Spirit Airlines pricing on Abc15

[Maurus]

I see where you are going with this MikeD, but I believe the increased accessibility to flying is what drives people to believe we are glorified Bus Drivers more than pricing models. When fares took a nose dive more people had access to flying and the whole "miracle of flight" sensation has died off. Public opinion took a dive well before this entire "fee" system even came into existence.

 

[trafficinsight]

I wouldn't exactly call SWA base level service anymore. They're the only airline that gives me food these days.

 

[MikeD]

I see where you are going with this MikeD, but I believe the increased accessibility to flying is what drives people to believe we are glorified Bus Drivers more than pricing models. When fares took a nose dive more people had access to flying and the whole "miracle of flight" sensation has died off. Public opinion took a dive well before this entire "fee" system even came into existence.

I wouldn't exactly call SWA base level service anymore. They're the only airline that gives me food these days.

Both fair points here.

 

[Gonzo]

I don't think there's anything necessarily wrong with the legacy model in terms of a basic standard of service. In my own opinion, SWA is about as basic as it should get: no frills, but also not nickel and dimey cheap-impression by charging for every little tiny thing. They only offer a very basic cabin service, but they don't charge for bags, carryon or checked, and one doesn't have to "do their homework" in buying a ticket, necessarily, as buying an airline ticket should have a relative convenience to it, not be made into a financial research project. Advertising a $9 fare that has a crapload of fineprint fees attached to it, isn't really what I'd call customer-friendly, speaking as a pax. Just tell me what the real cost is. Im an adult, I can accept that without needing a fishing lure to reel me in.

I think there is a lot wrong with the level of service on the legacy airlines.

 

[MikeD]

I think there is a lot wrong with the level of service on the legacy airlines.

I agree....no doubt there needs to be work done there. What they should be, and what they are (compared to what they were), are two very different things. My argument is geared towards what their model has traditionally been, prior to the affects of economics, industry events, etc. Some legacies still work near what they used to, others don't. But what we've come to now with ULCCs and the race to the bottom of the concept of service, is a tangent away from the basic model, and one Im not convinced is a great direction to go.

 

[HRDiva]

Again, please explain the glorified sevice I receive when flying on a $1000 ticket PhL to LAS on a legacy and have to pay $25 to check my bag. Oh, and most of the kiosks are broken or out of paper.

Amber, people avoid the bag fee by following the rules and bringing a bag that fits under the seat. If not, they can purchase an overhead or checked bag at a discount with booking. Spirit instituted the overhead fee because people were bringing on so much stuff that it significantly delayed flights. That doen't happen anymore even though the flights are full. So,while it is not for you Amber, it is appealing to many others; enough so for the airline to continue to grow and to be one of the few hiring now.

 

[MikeD]

Again, please explain the glorified sevice I receive when flying on a $1000 ticket PhL to LAS on a legacy and have to pay $25 to check my bag. Oh, and most of the kiosks are broken or out of paper.

Amber, people avoid the bag fee by following the rules and bringing a bag that fits under the seat. If not, they can purchase an overhead or checked bag at a discount with booking. Spirit instituted the overhead fee because people were bringing on so much stuff that it significantly delayed flights. That doen't happen anymore even though the flights are full. So,while it is not for you Amber, it is appealing to many others; enough so for the airline to continue to grow and to be one of the few hiring now.

Again, I understand your bias here in your opinion on this subject. I get that. You aren't going to shoot yourself in your own foot.

I agree that $1000 and a $25 bag fee on top of that for that route is robbery. But on a similar LCC, lets say SWA, you wouldn't have the $1000 ticket nor the bag fee, nor would have to search around for all the fees everywhere. Nor would you have things like and overhead baggage compartment fee. And $5 to have a gate agent print out your ticket? That's just nickel and dimey cheap.

Instead of instituting an overhead baggage fee, why not just force people to check oversized bags that won't fit? That seems to work everywhere else. Or charge what the actual flight cost is going to be, rather than the extremely low fee that has a great number of fineprint attached to it?

Plus, I would expect Spirit to be hiring. If running on the cheap as much as they are and with fees attached to nearly everything, they ought to be making money!

 

[MQAAord]

Again, please explain the glorified sevice I receive when flying on a $1000 ticket PhL to LAS on a legacy and have to pay $25 to check my bag. Oh, and most of the kiosks are broken or out of paper.

Amber, people avoid the bag fee by following the rules and bringing a bag that fits under the seat. If not, they can purchase an overhead or checked bag at a discount with booking. Spirit instituted the overhead fee because people were bringing on so much stuff that it significantly delayed flights. That doen't happen anymore even though the flights are full. So,while it is not for you Amber, it is appealing to many others; enough so for the airline to continue to grow and to be one of the few hiring now.

What's to stop people from putting their bags that fit under the seat into the overheads? Serious question, I'm not trying to be snarky. For example, Bob brings on a briefcase, it fits under the seat (as briefcases do) but he puts it in the OHB above his seat. He didn't pay for that space, is OHB usage monitored or verified onboard? Wouldn't people who paid for OHB space get pissy to see Bob putting a briefcase up there?

Spirit does not serve IND, so I haven't had the opportunity to observe any part of their operations since I flew on them from ORD to RSW in Jan of 2002 (that in and of itself was not a overwhelmingly positive experience, but it was 10 years ago so I'm not holding that against them). It's really a moot point for me, as they don't serve the city I live in now. That is part of their "niche" market plan too, they don't serve cities like IND. So, not only do I not care for the nickel-diming approach to their fee structure, they don't even offer service to any city within a 3.5 hour drive Like I said earlier, it's nothing personal against anyone who works there or who doesn't mind their fee structure. It's just not something I'll be participating in.

 

[HRDiva]

Ah, now I understand that you have no current expeience Amber. People bring on their approved sized bags and can easily toss them into the empty overheads.

My bias comes as a frequent business traveler on other airlines who is constanty annoyed. So, my last minute $1000 trip from PHL to CLT costs me to check my bag. Why not put it on the overhead? Because the legacy priority strict boarding and those of us who boked late (and paid the most) have the last boarding priority. In other words, my $1000 gets me nothing. Talk about a rip off for 1 hour flight on a legacy. I experience this all the time on my business flights. So, Mike, it has nothing to do with a bias toward Spirit just because DH flies for them. The legacies stink and have no right to pretend otherwise. I fly a lot on SWA and it is no bargain; bags do not fly free. The fares are now much higher.

 

[MikeD]

My bias comes as a frequent business traveler on other airlines who is constanty annoyed. So, my last minute $1000 trip from PHL to CLT costs me to check my bag. Why not put it on the overhead? Because the legacy priority strict boarding and those of us who boked late (and paid the most) have the last boarding priority. In other words, my $1000 gets me nothing. Talk about a rip off for 1 hour flight on a legacy.

Could this be fallout from the late booking (sure, I get that sometime that happens and it yes it sucks to pay out the yin-yang for it)? Or is it normal business at the legacies?

I experience this all the time on my business flights. So, Mike, it has nothing to do with a bias toward Spirit just because DH flies for them. The legacies stink and have no right to pretend otherwise. I fly a lot on SWA and it is no bargain; bags do not fly free. The fares are now much higher.

I thought normal weight bags fly for free on SWA? Im sure overweight or X numbers of bags over a certain amount get charged, but don't the first or second average checked bags still fly free?

I agree the legacies have their own problems, but they need to fix those and get back up to at least close to what standard there once was. That's just my opinion. Like I said, Spirit's business model is working if they're making money and have pax flying them. I just don't know if the quality of the "airline product" as a whole, overall, is necessarily the direction to go; as where does bottom come? I guess only time will tell.

 

[HRDiva]

Bags don't fly free at SWA because the fares are now really high.

If legacies want to charge $1000 for a ticket, they should figure out a way to comp other charges. They don't. They just rip off those of us who have to travel for work.

 

[Maurus]

Plus, I would expect Spirit to be hiring. If running on the cheap as much as they are and with fees attached to nearly everything, they ought to be making money!

Was this sarcasm?

They are actively taking deliveries of new aircraft and hiring pilots. Best part is that it is all growth.

 

[MikeD]

Bags don't fly free at SWA because the fares are now really high.

If legacies want to charge $1000 for a ticket, they should figure out a way to comp other charges. They don't. They just rip off those of us who have to travel for work.

A few hundred dollars is average for most flights for SWA, for their normal fares. So there's no extra bag fee in there......you know what you're paying up front. No navigating fees, etc.

And $1000 for a ticket, most airlines if one purchases last minute, the ticket price is going to be high. Granted, $1000 is pretty high for a coach fare......likely average for first class or something; but yes, I agree their charging for bags on top of that is dumb. Ive never liked bag fees from day one. Unfortunately, for those that have them, they're here to stay it seems.

 

[trafficinsight]

If you have to book last minute Southwest is generally the same price as if you booked well in advance, with a couple exceptions. The first two bags that are less than 50lb are included in the price. I like that because the overheads aren't full when the airplane is only half boarded. My favorite lately is the guy that puts his bag in the overhead allllll the way at the front of the plane when his seat is in the back so that when we stop he can book it for the front

On the trips I've priced Southwest is still usually the cheapest option... or maybe more expensive by a negligible amount considering that flying on Southwest is low drama, the employees are generally happy and willing to help, and I get a little bag of peanuts, or sometimes peanuts and crackers, pretzels or cookies, and a drink or sometimes two... and don't forget the rewards points!

No, I don't own Southwest stock.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

If you have to book last minute Southwest is generally the same price as if you booked well in advance, with a couple exceptions. The first two bags that are less than 50lb are included in the price. I like that because the overheads aren't full when the airplane is only half boarded. My favorite lately is the guy that puts his bag in the overhead allllll the way at the front of the plane when his seat is in the back so that when we stop he can book it for the front

On the trips I've priced Southwest is still usually the cheapest option... or maybe more expensive by a negligible amount considering that flying on Southwest is low drama, the employees are generally happy and willing to help, and I get a little bag of peanuts, or sometimes peanuts and crackers, pretzels or cookies, and a drink or sometimes two... and don't forget the rewards points!

No, I don't own Southwest stock.

You may be onto something (and I don't own LUV stock, either). The rest of the industry should steal copy the best parts of that operation, but for some reason they don't. There are lots of little things that they do that are awesome, and really streamline the operation.

I actually wish there was a way to efficiently do the valet model that we do on a larger scale (ever hang out in the jetway when they're taking the valet bags off the CRJ-900? It sucks). I personally like not having to drag my rollaboard around on board.

I did price out RNO-LAX a few months ago when my grandma was in the hospital and it turned out that Southwest wasn't the lowest fare available that particular day (going for a jungle jet ride was cheaper for the family member involved—no industry discounts or anything). Crandall said the other day that folks are well-conditioned to them being cheapest and for what it's worth flying on them is awful pleasant, too.

Bags don't fly free at SWA because the fares are now really high.

Wait, seriously? You do know that the cost per average seat mile and the average airline ticket are at their lowest since the inception of the industry when adjusted for inflation, right?

(Comments about labor cost, withheld)

It seems to me that you (and the remainder of the public) are going to complain no matter what the industry does. Include the cost of schlepping your 40lbs of luggage in the belly instead of in the cabin in the ticket? "Bah their ticket prices are too high!" Charge you for checking? "Bah these fees are ridiculous."

There is no such thing as a free lunch when it comes to anything burning jet fuel. You can purchase now, or purchase later, but someone has to pay sometime.

 

[MQAAord]

SWA's marketing department has done a splendiferous job of convincing people that they're ALWAYS the lowest fare... having their fares available ONLY on their own websites (no Orbitz, Travelocity, Expedia, etc) ensures people aren't seeing their fares right next to other airline's fares. Sometimes it is cheapest to fly SWA, sometimes it's not. Be a smart consumer and compare...

 

[Autothrust Blue]

SWA's marketing department has done a splendiferous job of convincing people that they're ALWAYS the lowest fare... having their fares available ONLY on their own websites (no Orbitz, Travelocity, Expedia, etc) ensures people aren't seeing their fares right next to other airline's fares. Sometimes it is cheapest to fly SWA, sometimes it's not. Be a smart consumer and compare...

In many ways, we (the industry) did this to ourselves. Letting the Orbitz, Travelocities and Expedias of the world in certainly have not helped the industry make money. Price transparency is awesome for the consumer and horrible, horrible for the business.

 

[MQAAord]

Oh I agree. It made me sad, actually, to see the degradation of service that I saw, even just in my few years. We used to have blankets, pillows.. when I did transcons on 767s we had playing cards and magazines to pass out. On full transcons we'd staff 10 F/As on a 767-300 because of the meal service! I bet it's been years since a transcon has gone out with 10 F/As...

 

[trafficinsight]

I do remember that on any United flight over 3 hours (I think that was the number) you got a box lunch... but the last time that happened to me was on a B727

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I do remember that on any United flight over 3 hours (I think that was the number) you got a box lunch... but the last time that happened to me was on a B727

I've been served a cold meal (in coach) between DAB and ATL before, but that was also a long time ago. They since took the galleys out of that airplane (M88) at that position and installed another few rows.

To me, when you say "service" I automatically think "meal," but that's because I remember the 1990s.