Considering joining the profession for good, could use advice

[drunkenbeagle]

Not to steal the thunder from https://jetcareers.com/forums/members/19294/, (not sure how to quote that name), but the thread title seemed appropriate.

Long time member, very rare topic poster. Currently working in the tech sales world for a big tech company. If you know me in person, you probably know that I've been ready to do something else for a while. It isn't lost on me that I have a job that lots of people would kill for in this business. I have enjoyed the career so far. I also don't want to do it for the rest of my life. And if I'm going to do something else, now is a better option than later. I have a mostly paid of house and can survive a substantial pay cut for a few years, but not forever.

I'm 45 years old, and have been flying since college. CFI/CFI-I/CFIG, C-ASEL/ASES/AMEL/Glider, ~1,100TT, 1st class medical, expired ATP written. Still teaching part time. Busted a CFI-Glider and C-AMEL ride, both involving to steep turns. No accidents/incidents/any other the of the bad boxes to check. Unless it is an offer I couldn't turn down, the goal is part 121 - not 135.

I'm aware that the hiring environment isn't what it was 18 months ago. I still have my day job, and it has seemed prudent to keep doing what I'm doing for now. The hours keep (slowly) adding to the logbook, and I continue to shake hands at industry events. This has been productive, even if they have been jobs that it hasn't made sense for me to take (I'm older, a combination of less flight time and even less money isn't going to work out long term).

Is there some point where it makes more sense to rip off the band aid and start flying full time? And if so, when is that? Or stick to the current plan, which is to keep the day job until 1,500 hours, quit, and get an ATP and a type in a sim, and instruct full time until the phone rings. Or something I haven't thought of?

Appreciate any feedback, and if you can let it go at least 10 posts without turning it into a political dumpster fire, thanks. Special thanks to everyone that also gives me advice now, but that's a pretty small group. You know who you are, and I sincerely appreciate it.

 

[knot4u]

Not to steal the thunder from https://jetcareers.com/forums/members/19294/, (not sure how to quote that name), but the thread title seemed appropriate.

Long time member, very rare topic poster. Currently working in the tech sales world for a big tech company. If you know me in person, you probably know that I've been ready to do something else for a while. It isn't lost on me that I have a job that lots of people would kill for in this business. I have enjoyed the career so far. I also don't want to do it for the rest of my life. And if I'm going to do something else, now is a better option than later. I have a mostly paid of house and can survive a substantial pay cut for a few years, but not forever.

I'm 45 years old, and have been flying since college. CFI/CFI-I/CFIG, C-ASEL/ASES/AMEL/Glider, ~1,100TT, 1st class medical, expired ATP written. Still teaching part time. Busted a CFI-Glider and C-AMEL ride, both involving to steep turns. No accidents/incidents/any other the of the bad boxes to check. Unless it is an offer I couldn't turn down, the goal is part 121 - not 135.

I'm aware that the hiring environment isn't what it was 18 months ago. I still have my day job, and it has seemed prudent to keep doing what I'm doing for now. The hours keep (slowly) adding to the logbook, and I continue to shake hands at industry events. This has been productive, even if they have been jobs that it hasn't made sense for me to take (I'm older, a combination of less flight time and even less money isn't going to work out long term).

Is there some point where it makes more sense to rip off the band aid and start flying full time? And if so, when is that? Or stick to the current plan, which is to keep the day job until 1,500 hours, quit, and get an ATP and a type in a sim, and instruct full time until the phone rings. Or something I haven't thought of?

Appreciate any feedback, and if you can let it go at least 10 posts without turning it into a political dumpster fire, thanks. Special thanks to everyone that also gives me advice now, but that's a pretty small group. You know who you are, and I sincerely appreciate it.

Easy. Just start saying you're a teacher/doctor, doors will open. Good luck.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

Easy. Just start saying you're a teacher/doctor, doors will open. Good luck.

I'm very much enjoying teaching. I'm going to miss that more than anything else, if I have to give it up.

 

[derg]

Dive in. Because when things improve you’re already positioned to take advantage of opportunity.

You don’t have to give up teaching, especially on the side. Hell 100% of the job I do as a LCA exercises my CFI muscle.

 

[Boris Badenov]

and if you can let it go at least 10 posts without turning it into a political dumpster fire, thanks.

You're a communist. Who now owes me $5.

That said, reading the tea-leaves (leafs?), things aren't going to get a whole lot worse (due to retirements) for the foreseeable future, unless there's a black swan type of thing. I think you're probably at least as smart as anyone responding when it comes to the time/money/value equation, so I'll just say that I had no *idea* how important Seniority was until I got into 121. Sure, I read everyone saying it over and over, but it didn't really scan until I was, myself, in the trenches. If I'd been hired at the current shop five years earlier (which I probably could have been, had I made it my Mission), I'd be either an extremely senior F/O pretty much calling my own shots vis a vis scheduling, or a not-super-junior C/A who could at least dodge the worst of the domestic crap.

You have made Friends, here (in all of the right, non-cringey ways). If it were me, and I knew to a certainty that I was going to go fly airplanes eventually, I would fly the feathers off of that purple monstrosity until I hit 1499, then fire off a hundred emails whilst flying the last hour.

You're going to sin (financially) eventually, might as well Sin Boldly and Soon.

This advice is worth what you paid for it.

 

[jmc4]

@killbilly

Killbilly will have more recent knowledge, but I ripped the bandaid off at 30 and left the full time job for full time cfi. My experience (and yours) is going to be really unique.

Can you take leave and full time CFI for the last 400 hours then possibly return to the steady income until you get a 121 offer?

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I think it will be readily apparent to you, as someone who has already had a long career, when it’s time to get into the trough with all four limbs, aviation wise, just as it has been computing wise.

With this said, I do like your plan; please continue to fly airplanes if you want to fly airplanes. @killbilly can tell you more about the “first steps” with more recency than I (or a lot of others, frankly) can.

I'm very much enjoying teaching. I'm going to miss that more than anything else, if I have to give it up.

Depends on where you wind up; some shops will happily look the other way for outside instruction, others won’t. But there’s the LCP thing and all manner of other places “in house” for those with the teaching bend too. And it can be lucrative, too.

 

[///AMG]

I think it will be readily apparent to you, as someone who has already had a long career, when it’s time to get into the trough with all four limbs, aviation wise, just as it has been computing wise.

Did have to laugh at your use of "computing"

"Hey guy over there, whatcha up to?"....."oh me? Just doing some computing"

 

[Autothrust Blue]

Did have to laugh at your use of "computing"

"Hey guy over there, whatcha up to?"....."oh me? Just doing some computing"

The serious computing kind, of the sort that runs a good portion of the Internet, and so on.

The one question I guess I’d have for @drunkenbeagle is about where to work vs. where to live. Err’body commutes from Florida it seems, but that one’s a bit down the line, problems-wise.

 

[SteveC]

I made the switch in my mid-40’s. Part 135/91, not 121, but I’ll tell the abbreviated version anyway. Had around 1200 hours when I made the decision. Networked and found a part-time job flying charter twin Cessnas - I’d get a call requesting to fly (a few days out), and I’d take a vacation day from the full-time job to accept. After a while that operator offered me full-time, old-school 135, basically on-call 24/7, for $24K. I had enough money set aside to supplement the income for up to two years, so I dove in (with a back-up plan of returning to the old career). Got the offer at my final employer just under my 2 year deadline - never looked back.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

The one question I guess I’d have for @drunkenbeagle is about where to work vs. where to live. Err’body commutes from Florida it seems, but that one’s a bit down the line, problems-wise.

Something I'll worry about when if and when it happens I guess.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

@killbilly

Killbilly will have more recent knowledge, but I ripped the bandaid off at 30 and left the full time job for full time cfi. My experience (and yours) is going to be really unique.

Can you take leave and full time CFI for the last 400 hours then possibly return to the steady income until you get a 121 offer?

If I thought I could get away with that, I would have already. I suspect that asking the question would result in a severance package offer within the hour. That's what has happened to everyone I personally know that has requested any type of leave.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

Not to steal the thunder from https://jetcareers.com/forums/members/19294/, (not sure how to quote that name), but the thread title seemed appropriate.

Long time member, very rare topic poster. Currently working in the tech sales world for a big tech company. If you know me in person, you probably know that I've been ready to do something else for a while. It isn't lost on me that I have a job that lots of people would kill for in this business. I have enjoyed the career so far. I also don't want to do it for the rest of my life. And if I'm going to do something else, now is a better option than later. I have a mostly paid of house and can survive a substantial pay cut for a few years, but not forever.

I'm 45 years old, and have been flying since college. CFI/CFI-I/CFIG, C-ASEL/ASES/AMEL/Glider, ~1,100TT, 1st class medical, expired ATP written. Still teaching part time. Busted a CFI-Glider and C-AMEL ride, both involving to steep turns. No accidents/incidents/any other the of the bad boxes to check. Unless it is an offer I couldn't turn down, the goal is part 121 - not 135.

I'm aware that the hiring environment isn't what it was 18 months ago. I still have my day job, and it has seemed prudent to keep doing what I'm doing for now. The hours keep (slowly) adding to the logbook, and I continue to shake hands at industry events. This has been productive, even if they have been jobs that it hasn't made sense for me to take (I'm older, a combination of less flight time and even less money isn't going to work out long term).

Is there some point where it makes more sense to rip off the band aid and start flying full time? And if so, when is that? Or stick to the current plan, which is to keep the day job until 1,500 hours, quit, and get an ATP and a type in a sim, and instruct full time until the phone rings. Or something I haven't thought of?

Appreciate any feedback, and if you can let it go at least 10 posts without turning it into a political dumpster fire, thanks. Special thanks to everyone that also gives me advice now, but that's a pretty small group. You know who you are, and I sincerely appreciate it.

The time to rip off the bandaid was 2 years ago. I can’t say I’d recommend quitting and going all in at this point.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

If I thought I could get away with that, I would have already. I suspect that asking the question would result in a severance package offer within the hour. That's what has happened to everyone I personally know that has requested any type of leave.

God bless America.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

The time to rip off the bandaid was 2 years ago. I can’t say I’d recommend quitting and going all in at this point.

I can't change the past, only what I can do tomorrow.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

I can't change the past, only what I can do tomorrow.

Yeah, sure, but right now, the entry level job market has sort of dried up. That’s why I’d recommend doing what you’re doing until you get closer to 1500 hours. You can continue to save for a while, because the next 3-5 years will be pretty lean.

 

[///AMG]

If I thought I could get away with that, I would have already. I suspect that asking the question would result in a severance package offer within the hour. That's what has happened to everyone I personally know that has requested any type of leave.

Jeez, that sounds rough. Are you talking more extended/other purpose leaves, or just regular old vacation/PTO?

 

[drunkenbeagle]

Jeez, that sounds rough. Are you talking more extended/other purpose leaves, or just regular old vacation/PTO?

Anything that would make it in front of HR.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Yeah, sure, but right now, the entry level job market has sort of dried up. That’s why I’d recommend doing what you’re doing until you get closer to 1500 hours. You can continue to save for a while, because the next 3-5 years will be pretty lean.

I hope you're wrong but fear you are correct.

 

[Kingairer]

I personally am more cautious, and would not leave my current job without some sort of clear pathway to another one. I would stay current, part time CFI, keep firing resumes to places that can get me flying full time and then quit. But i would not quit, to do more training, 2 years ago maybe. I would also seek out jobs at some of those "public charter" (loophole) places like JSX or contour that may be able to hire you without 1500 hours.