scenarios (not actually a fire but fire indication) and the pilot takes a small issue like a bleed leak and turns it into a big problem by flying an abnormal approach, landing with a tailwind that exceeded limitations rather than taking it to the safer runway, then yes it’s a bust. Deviation authority is fine, but, if you use that authority to make a situation worse, then yeah- it calls for retraining.
If I gave the above scenario to a pilot and he/she flys off the handle and takes the “I’m right because I’ve taught this to other pilots “ defiant attitude, then, I’m stopping the check ride, because that’s getting beyond what trained to proficiency is for. Is a steep spiral better than a pattern? Completely situational honestly. If I’m engine out with enough altitude to fly a normal pattern, that’s probably safer than a steep spiral which I hardly do. If I don’t have enough altitude for a pattern and need to loose altitude to land where I am, then yes spiral - but I’m not going to automatically spiral over the closest runway.
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dustoff17
Still trying to reach the Top Shelf
@M5000,
This forum isn’t like others you may be a part of. We are respectful of others knowledge and lack of knowledge and we don’t “take shots“ just because we can. No need to pounce just because you don’t like a response. We, as humans, always hate to hear the truth, regardless of what we WANT it to be.
If the Carrier in question is the same as posted earlier, the people in this Forum know more about the carrier than we know about YOU! ALL we know about you and this situation is what you have presented. @Pilot Fighter stated pretty much what I did and that is; from your description of this situation, YOU performed the emergency incorrectly according to the Company training procedures. Then you defended it to the point that you lost your job! That‘s what I understood from YOUR post.
You MAY have a point or a case with regards to “firing of minority pilot” as you stated. However, based on what YOU have posted here, I would find NO fault in the Company firing you for the way you handled this situation. If you were a new pilot or even a new Captain, maybe some extended grace would be apropos. But you’re not, you’re a multi-year Training Captain! This means that YOU have to fly the procedures the way the Company wants you to, AND you have to do it with a great attitude.
You don’t have the privilege, regardless of your skin color to fight with the Chief Pilots! You should know by now that your actions were and are not consistent with professionalism. AND, if you actually think that the Company has been firing minority pilots, then your combative actions with regards to this check ride is paramount to poking the caged tiger! Furthermore, if YOU were training other pilot in conflict with the Company’s procedures, as YOU posted, then, this alone, is grounds for termination (no “minority” issue here).
If you handled your soft bust, like you handled this discussion, it’s no wonder you were let go. This having been stated, if the Company has been engaging in inappropriate firing and hiring, then It is my hope for you and the other pilots to receive a favorable ruling.
Take a deep breath, talk to the other pilots and your attorney and get this thing behind you. Get yourself into the “I need to move forward” mode and out of the “I’m a victim” mode.
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Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
Definitely a “both sides are wrong” vibe being given here
Boots2Wings
Just happy to be here.
Wow that escalated rather quickly.
Keeping with the OP theme, I am surprised a “bad pria” could even really harm chances most places, especially at a regional carrier. If its just a single check-ride fail, which is what it may sound like, I thought those were not a significant deal (in most circumstances), especially with an otherwise clean record and pass rate.
Keeping with the OP theme, I am surprised a “bad pria” could even really harm chances most places, especially at a regional carrier. If its just a single check-ride fail, which is what it may sound like, I thought those were not a significant deal (in most circumstances), especially with an otherwise clean record and pass rate.
Boris Badenov
This is no laughing matter.
Life is full of second chances for people who have a minor stain on their record, ask me how I know.
I think it might be a wee bit less forgiving of people who charge in to a group of strangers asking for advice and then start throwing elbows when they get advice they didn't want to hear. I wouldn't touch this dude with YOUR ten foot pole, guy has "recurring headache" tattooed on his forehead.
CoffeeIcePapers
Well-Hung Member
Definitely an issue if you say you haven't failed a checkride and then they find out you have.
Boots2Wings
Just happy to be here.
Is simply a check-ride failure that kind of “stain” though? Id imagine beyond something that along lines of a Pria, it wouldn’t really be manipulatable.
I suppose the attempt to hide, or explain away something like that on an interview would absolutely tank chances…but acknowledged existence much less so.
I have certainly read the threads of “oh no I failed xxx”, and certainly do not intend to revive them here, and the general concensus always seems to be (paraphrasing here)
1) dont hide it
2) learn from it
3) dont make it a habit
4) dont worry about…if you follow 1-3 it wont hurt your career.
Is that no longer the case?
TUCKnTRUCK
That guy
While I’m a lowly 91 DO, if I have a candidate say no and pria comes back with a busted check ride - that’s full stop unless it was in error.
I don’t care if people have made mistakes in their past, but absolutely will not tolerate dishonesty like that.
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dustoff17
Still trying to reach the Top Shelf
It's quite possible that integrity may have been an underlining factor in this from the beginning.....
caliginousface
Frank N. Beans
Whoa, there, big fella! You don't wanna start making ME look good...
The best takes.
Also, Chris Ford?
GypsyPilot
Mohawk Town
I haven’t heard that name in a long time! The Chris Ford from AirDisasters.com?
Autothrust Blue
"Well, on the Brasilia..."
Does anyone actually care what kind of maneuvers are used as long as it's a minimum (safe) time to ground situation and is reasonable, prudent, etc.?
If the PRIA doesn't match the applicant's statements, there's some heavy duty 'splaining to do (which is likely to happen as that person's ID badge is run through the shredder, their iPad and other Company property is collected and they're shown the door unless there's a REALLY good story attached).
