AA canceled flights

[MikeD]

Probably not so bad once they started charging for full access however.

Yeah, was a great way to get rid of the riff raff and their commentary.

Hmmm. You know....that could work for here.......

 

[SeanD]

Ever seen the Craigslist rants section? Wwwwwwhoa

 

[Sidious]

Ever seen the Craigslist rants section? Wwwwwwhoa

I just did. Honestly, a little bit of me died while reading. Damn

 

[mastermags]

Why bother getting upset at reader comments? Half the people commenting don't know the difference between fair and fare or plain and plane. I guarantee none of them know a thing about union relations and law.

 

[MikeD]

Why bother getting upset at reader comments? Half the people commenting don't know the difference between fair and fare or plain and plane. I guarantee none of them know a thing about union relations and law.

All of which is moot. Sure, they don't know the difference. But a negative public perception isn't good for either side. And between the management as well as the union and what both are doing, the biggest entity who loses in all of this, is the name of American Airlines; a proud name with a long heritage. And that's pretty sad.

 

[mastermags]

All of which is moot. Sure, they don't know the difference. But a negative public perception isn't good for either side. And between the management as well as the union and what both are doing, the biggest entity who loses in all of this, is the name of American Airlines; a proud name with a long heritage. And that's pretty sad.

My point was simply about avoiding comments sections. As far as my opinion on the proud name of American Airlines: With unprecedented scope relief, unlimited outsourcing to other carriers, and multiple domicile closures it's the very brand name of American Airlines that AMR is attempting to liquidate to 'some day' turn a profit.

 

[MikeD]

My point was simply about avoiding comments sections. As far as my opinion on the proud name of American Airlines: With unprecedented scope relief, unlimited outsourcing to other carriers, and multiple domicile closures it's the very brand name of American Airlines that AMR is attempting to liquidate to 'some day' turn a profit.

I agree with your point; I was just expanding it out to the bigger picture of AA's current woes and how they were likely seen by the lay public.

 

[nocturnalaviator]

Some of those comments really irritate me!

Still not as bad as youboobtube.

Sent from my Android mobile device.

 

[wheelsup]

So anyway that woman was probably one of the most informed and knowledgeable "consultants" I have EVER seen on a news program. Unfortunate she isn't on a major network.

 

[Xcaliber]

OK, so, something we've all been seeing a lot of lately:

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...-hundreds-flights-pilots-blame-130608550.html

According to American,...maintenance write-ups "have covered items such as torn seat pockets, frayed seat belts and malfunctioning coffee machines and passenger reading lights."

American Spokesman Bruce Hicks told The Wall Street Journal that management has "seen unprecedented pilot maintenance write-ups, many at the time of scheduled departure, which is having an impact on our operations" in the past two weeks.

http://marketday.nbcnews.com/_news/...rlines-sends-thousands-of-layoff-notices?lite

American also said it is cutting flights by one to two percent for the rest of September and October.
The cuts are partly due to an increase in pilot sick days and greater maintenance reports by flight crews led to flight cancellations and delays, Hicks said.

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/american-airlines-faults-pilots-disruptions-103604472.html

Airlines typically try to keep flying through bankruptcy. But simmering labor tensions at American Airlines have boiled over from the negotiating room to the airports in recent weeks, disrupting operations and leaving a trail of delayed and canceled flights that the airline says is the fault of its pilots.
ing matters worse, last-minute inspections ordered by pilots have more than quadrupled the number of cancellations related to maintenance issues this month. As a result, nearly half of American’s flights are now arriving late at their destinations.
A spike in maintenance work requested by pilots has forced more flight cancellations and delays. Those requests, called pilot write-ups, are sometimes posted after the main cabin door has been closed or the airplane has reached the taxiway, the company said.
Since the beginning of the month, the cancellation rate has averaged 2 percent, more than twice the usual rate. On Sept. 17, the airline said, it canceled 6 percent of its flights because of pilot write-ups. Maintenance requests by pilots are 34 percent higher this month than the same month last year. Another procedure called a precautionary check, which is also ordered by pilots but requires no repair, is up by 97 percent, the airline said.
“Every airline has maintenance issues, every day,” said Mr. Hicks, the spokesman for American.
“We have a system that provides for safe operations and we expect our pilots to write up legitimate maintenance concerns. But the impact on operations has been terrible. Customers see it that way, and rightly so.”
In some cases, the complaints involve serious issues. In others, they are more mundane: pilots have been reporting burned-out passenger lights, frayed seat-back pockets or broken coffee makers, the airline said. As a result, the number of flights canceled because of maintenance issues has shot up to an average of 31 a day this month. That is more than four times the regular maintenance-related cancellation rate of seven, the airline said.

Here's where I'm confused. Let's set a few facts:
- The airline keeps using words like "pilot's fault" and "mundane issues."
- You and I all know that around the industry, more often than not, "we didn't see that it was broken until we got home/to a maintenance base/after our turn." All of the sudden, pilots at AMR aren't doing this, and instead, are doing what they're supposed to do, write up squawks when they find them.
- FAA legal views maintenance issues as black and white: either it's broken, or it's good to go. There are no such things as "mundane" issues when it comes to airworthiness.
- As part of the perception of safety at an airline, it behooves AMR to say they are addressing all of the maintenance concern brought to them by pilots in a timely, effective, and safe manner.

I get that the airline is trying to set the public perception that the pilots are intentionally trying to sabotage the airline. But from these press releases, AMR is not only saying that they know pilots are flying with undocumented maintenance issues around their system, but that they expect the pilots to do this. How does that...
1) not set a bad taste in the mouths of travelers that AMR isn't taking the issue of aircraft maintenance seriously?
2) not cause FAA national to raise a few eyebrows with regards to maintenance practices at AMR, regardless of public perception?

I just don't understand how an airline can think it's a good idea to so blatantly admit that they're flying illegally and with such disregard for safety. It just seems like an ass-backwards position to be taking.

 

[bronco21016]

$$$ + FAA = We don't need no stinkin' reading lamps.

 

[wheelsup]

4 pages already

http://forums.jetcareers.com/threads/aa-canceled-flights.153212/#post-1974188

 

[Autothrust Blue]

Nothing to see here, move along.

 

[derg]

I figure it's "binary". If it doesn't work, let the chips fall with maintenance.

The company knows the rules, the pilots know the rules and maintenance knows the rules as well.

Having been to the "big brown desk" at HQ with the FAA, do not risk your career trying to be a "good guy" or "keep 'em flying" because the FAA maintenance inspection division is like Honey Badger.

 

[pete2800]

As I said.......speaking of war: I may disagree heavily with US foreign policy on our wars and how our own government is screwing our troops; but that doesn't mean when I get deployed overseas that I go bomb civilians with my jet just so I can make a point.

Writing up a legitimate maintenance item at an inconvenient time that is going to result in someone's flight getting cancelled is hardly the same as intentionally mis-using weaponry to end the lives of people unrelated to the situation.

 

[MikeD]

Writing up a legitimate maintenance item at an inconvenient time that is going to result in someone's flight getting cancelled is hardly the same as intentionally mis-using weaponry to end the lives of people unrelated to the situation.

Writing up a legitimate minor maintenance item that wouldn't have been written up before, but is now written up in order to cause inconvenience and/or a flight cancellation, IS a similar concept. And it does and has happened.

 

[BobDDuck]

Writing up a legitimate minor maintenance item that wouldn't have been written up before, but is now written up in order to cause inconvenience and/or a flight cancellation, IS a similar concept. And it does and has happened.

You are looking at this backwards. Prior to the pilots just doing their jobs, they would intentionally violate FARs and NOT write stuff up in order to NOT inconvenience passengers and to AVOID flight cancellations.

Was it a good thing and did it keep the airline (mostly) running on time?

Yep.

Was it willfully negligent and illegal?

Yep.

 

[MikeD]

You are looking at this backwards. Prior to the pilots just doing their jobs, they would intentionally violate FARs and NOT write stuff up in order to NOT inconvenience passengers and to AVOID flight cancellations.

Was it a good thing and did it keep the airline (mostly) running on time?

Yep.

Was it willfully negligent and illegal?

Yep.

It's twofold. There are minor gripes that are more annoyances vs ones that are FAR violations. Of course anything required for airworthiness or by opspecs should be written up and attended to; but pile up enough minor gripes that arent grounding or violating, where one didn't used to, and its easy to cause delays and/or cancellations that wouldn't have been there before. It's too bad that this is where things sink to, with both sides doing nothing more than ruining the good name of their airline.

 

[tomokc]

Apples & oranges (commercial aviation and the Apollo program), but here is a quote from Neil Armstrong as reported by the Wall Street Journal last month. My point is to ask how we start moving towards better maintenance in the industry? How do you get people to take pride in their jobs again, and ownership of how they contribute towards the organization? Naive when talking about AMR, I suppose, but I'd like to see them better stewards of their employees' contributions...

“Each of the components of our hardware were designed to certain reliability specifications, and far the majority, had a reliability requirement of 0.99996, which means that you have four failures in 100,000 operations. If every component met its reliability specifications precisely, a typical Apollo flight would have about 1,000 separate identifiable failures.”
“In fact, we had more like 150 failures per flight, substantially better than statistical methods would tell you that you might have. I can only attribute that to the fact that every guy in the project, every guy at the bench building something, every assembler, every inspector, every guy that’s setting up the tests, cranking the torque wrench, is saying, ‘If anything goes wrong here, it’s not going to be my fault, because my part is going to be better than I have to make it.’ And when you have hundreds of thousands of people all doing their job a little better than they have to, you get an improvement in performance.”

 

[MikeD]

"...... I can only attribute that to the fact that every guy in the project, every guy at the bench building something, every assembler, every inspector, every guy that’s setting up the tests, cranking the torque wrench, is saying, ‘If anything goes wrong here, it’s not going to be my fault, because my part is going to be better than I have to make it.’ And when you have hundreds of thousands of people all doing their job a little better than they have to, you get an improvement in performance.”

I don't know if you'd find that in: 1) the union culture at the airline of not doing more than contracted, not doing anything extra, not going above and beyond; and essentially doing only what is supposed to be done, no less and definitely no more. Or, 2) the management culture of dollars/profit first, people/workers last. There a myriad of reasons for why it's this way...and they are letigimate in certain respects, such as liability and/or insurance purposes. So while it'd be nice to have management that truly cares for the workers, and workers who will always go above and beyond; realistically, I don't know if it could ever happen today. Maybe back in the day when we had a less litigious society all-around.