Victor Squawk

Well-Known Member
Don't make fun of me about this but I'm looking for a decent-enough simulation game that can help me learn to visualize and concretize things I'm currently learning.

Its not likely that I will be able to get in a plane soon, nor use a real simulator, so for now I just want something I can use in my downtime based on my current schedule (something that will feel more productive towards conquering my learning curve).

My current career path is pointed at become a dispatcher, and likely that, before getting certificated as a private pilot. I would like to actually fly to gain some familiarity but practically speaking this is outside the current scope of what I can grasp.

So I'm looking for a game I can download onto a console and get some simulated familiarity. I understand it cannot substitute for real experience. I just need it to help me concretize information I am absorbing.

That aside though, I want it to be as accurate and helpful as possible. I definitely want to avoid learning misinformation. In the same idea, but on a side note, if there's a game that can help me gain familiarity with the dispatching aspect of getting a plane from one place to another, I'd be curious to try that too.

I'm asking here since all of you are some kind of braniacs who, I think, can actually answer my question that I don't know where else to ask. Otherwise I'm going to play hit-n-miss and judge by sales ads and search-engine-optimized floof.

For more context I work bags on the ramp, am studying the basics of private pilot, and preparing to get a dispatcher cert. My time studying aviation spans a couple months. Things are set in motion on a clock and calendar but I still end up with downtime which makes me feel restless and impatient, hence my post.

Thanks in advance.
 
MSFS is a good sim that will teach you the fundamentals of flight/procedures. Coupled with VATSIM or PilotEdge (if you’re looking for something a bit more geared towards actual training and professional ATC). The latter does require a subscription but IMO is worth it.

As for the dispatcher side of things, Simbrief is a decent free dispatch solution that you can practice applying regs (1-2-3 rule, different OpsSpecs, etc). If you want to get a bit more advanced you can buy PFPX which is a very robust dispatching utility that is very similar to our real world flight planning software.
 
Paging @inigo88 who can tell you all about VATSIM.
I’ve been out of the VATSIM game for many years, but definitely recommend it in conjunction with MSFS 2020, the upcoming MSFS 2024, Prepar3D (formerly FSX) or Xplane.

I’d recommend OP invest in a desktop PC for this and invest in at least the $30 Logitech level joystick, it’s going to be night and day vs anything available on console.

The pros of VATSIM are that it’s free. The cons are that since it’s free, all the “controllers” are donating their time. I always felt bad having some real world commitment come up and having to leave a bunch of people hanging, but such is life with free things.

If you want to hone your IFR skills in as realistic an environment as possible the alternative to VATSIM is a subscription based service called PilotEdge. The controllers are paid and their availability is more regular and predictable. Last I checked I think they only offered Northern California. I’ve never used it but I had a friend who swore by it during his instrument training.
 
I’ve been out of the VATSIM game for many years, but definitely recommend it in conjunction with MSFS 2020, the upcoming MSFS 2024, Prepar3D (formerly FSX) or Xplane.

I’d recommend OP invest in a desktop PC for this and invest in at least the $30 Logitech level joystick, it’s going to be night and day vs anything available on console.

The pros of VATSIM are that it’s free. The cons are that since it’s free, all the “controllers” are donating their time. I always felt bad having some real world commitment come up and having to leave a bunch of people hanging, but such is life with free things.

If you want to hone your IFR skills in as realistic an environment as possible the alternative to VATSIM is a subscription based service called PilotEdge. The controllers are paid and their availability is more regular and predictable. Last I checked I think they only offered Northern California. I’ve never used it but I had a friend who swore by it during his instrument training.

I second PilotEdge. And nowadays they cover ZLA/ZOA/ZSE/ZLC/ZDV/ZAB
 
I’ve been out of the VATSIM game for many years, but definitely recommend it in conjunction with MSFS 2020, the upcoming MSFS 2024, Prepar3D (formerly FSX) or Xplane.

I’d recommend OP invest in a desktop PC for this and invest in at least the $30 Logitech level joystick, it’s going to be night and day vs anything available on console.

The pros of VATSIM are that it’s free. The cons are that since it’s free, all the “controllers” are donating their time. I always felt bad having some real world commitment come up and having to leave a bunch of people hanging, but such is life with free things.

If you want to hone your IFR skills in as realistic an environment as possible the alternative to VATSIM is a subscription based service called PilotEdge. The controllers are paid and their availability is more regular and predictable. Last I checked I think they only offered Northern California. I’ve never used it but I had a friend who swore by it during his instrument training.
Even PilotEdge knows how to do CPDLC…anyway.
 
MSFS + VATSIM + live traffic is very immersive. The stock atc is ass compared to FSX/P3D tho. But I mean I've had like 6 or 7 gaps of 6 months to 1 year in flying because my life is chaotic and when I do fly I often barely make the 90 day currency because of money. Despite both those things, VATSIM flying actually has kept me proficient and I've never had a check out or BFR take more than one flight. The physics in MSFS are like X-Plane but with much better graphics, for sure the best home sim now to try and replicate the real thing. Best VFR sim ever, and amazing for IFR so long as you use VATSIM and not the in game ATC. There are free 3rd party enhancements for most of the default planes to make that better than payware for previous simulators. I love exploring the real world graphics in WWII era planes and stuff. For jets, I still think DCS is best, but MSFS is better for hot dogging in real locations because of the graphics. No legit weapons simulations tho, but personally I'm more into WWII dog fighting than modern stuff so never got into DCS much.

Note that VATSIM ATC is usually good in the US but varies. In Asia, Europe, and NZ/AU they take it super seriously and it's very realistic. I don't fly in the US much because it's more immersive doing it internationally and 7 days a week a lot of countries have ATC consistently while the US is very spotty other than LA, Memphis and Boston. Pilotedge is a waste of money, sorry. I've been doing this crap for 2 decades and I just go where the ATC is. If the US has no coverage, I promise you some airport in Europe or Asia or something probably has every freq online. It's more challenging that way anyway because every country does it differently and you learn a lot being constantly outside your comfort zone. When there is full ATC, I don't find pilot edge any more or less realistic. It's rare to have a horrible VATSIM controller. It's a sim, how boring to just fly in your backyard IMO. I often have MSFS on in the background cruising and this week I've done CRK-HKG, MNL-GES, SIN-KLO, DPS-SIN, BEG-HER, KWI-DXB, MEL-SYD, and SFO-EWR. I see what ATC is online and hasn't been logged in long, see what aircraft have flown that route recently, then hop in and go. That way I'm not only checking out different places but flying many different kinds of planes. It's a lot of fun to just be spontaneous and see the real traffic that is at that airport.

The payware airliners for MSFS are simply amazing. The Fokker 28 that just came out is so complex that I actually had to watch tutorials. I'm not a read the manuals kinda guy so I can usually just figure planes out and get them flying, but that one is crazy and I really enjoy doing strictly analog IFR flying in it.

Building a PC is stupid easy, even I can do it and I can't even change a tire on my car without damaging something or putting myself in grave danger. Less than $1000 and you can have a PC that will run MSFS with amazing graphics while you use Photoshop and other high RAM/VRAM usage programs in the background and watch porn all with great FPS. Or so I hear. I don't bother with pedals because every pair I've owned has sucked and broken easily, the Thrustmaster T1600 is a super sensitive joystick and the Honeycomb yoke really feels like the inputs you'd use in real life and goes a full 90 degrees when you twist it. I use a Saitek X56 Rhino throttle, sold the medicore joystick that came with it. You can use both throttles independently and do that UA232 stuff which is really difficult but lots of fun.
 
Last edited:
Don't make fun of me about this but I'm looking for a decent-enough simulation game that can help me learn to visualize and concretize things I'm currently learning.

Its not likely that I will be able to get in a plane soon, nor use a real simulator, so for now I just want something I can use in my downtime based on my current schedule (something that will feel more productive towards conquering my learning curve).

My current career path is pointed at become a dispatcher, and likely that, before getting certificated as a private pilot. I would like to actually fly to gain some familiarity but practically speaking this is outside the current scope of what I can grasp.

So I'm looking for a game I can download onto a console and get some simulated familiarity. I understand it cannot substitute for real experience. I just need it to help me concretize information I am absorbing.

That aside though, I want it to be as accurate and helpful as possible. I definitely want to avoid learning misinformation. In the same idea, but on a side note, if there's a game that can help me gain familiarity with the dispatching aspect of getting a plane from one place to another, I'd be curious to try that too.

I'm asking here since all of you are some kind of braniacs who, I think, can actually answer my question that I don't know where else to ask. Otherwise I'm going to play hit-n-miss and judge by sales ads and search-engine-optimized floof.

For more context I work bags on the ramp, am studying the basics of private pilot, and preparing to get a dispatcher cert. My time studying aviation spans a couple months. Things are set in motion on a clock and calendar but I still end up with downtime which makes me feel restless and impatient, hence my post.

Thanks in advance.
If you want to concretize, you'll need lots of concrete. Concrete is inimical to every goal of aviation.

It's ALL video games these days. In aviation, your best video game bet is likely X-Plane.
 
MSFS is a good sim that will teach you the fundamentals of flight/procedures. Coupled with VATSIM or PilotEdge (if you’re looking for something a bit more geared towards actual training and professional ATC). The latter does require a subscription but IMO is worth it.

As for the dispatcher side of things, Simbrief is a decent free dispatch solution that you can practice applying regs (1-2-3 rule, different OpsSpecs, etc). If you want to get a bit more advanced you can buy PFPX which is a very robust dispatching utility that is very similar to our real world flight planning software.

DCS is pretty sweet for military stuff. Especially when combined with VR.

I’ve been out of the VATSIM game for many years, but definitely recommend it in conjunction with MSFS 2020, the upcoming MSFS 2024, Prepar3D (formerly FSX) or Xplane.

I’d recommend OP invest in a desktop PC for this and invest in at least the $30 Logitech level joystick, it’s going to be night and day vs anything available on console.

The pros of VATSIM are that it’s free. The cons are that since it’s free, all the “controllers” are donating their time. I always felt bad having some real world commitment come up and having to leave a bunch of people hanging, but such is life with free things.

If you want to hone your IFR skills in as realistic an environment as possible the alternative to VATSIM is a subscription based service called PilotEdge. The controllers are paid and their availability is more regular and predictable. Last I checked I think they only offered Northern California. I’ve never used it but I had a friend who swore by it during his instrument training.

MSFS + VATSIM + live traffic is very immersive. The stock atc is ass compared to FSX/P3D tho. But I mean I've had like 6 or 7 gaps of 6 months to 1 year in flying because my life is chaotic and when I do fly I often barely make the 90 day currency because of money. Despite both those things, VATSIM flying actually has kept me proficient and I've never had a check out or BFR take more than one flight. The physics in MSFS are like X-Plane but with much better graphics, for sure the best home sim now to try and replicate the real thing. Best VFR sim ever, and amazing for IFR so long as you use VATSIM and not the in game ATC. There are free 3rd party enhancements for most of the default planes to make that better than payware for previous simulators. I love exploring the real world graphics in WWII era planes and stuff. For jets, I still think DCS is best, but MSFS is better for hot dogging in real locations because of the graphics. No legit weapons simulations tho, but personally I'm more into WWII dog fighting than modern stuff so never got into DCS much.

Note that VATSIM ATC is usually good in the US but varies. In Asia, Europe, and NZ/AU they take it super seriously and it's very realistic. I don't fly in the US much because it's more immersive doing it internationally and 7 days a week a lot of countries have ATC consistently while the US is very spotty other than LA, Memphis and Boston. Pilotedge is a waste of money, sorry. I've been doing this crap for 2 decades and I just go where the ATC is. If the US has no coverage, I promise you some airport in Europe or Asia or something probably has every freq online. It's more challenging that way anyway because every country does it differently and you learn a lot being constantly outside your comfort zone. When there is full ATC, I don't find pilot edge any more or less realistic. It's rare to have a horrible VATSIM controller. It's a sim, how boring to just fly in your backyard IMO. I often have MSFS on in the background cruising and this week I've done CRK-HKG, MNL-GES, SIN-KLO, DPS-SIN, BEG-HER, KWI-DXB, MEL-SYD, and SFO-EWR. I see what ATC is online and hasn't been logged in long, see what aircraft have flown that route recently, then hop in and go. That way I'm not only checking out different places but flying many different kinds of planes. It's a lot of fun to just be spontaneous and see the real traffic that is at that airport.

The payware airliners for MSFS are simply amazing. The Fokker 28 that just came out is so complex that I actually had to watch tutorials. I'm not a read the manuals kinda guy so I can usually just figure planes out and get them flying, but that one is crazy and I really enjoy doing strictly analog IFR flying in it.

Building a PC is stupid easy, even I can do it and I can't even change a tire on my car without damaging something or putting myself in grave danger. Less than $1000 and you can have a PC that will run MSFS with amazing graphics while you use Photoshop and other high RAM/VRAM usage programs in the background and watch porn all with great FPS. Or so I hear. I don't bother with pedals because every pair I've owned has sucked and broken easily, the Thrustmaster T1600 is a super sensitive joystick and the Honeycomb yoke really feels like the inputs you'd use in real life and goes a full 90 degrees when you twist it. I use a Saitek X56 Rhino throttle, sold the medicore joystick that came with it. You can use both throttles independently and do that UA232 stuff which is really difficult but lots of fun.
Thanks for the advice. A lot of it is currently going over my head but I got the gist that there are some ways to communicate with real ATCs live using these softwares and get much more meaningful practice. I also got the message that it's probably better to just get myself a computer, which sounds reasonable. It'll take some time to put a machine together but I'll come back to this thread for reference when its ready. (And I do like realistic simulations of all sorts of things, including places I haven't been and historic stuff, but for now I'm just nervous about learning what I need to know for my career path).

Thanks for all the information, everyone.
 
Last edited:
Bonus points for using "concretize". I didn't know that word!

That makes two of us, I'm glad I found it to be a real word before I set about trolling the OP
Thanks. I learned it from an old linguist and it satisfied my demand for an equal and opposite verb-form that could match "abstract". I didn't like the guy but he knew some useful stuff! Can't deny that, so I must credit him.

Actually, this might surprise you, but every English word I know, I learned from someone else.
 
I'll add for anyone reading this wanting to simulate IFR and VATSIM, these are you friends:

SimBrief.com - Virtual Flight Planning Solutions (free virtual dispatch for IFR flightplanning that is linked to many MSFS aircraft via tablets in the cockpit so you can quickly download the fuel\payload\route you create)

Navigraph - Flight Simulation Charts, Navigation Data and Flight Planning (subscription service a few bucks per month but provides global real-life IFR charts all updated regularly and connects to simbrief to ensure you are using the latest SIDs and STARs and waypoint database in MSFS. Many aircraft in MSFS will allow you to link to your navigraph account on the tablet and then view all the charts in the cockpit vs using the navigraph app as another window. The stand-alone app lets you explore every airport\enroute chart out there and it helped me a lot passing my IFR\CFII written)

Microsoft Flight Simulator | MSFS Mods, Add-Ons & Liveries - Flightsim.to (the main site for MSFS addons. If you look thru the most popular downloads, you'll find a lot of improvement mods and some very cool planes, and with something like 8x the userbase that FSX had, even really obscure liveries have been done for most planes).

FlyByWire Simulations (their "A32X" download turns the default MSFS A320 into a payware quality plane, and their improved cockpits and systems can be used on the freeware A333\A339 and the LatinVFR A318\319\321NEO with merge files on flightsim.to. Their app also lets you download and run FS Live Traffic [FSTL] which is a large file that will install the models and textures you need to see the majority of civil aircraft as live traffic in the real location and phase of flight they are in across the globe)

With AI though, the game is a bit buggy still. They fly weird, rotate waaaay too early (because MSFS thought users would rather have fake AI rocket off one after another than wait in line for real takeoff times with their arcade Xbox mentality...), jetways don't connect right sometimes, ect.

traffic1.jpg
 
Last edited:
Thanks. I learned it from an old linguist and it satisfied my demand for an equal and opposite verb-form that could match "abstract". I didn't like the guy but he knew some useful stuff! Can't deny that, so I must credit him.
You need to find another career path. You’re too smart to be a pilot.
 
If we can use simulators to qualify, I am certainly ready to drive a giant, stompy robot through all kinds of terrain.
 
X-Plane 12 and the Hot Start Challenger 650 is pretty damn amazing! My wife doesn’t agree though.
 
I'll add for anyone reading this wanting to simulate IFR and VATSIM, these are you friends:

SimBrief.com - Virtual Flight Planning Solutions (free virtual dispatch for IFR flightplanning that is linked to many MSFS aircraft via tablets in the cockpit so you can quickly download the fuel\payload\route you create)

Navigraph - Flight Simulation Charts, Navigation Data and Flight Planning (subscription service a few bucks per month but provides global real-life IFR charts all updated regularly and connects to simbrief to ensure you are using the latest SIDs and STARs and waypoint database in MSFS. Many aircraft in MSFS will allow you to link to your navigraph account on the tablet and then view all the charts in the cockpit vs using the navigraph app as another window. The stand-alone app lets you explore every airport\enroute chart out there and it helped me a lot passing my IFR\CFII written)

Microsoft Flight Simulator | MSFS Mods, Add-Ons & Liveries - Flightsim.to (the main site for MSFS addons. If you look thru the most popular downloads, you'll find a lot of improvement mods and some very cool planes, and with something like 8x the userbase that FSX had, even really obscure liveries have been done for most planes).

FlyByWire Simulations (their "A32X" download turns the default MSFS A320 into a payware quality plane, and their improved cockpits and systems can be used on the freeware A333\A339 and the LatinVFR A318\319\321NEO with merge files on flightsim.to. Their app also lets you download and run FS Live Traffic [FSTL] which is a large file that will install the models and textures you need to see the majority of civil aircraft as live traffic in the real location and phase of flight they are in across the globe)

With AI though, the game is a bit buggy still. They fly weird, rotate waaaay too early (because MSFS thought users would rather have fake AI rocket off one after another than wait in line for real takeoff times with their arcade Xbox mentality...), jetways don't connect right sometimes, ect.

traffic1.jpg

traffic1a.jpg


Wat
 
Back
Top