Plane Down in Buffalo - Colgan Continental Flight 3407

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from the drudgereport
http://wcbstv.com/breakingnewsalerts/continental.airlines.crash.2.934393.html

Quoted directly from the article.

"Spokesman Steven Chealander of the National Transportation Safety Board said that the flight data and cockpit voice recorders were recovered, and that they were able to listen to the crew's conversations moments before the crash.

"The crew discussed significant ice buildup, ice on the windshield and leading edge on the wings," Chealander said. "Right after that 'severe pitch and roll' were the words that were used."

Chealander added that the pilots reported that the visibility was three miles with snow and mist in the vicinity, and that they "noticed it was rather hazy" as they descended."
 
Stone Cold said:
Aviate Navigate Communicate. Some of the first things an aviator learns. Sorry, but they had bigger fish to try to fry than letting ATC know what is happening. Besides, if things got as ugly as they possibly did on this flight, you would be in self-preservation mode and not worried about ATC at this point.
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Understood. Thanks.
 
PGT said:
I thought one is supposed to blow the boots at the FAF or just before?
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The Q is auto and operates on the set it and forget it principle. The boots would have been on "fast" with props and windshield on and would have handled itself. There is nothing the pilots could have done to intervene with the system aside of turning it on or off or from slow to fast. There are a few other minor settings in there but are not pertinent. The boots clear every surface of the airplane in a matter of 1 minute 1 "zone" at a time and then start over again. The props cycle between the two and the windshield, it gets hot.

Im headed to BOS as we speak to take fedex to Newark to spend 1am until 7 in the crewroom, not looking forward to it.
 
Wow...this was not the kind of news that i wanted to see on the tv screen in the instructor lounge as i'm walking in from soloing a student, as soon as i found out it was a colgan flight my first reaction was to check JC , that just shows how tightly knitted this community is... i wish my deepest condolences to the family's of the flight crew, passengers and to anyone else who is in some way affected by this terrible tragedy....r.i.p.
 
PGT said:
I thought one is supposed to blow the boots at the FAF or just before?
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Not sure about the Q400, but on the ATR you basically had the boots either on (ice detected) or off (no ice detected). It cycled them on its own. I'd assume the Q is similar.

Am I the only one hear having a problem with the silence?
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Yup :). At Eagle, they gave us the Roselawn situation in the sim. From 8000' (I think) there was no time to react whatsoever. Once they brought the flaps up, I think it was pretty much unsurviveable. It really struck me, though, how violent and rapid the whole thing was.
 
Velocipede said:
And they probably had less than 30 seconds to do it.
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The NTSB spokesman said 20 seconds elapsed from the flaps 15 selection to the end of the recording. Not much time to contemplate your entire life while attempting to regain control of an out of control airliner. I'm sure they were trying to fly it to the end.
 
Duck_Twacy said:
I'm sure they were trying to fly it to the end.
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I believe the NTSB said they had extended the gear, then flaps...and the gear was retracted just prior to impact. Seems to me they were flying till the end, the mark of a professional aviator. Sad, sad, sad....
 
Wow. I didn't hear about this until this morning while I was driving up to the union office. One of the other union officers called me and just asked "do you want to send an email up to the Colgan MEC offering our help if they need it?" I didn't have any idea what he was talking about. When he explained what happened, I hung up immediately and called Seggy. Those couple of rings before he picked up the phone felt like an eternity. Thank God he's ok, along with the other JC regulars from CJC.

My thoughts and prayers go out to the Colgan pilots and the families of our brothers and sisters who were lost. And please, follow Velo's advice if you're taking this especially hard: talk to a CIRP volunteer. I made sure to call Seggy back this afternoon to let him know we were sending up one of our CIRP volunteers to IAD to help out. CIRP doesn't get activated very often (thank God), but they're worth their weight in gold when something horrible like this happens.
 
Duck_Twacy said:
The NTSB spokesman said 20 seconds elapsed from the flaps 15 selection to the end of the recording. Not much time to contemplate your entire life while attempting to regain control of an out of control airliner. I'm sure they were trying to fly it to the end.
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I'm sure that's exactly what happened. When I was in 727 FE ground school, we had an instructor who crashed a racer at Reno. He even had film of the crash.

When the guys asked him what it was like, he said you don't even think about dying. You just keep flying the airplane until you hit the ground.
 
Re: Plane Down in Buffalo

Qgar said:
OMG, I was just getting home from my day in DFW and heard the breaking news on the radio. At the same time, my best friend at colgan called me hysterical to see if I'm ok. She told me who the FAs are, and I know them well and just saw them on an a/c swap the other day. I feel sick to my stomach.
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Qgar,
Sorry to hear about your friends. I have a good friend, a Continental FO, and his wife and three kids who were supposed to be on that flight, but missed it at the last minute.
 
I read a great quote on another board and thought that I would share it here: “…an airline pilot may earn his entire yearly salary in just few minutes. At that moment he would gladly give up the entire amount for the privilege of being elsewhere.”

So awful. I get back into the Dash tomorrow morning and I know that this will be with me the entire 3 day trip and much longer
 
Scandinavian13 said:
Sometimes, people should just keep their mouths shut if they don't know what they're talking about...

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h6MCrWgt5QTAImBhMb85LPhYzQfQD96B18FG0

I would say I can't believe someone would be so ignorant to write an article like that, but I've seen too many aviation stories covered by non-aviation presses.
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This terrible whenever I hear about a fatalities in aviation it churns my stomach. My condolences to all the victims and their families.

On the same note, Bill OReilly and Geraldo Rivera brought up the same thing on FoxNews tonight... To early and too soon to go there... :mad:
 
Becca Shaw was a Central Washington grad. I remember seeing her everyday before I got disptached to go flying at Central. She was always nice and asking how your day was going. Central is located in Ellensburg, Wa and if anyone know how to deal with adverse flying conditions it would have been a Central grad. We train in the heart of the PAC. NW where it can be sunny one minute and snowing the next. Most of our training, like most flights, was based around the weather. Determining the go/no-go decision was in your mind every flight. Ellensburg is really known for being the venturi of the NW. One day it could be calm and then the next day blowing 35 plus knots and we go.

Please never doubt the skill of the crew because one day it could be you. We all have to strive for excellence. Unlike the previous posts the google article disgust me. The experience of the pilot yes should be a concern, but by God we live in America where we all train for the unexpected sometimes its more than we can handle. Thats God's plan for us and those that know us.

Keep the Shaw and Morris family in your prayers.

And I too believe, no matter the disagreements all pilots profesional or not stand for their for own.

Blue Skiies and Safe Landings!

GO CENTRAL WILDCATS!
 
zmiller4 said:
Yup :). At Eagle, they gave us the Roselawn situation in the sim. From 8000' (I think) there was no time to react whatsoever. Once they brought the flaps up, I think it was pretty much unsurviveable. It really struck me, though, how violent and rapid the whole thing was.
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It seems like 'rapid onset' is the consensus here for why ATC might have never heard anything unusual from this crew.

Wow - and to think it can all happen just that quickly. Scary stuff.

I'm anxious to learn the actual causality. From my reading of history, the NTSB sometimes never finds out exactly and ends up having to make their best educated [analyzed] guess.

I'm hopeful that this will not be one of those scenarios.

Thanks, Z.
 
Scandinavian13 said:
Sometimes, people should just keep their mouths shut if they don't know what they're talking about...

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/article/ALeqM5h6MCrWgt5QTAImBhMb85LPhYzQfQD96B18FG0

I would say I can't believe someone would be so ignorant to write an article like that, but I've seen too many aviation stories covered by non-aviation presses.
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Capt. Caucasian said:
Remarkably, I didn't find it that bad. There are some good quotes in it.
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Yeah I'm not sure what do think about this article. It seems to suggest that your life is in danger with young regional pilots but then retracts. Regardless, everything seems quite true other than a few misinterpretations. I think my biggest problem that I have with this article is that it seems quite pointless. But I do like how it shines the light on the misconceptions people have on pilots now a-days, such as the QOL and pay for regional pilots. I loved this quote, ""You won't make a livable income until you get in the left (captain's) seat," Smith said. "Pilots accept this as part of the game, and the companies do it because they can.""
 
I still can't believe this terrible news. I used to live 2 miles from the crash site. I went to school with the daughter of the house that was hit by the plane. Just terrible to see this happen, especially to this community. Waking up and seeing eyewitness accounts from friends is unreal. RIP, my prayers go out to all involved.
 
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