Legal ramifications of majors not hiring "connection" carrier pilots

[Autothrust Blue]

Thanks my friend. Love that movie and Freeman is a favorite. Could not resist. Warden Hadley was a vile man no?

He was indeed. The film adaptation was really rather good, even if it wasn't always true to the book (Norton is warden the whole time at Shawshank, while in the book, Hadley etc. move on through in succession).

While I can't really say that this is anything like prison (I've never been and I'm not fixin' to find out), almost everyone I flew with on the Brasilia who wants to move on, has moved on, and yes, the place where I live is that much more drab and empty as a result.

 

[Aero Crew Solutions]

@Derg, let me know when you are in town for recurrent and the beers are on me.

The whole point of interview prep is to teach you how to answer questions correctly using YOUR OWN WORDS. We never our tell our clients what to say. The airlines know you can fly an airplane. They want to see who you are as a professional pilot and a person. That's why they ask questions about yourself. Who you are in your personal life will mirror who you are in your professional life. If you are a jerk outside of work I can guarantee you are that same jerk at work.

Derg asked the candidate about sailing because he finally got to know who he was as a person. You feel relaxed discussing a topic you know about. You need to feel relaxed talking about yourself. Most pilots have not really figured out what they are all about. One of the things we tell our clients to do is to create an interview logbook. Take all the thoughts, ideas and stories out of your head and put them on paper. It will be easier for you to recall the information if it is written down on paper.

The biggest complaint from all airline recruiters is pilots are not coming to the interview prepared. Take time now to start studying so you are not scrambling around when they call you for the interview.

 

[wheelsup]

I know a dozen guys hired at the legacies without doing any sort of paid interview prep. Just sayin' folks. Now that United has dropped the sim from their interview process I would skip it as well.

Prep for the interview process? Absolutely. Pay for it, in the form of hundreds of dollars spent? Personally I wouldn't, and didn't, but if you like to be spoonfed stuff I can see it might be a good way to go.

 

[Maximilian_Jenius]

I know a dozen guys hired at the legacies without doing any sort of paid interview prep. Just sayin' folks. Now that United has dropped the sim from their interview process I would skip it as well.

Prep for the interview process? Absolutely. Pay for it, in the form of hundreds of dollars spent? Personally I wouldn't, and didn't, but if you like to be spoonfed stuff I can see it might be a good way to go.

Didn't you also state that you felt that, that was your worse interview ever because you didn't prepare and were kinda just meh. If I remember right you thought you totally bombed it. And were totally shocked when you got the call?

 

[Deleted member 27505]

@Derg, let me know when you are in town for recurrent and the beers are on me.

Derg asked the candidate about sailing because he finally got to know who he was as a person. You feel relaxed discussing a topic you know about. You need to feel relaxed talking about yourself. Most pilots have not really figured out what they are all about. One of the things we tell our clients to do is to create an interview logbook. Take all the thoughts, ideas and stories out of your head and put them on paper. It will be easier for you to recall the information if it is written down on paper.

The biggest complaint from all airline recruiters is pilots are not coming to the interview prepared. Take time now to start studying so you are not scrambling around when they call you for the interview.

What do you mean by "prepared"? If that is counsel to obtain and possess some modicum of information about the target company, and why one wishes to work at that particular company, vs. say, the myriad other companies with airplanes, I get it and concur. Just seems sort of unlikely that someone applying to a major wouldn't already know that.
Or is it demeanor/image/approach that needs a bit of shining up or aligning with the target company?
Other than that, what is there to prepare for that would not be regularly practiced by an active pilot? Regs? Airspace? Equipment/Systems? Wx? Procedures? Aerodynamics? Customer service? Seems improbable that somebody currently flying for a living could not have those down pat and still be effective/safe/legal.

 

[derg]

Most of those things are there, if at all, in order to get to know you as a candidate.

These are the bigs, we assume you can already fly an airplane safely, but a lot of us want to know if you're going to be someone you want to fly with on a potentially stressful 5-day trip.

 

[wheelsup]

Didn't you also state that you felt that, that was your worse interview ever because you didn't prepare and were kinda just meh. If I remember right you thought you totally bombed it. And were totally shocked when you got the call?

I felt that way, yeah. Apparently, it wasn't that bad.

And I did prepare. More than for any interview I have ever gone on. I posted on here somewhere a picture of my interview prep recently. You can see all the flashcards I printed out and had stories/answers for, the write in answers I made, etc. Every night I walked my dog I brought the flashcards with me. On all my trips I asked FO's their thoughts on my answers. On overnights I made video of myself using my computer camera, answering the questions. I called buddies who had already interviewed and were hired. I used the STAR method exclusively, which is something prep places will tell you, but it's freely available on the internet. I spent a lot of time on it.

And that's just it. You can do this yourself, but it does take time and dedication, at least for most.

That, and me declining the first interview all because I couldn't get the time off in time and not wanting to call in sick helped, when I went to a CP office and told them the story I had another call within 12 hours. I'd like to think that was partially responsible for me getting the nod as well.

 

[Dan208B]

What do you mean by "prepared"? If that is counsel to obtain and possess some modicum of information about the target company, and why one wishes to work at that particular company, vs. say, the myriad other companies with airplanes, I get it and concur. Just seems sort of unlikely that someone applying to a major wouldn't already know that.
Or is it demeanor/image/approach that needs a bit of shining up or aligning with the target company?
Other than that, what is there to prepare for that would not be regularly practiced by an active pilot? Regs? Airspace? Equipment/Systems? Wx? Procedures? Aerodynamics? Customer service? Seems improbable that somebody currently flying for a living could not have those down pat and still be effective/safe/legal.

It depends on the airline. Know your audience. Technical stuff? Southernjets has an in-depth technical assessment that covers things a lot of line pilots wouldn't necessarily be studied up on, such as advanced aerodynamics and detailed weather theory. Not that I'm saying you shouldn't know that, just that most people don't. And HR/situational questions? I used to conduct interviews and often when you asked a question it was fairly obvious the candidate was just hearing this question for the first time. That's unacceptable to me and says they didn't prepare. Every interview question major airlines are asking is a derivative of another base question. If you work hard on stories and answers you will have enough in your "bank" to cover any question they might ask in any different format. And the gist of all these questions is to see how you would deal with a situation and to get to know you better. A good technique for coming up with answers is to look at the question and think about why they might be asking that particular question. A question like "tell me about a time you did something stupid in an airplane" is probably looking deeper than you might think. An interviewer can learn about some of your flying experience as well as how you deal with bad situations, how you learn, and how you apply that to your life and career today. I hope this helps you understand what they're looking for and what an interviewer might mean by seeing candidates "unprepared."

On another note I'm a big fan of interview prep. If you think you can do it all on your own and you make it, that's great. But if you don't you might regret not having done everything you could to get the job. Often a 3rd party can get you to think about something you may not have otherwise and some of the better interview prep services have some pretty good insight on a particular airline as well. This could be worth way more than the small fee you pay.

 

[ComplexHiAv8r]

. Often a 3rd party can get you to think about something you may not have otherwise and some of the better interview prep services have some pretty good insight on a particular airline as well. This could be worth way more than the small fee you pay.

How much are these prep services?

 

[Hacker15e]

College is an opportunity to, in no particular order:
(1) do some cool things you never thought you'd do (research)
(2) possibly discover passions you didn't know you had
(3) meet some pretty awesome people and learn how to collaborate with them - this is a tremendous team effort we're in, here
(4) become a better citizen.

Waaaaait a minute. I thought college was an opportunity to:

- Chase skirts
- Drink beer.

 

[Dan208B]

How much are these prep services?

Depends on the service. Most airlines aren't doing sims anymore so no prep required there. I would say usually $250-550 depending on the company. But if you're getting hired at a major airline with a multi-million dollar career in store, it's a drop in the bucket.

 

[ASpilot2be]

Waaaaait a minute. I thought college was an opportunity to:

- Chase skirts
- Drink beer.

Damn. I failed that part miserably.

 

[alaskadrifter]

Damn. I failed that part miserably.

Me too, but I was married for most of it, so I still got plenty .

 

[Kingairer]

@Derg, let me know when you are in town for recurrent and the beers are on me.

The whole point of interview prep is to teach you how to answer questions correctly using YOUR OWN WORDS. We never our tell our clients what to say. The airlines know you can fly an airplane. They want to see who you are as a professional pilot and a person. That's why they ask questions about yourself. Who you are in your personal life will mirror who you are in your professional life. If you are a jerk outside of work I can guarantee you are that same jerk at work.

Derg asked the candidate about sailing because he finally got to know who he was as a person. You feel relaxed discussing a topic you know about. You need to feel relaxed talking about yourself. Most pilots have not really figured out what they are all about. One of the things we tell our clients to do is to create an interview logbook. Take all the thoughts, ideas and stories out of your head and put them on paper. It will be easier for you to recall the information if it is written down on paper.

The biggest complaint from all airline recruiters is pilots are not coming to the interview prepared. Take time now to start studying so you are not scrambling around when they call you for the interview.

Ok so that's...

• Mini Tasty-Fill Cake Pan Set
• Cake:
• 1 package (16 oz.) frozen strawberries in syrup, thawed
• Water
• 1 package (18.25 oz.) white cake mix (no pudding in mix)
• 3 egg whites
• 2 tablespoons vegetable oil
• Filling:
• 1 package (16 oz.) frozen strawberries in syrup, thawed
• Water
• 1/3 cup granulated sugar
• 1 teaspoon lemon juice
• 3 tablespoons cornstarch
• 1-1/2 tablespoons cold water
• Icing:
• 3 cups prepared buttercream icing
• 3/4 cup seedless strawberry jam
• AND A BIG DELTA Widget on top

;-)

 

[Autothrust Blue]

Waaaaait a minute. I thought college was an opportunity to:

- Chase skirts
- Drink beer.

I knew I did something wrong.

 

[🦈💜]

In my opinion, if you have to (or can) prepare for an interview, then that interview is likely a poor assesment.

-Fox

 

[ASpilot2be]

In my opinion, if you have to (or can) prepare for an interview, then that interview is likely a poor assesment.

-Fox

I agree and disagree. If someone is telling you what to say, then the person isn't getting a good idea of who you are.

Then there are people like me who become an idiot when put in front of a group of people in a high pressure situation like an interview. So in that case I would like help with presentation rather than what to say. But there are people out there that can walk right in and perform perfectly in an interview. I wish I was one of them.

 

[mastermags]

In my opinion, if you have to (or can) prepare for an interview, then that interview is likely a poor assesment.

-Fox

Eh, don't know about that. I will go out on a limb and say if the average pilot interviews at a major carrier without preparing, more often than not they would not get the job. One of the first questions you are likely to get asked is 'what did you do to prepare for this interview?' 'Um, nothing' isn't what they want to hear.

 

[ComplexHiAv8r]

Depends on the service. Most airlines aren't doing sims anymore so no prep required there. I would say usually $250-550 depending on the company. But if you're getting hired at a major airline with a multi-million dollar career in store, it's a drop in the bucket.

I had heard the $1200+ number but I knew that included a sim

 

[Kingairer]

I did not do formal prep. Maybe it was laziness, cheapness, or confidence, or maybe a combination of all three!. I did a lot of home study, gouge review, and a lot of organizing true stories in my mind in a logical manor. I believed in my story and my desire to work for the airline.

I would always caution applicants from taking advice from avg line guys like myself who have never been on the otherside of the interview table. Someone could be telling you to "stare them right in the eyes and let them know you want it! It worked for me!" And if you asked the interviewer they may say "wow the stare thing was really weird, but the pilot board broke the tie breaker". You just don't get a lot of feedback obviously other than "yes or no".