ATP is now VA approved!

About time they did this... Im sure its a pain for everyone to get 141 approval, but its business that they were missing out on.
 
If I remember right Panama is the only location. They took over a place there that had the 141 kind of in place. I believe they still up until a while ago had those former instructors there to. Anyways its good news for our Vets. Not a bad price at all. 24k.
 
Now the question is, for the Vets who have gone through the program recently. Can they get in on the VA action for ATP's career pilot program?
 
WOW, ATP finally made the 141 jump. Their program is a 141 style. I guess in these times, they are looking for every possible way to make a buck. Good for them, it's about time.
 
I personally think ATP's own system for teaching Instruments is far superior to the 141 Jepp syllabus. I've been teaching 141 for quite a while now, and I think the cross country phases is VERY weak. With ATP 61, I had 30 hours of time building doing IFR cross countries before I ever started the IFR training.
Well it would be interesting to see which 141 syllabus they use, maybe they developed their own and had the FAA approve it.
 
Back in February of 2008, I went to Panama City. The class right before mine, January 2008 class was in the Part 141 private pilot course. The February 2008 class did Part 61. All other classes while I was there did the private course under Part 61. ATP took over an older 141 flight school that was there in the building and they inherited two older guys who were 141 instructors. I guess that's why they were doing 141 for a little bit.
 
Jetguy... The ATP location is a 141 school for both private and career pilot programs now... I am not sure when they made the switch but as far as I understand its been 141 private for a while now.
 
Well thats great. Too bad its too late. Can former grads get reimbursed through the VA? Guess thats a quesiton for ATP and the VA.
 
Airdale said:
Well thats great. Too bad its too late. Can former grads get reimbursed through the VA? Guess thats a quesiton for ATP and the VA.
Click to expand...

No, that is not an option.

The VA will not reimburse funds for non-VA approved flight training that occur prior to the date of approval.

Sucks, but that's just the way it is.
 
I talk to my inst. instructor about twice a month. I spoke to him yesterday, and he told me he thinks that they are trying to get 141 at all the major locations. That would include ATL and JAX, but I don't know about Dallas. 141 is where the VA approval came from.
 
Just so there is no confusion, simply operating a 141 flight school does not make a VA Approved flight school.

As I understand it, each individual location requires VA approval for the 141 courses in operation at that location.

Company XYZ owns two locations.

Location A offers 141 courses in Instrument Airplane, Commercial Multi and Single, and Flight Instructor certificates. Location A has completed and has VA approval for those programs as the investigation process has concluded.

Location B offers 141 courses in the same courses as location A, but has not follow the appropriate steps to have VA Approval for those individual courses. Thus, Location B is not VA Approved.

Students at Location B would not be able to claim VA educational benefits simply by filing the paperwork through Location A.
 
PFN is VA approved for the Airline Career Pilot Program and so far that is the only location. It is just about the same program as at all the other ATP locations. There are a couple of slight changes, but nothing that a student would even notice. You still get 200 hours of flight time (don't let the website fool you into thinking you get 250 hours).

I know ATP is sending students to PFN from other locations to do the Private Multi and then those students are going back to their original locations for the instrument. I think that it has something to do with keeping the 141 certificate current. Maybe someone with more 141 knowledge than myself can explain better.

As far as other locations getting 141 approved, I know that is the plan but I don't know how soon it will happen. The plan is JAX, ATL, and DFW initially.
 
guywhoflies said:
PFN is VA approved for the Airline Career Pilot Program and so far that is the only location. It is just about the same program as at all the other ATP locations. There are a couple of slight changes, but nothing that a student would even notice. You still get 200 hours of flight time (don't let the website fool you into thinking you get 250 hours).

I know ATP is sending students to PFN from other locations to do the Private Multi and then those students are going back to their original locations for the instrument. I think that it has something to do with keeping the 141 certificate current. Maybe someone with more 141 knowledge than myself can explain better.

As far as other locations getting 141 approved, I know that is the plan but I don't know how soon it will happen. The plan is JAX, ATL, and DFW initially.
Click to expand...

Im going to assume that part 141 stuff is the same no matter where you are.

My old school taught PPL as part of a part 141 program. The main difference I noticed were the stage checks that are required at certain points. Those stage checks cant be done by just any CFI, they have to be done by a CFI who has been checked out by the FAA. This is probably the main reason why they are only doing the 141 program in one location, because they have the CFI's that are checked out to do the stage checks there.

You can also only have a certain amount of "stage checkers." At our school we had 3 guys who were able to do that, and for whatever reason we werent allowed anymore. So if you look at some ATP locations where there are only 2 or 3 instructors, they would have to rely heavily on one person. If that person quit for whatever reason, then it would cause a huge backlog in getting people done on time.
 
v1valarob said:
Those stage checks cant be done by just any CFI, they have to be done by a CFI who has been checked out by the FAA. This is probably the main reason why they are only doing the 141 program in one location, because they have the CFI's that are checked out to do the stage checks there.

So if you look at some ATP locations where there are only 2 or 3 instructors, they would have to rely heavily on one person. If that person quit for whatever reason, then it would cause a huge backlog in getting people done on time.
Click to expand...

Actually, check instructors must pass a test given by the chief instructor, not the FAA. [141.37(a)(1)] They do, however, have to then be approved by the FAA [141.37(b)(2)] (not sure what that entails, maybe a "checkride" or maybe just a signature). Also, PFN doesn't have any instructors who are approved check instructors. They have their chief instructor but he doesn't have examining authority yet. That is why the students from other locations are being sent to PFN...so that ATP has 10 students go through the training and they are hoping that 90% pass their PMEL checkrides and then they can apply for examining authority. [141.63(a)(5)]

As you said, ATP will never have 141 courses at their smaller locations simply because they don't have a chief instructor. As far as I know, the only locations that are being looked at right now for possible 141 programs are JAX, ATL, and DFW (which all have people who could be the chief instructors at those locations).
 
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