It's obvious that many folks already have their minds made up about ATP and flight training in general.
Good, bad, indifferent.
ElephantPilot came on here looking for suggestions and questions to ask regarding attending ATP. It obvious that he has done some research on what he thinks will work for himself and his personal situation.
Many people think that by bashing a persons decisions is a way to help them... I think differently. I believe that it's important for the future of our profession that we be supportive of others who have the desire to get into this profession.
To me it sounds like you are full of excuses. If you really want to get your training done you will get it done. You should want to start today. There is no reason not to. I worked a full time job, was a full time students, and had a campus job. Oh and my job included running a youth center on the east side of Indianapolis, while being an Resident Assistant at school, studying, having a girlfriend, and still finding time to have fun on the side. Oh and my training through an FBO cost me about 30k. I've instructed with ATP. I cannot honestly say that any of your arguements about ATP are even valid. You plan on paying back your loans quicker then 10-15 years? Ok so you realize for the 1st 5 years or so you will be barely making 30k as an FO? Honestly upgrades of 2 years are gone. You wont see them anywhere. Plus ontop of that, no one is hiring and let alone when they do start hiring if you have the minimums (ME) that's really all that matters. In the end landing a job is truely upon your personality and if you are liked or not. Something you either have, or you dont. Nothing in which ATP can offer. You really would benefit from doing a SEARCH on here and also taking time to learn from those who are telling you to look else where. Especially since you stated you are in college and are 20 years old! You are entirely too young to go 60k into debt. You really need to take time and listen to people on here, instead of thinking you know it all. We were all there once, and many of us were able to find ways to do things cheaper based on fellow members kind words of wisdom.
Paul,
I know we've spoken before, and I know your a fairly good guy. But you have to understand that not everyone is you... and not everyone will accomplish the same things as you in the same way. Not everyone's circumstances, beliefs, learning habits, financial situation, and goals are the same as yours.
You've obviously had some issues with ATP and you've communicated your feelings about that many times in multiple forums here on JC. After a while though, due to the repition, your story's meaning get's lost and folks may start to think that you are just a jaded pilot with a bone to pick.
Just as an example... Many of your observations and "absolutes" about ATP and even FBO's are false... from my perspective, and I'd happily argue them with you. But remember that I'm stating "from my perspective", and that's key to this whole thing. The fact is... there's not a lot of absolutes in this industry and simply telling people "the way it is" doesn't always work, usually because you are telling folks the "way it is" from your personal perspective, based on your own experiences and background, and that is not necessarily the way it will be for others.
The best advice we as professional pilots can give folks is to simply have them do their homework, and get the facts from each institution they wish to pursue and compare those facts so that they can make a determination as to what course of action will work best for them and their personal situation.
Mentoring is not always "do it my way, it worked for me" or "don't do it the way I did... it didn't work for me", rather, it's about helping the individual learn what will work best for them... and encouraging them to pursue that course action, because you know they will thrive better in that environment. For those parents out there... you can completely understand this point.
Even Don (DE727) understood this when he and I used to have our in-depth discussions about life, liberty and the pursuit of the aviation dream...
Anyway... just an observation.
Stay safe...
Bob