NYPD chases helicopter that picked up passengers in Brooklyn vacant lot

[Oxman]

NYPD chases helicopter that picked up passengers in Brooklyn vacant lot

A helicopter made an unexpected, unauthorized landing Thursday in a vacant lot in Brooklyn, picked up two passengers, and flew off to New Jersey with police in pursuit, authorities and witnesses sa…

www.nydailynews.com

A helicopter made an unexpected, unauthorized landing Thursday in a vacant lot in Brooklyn, picked up two passengers, and flew off to New Jersey with police in pursuit, authorities and witnesses said.
The chopper landed at the corner of Carroll St. and Troy Ave. in Crown Heights around 1:30 p.m.

A woman living nearby said she saw the helicopter take off and land twice — and the second time, she saw someone get out briefly.
Added her husband: “It was something else — not something you see every day.”

When the chopper departed the neighborhood, an NYPD Aviation Unit helicopter gave chase.

Police followed the chopper to Lakewood Township Municipal Airport, and met with the pilot after it landed.

The pilot told police he didn’t know that he couldn’t land on a city street or a vacant lot, police sources said.
The chopper pilot had a “cordial” conversation with the NYPD officers after landing, said Kevin McKenzie, the on-site manager at Lakewood Municipal Airport.

“It was people speaking, and they each went their separate way,” he said. “That helicopter left, and the police helicopter left, and they went north.”
He said the helicopter was an R66 Robinson based in New York.

The Federal Aviation Administration is investigating the incident, police sources said.
The air traffic control tower at Kennedy Airport told police the helicopter had permission to be in the area, sources said.
McKenzie said the chopper pilot undoubtedly knew the rules about where he could land in New York City.
“Rules and regulations, they drill it in your head. You have to know it when you pass your test,” McKenzie said. “You break the rules, someone’s going to find you.”

 

[moxiepilot]

That’s 500 feet and unpopulated there, right?

 

[NovemberEcho]

I was actually on Kennedy tower freq flying along the shoreline when this guy called up asking if it’s ok. He told tower he’d be just outside the bravo surface area so tower told him they don’t care.

 

[MikeD]

That’s 500 feet and unpopulated there, right?

I was actually on Kennedy tower freq when this guy called up asking if it’s ok. He told tower he’d be just outside the bravo surface area so tower told him they don’t care.

Agreed. Surface area outside of tower’s airspace, I would also think they wouldn’t care. And under 14 CFR 91.119(d)(1), helicopters have no altitude restrictions provided there are no other prescribed altitude restrictions from the FAA. Insofar as landing, unless there’s some city ordnance prohibiting it due to not being a prescribed helicopter alighting area, I’m not sure the specific rule being broken besides being a very unusual event to see.

 

[Minuteman]

Paranoid me thinks this was totally-not-explicitly sponsored by one of the air taxi companies looking to disrupt a regulated market.

 

[NovemberEcho]

Agreed. Surface area outside of tower’s airspace, I would also think they wouldn’t care. And under 14 CFR 91.119(d)(1), helicopters have no altitude restrictions provided there are no other prescribed altitude restrictions from the FAA. Insofar as landing, unless there’s some city ordnance prohibiting it due to not being a prescribed helicopter alighting area, I’m not sure the specific rule being broken besides being a very unusual event to see.

I think NYC banned all non-authorized (ie pd/fd) helicopter landings inside the city other than certain areas after the Pan Am crash, but I might be mistaken and that just applies to rooftops

 

[MikeD]

I think NYC banned all non-authorized (ie pd/fd) helicopter landings inside the city other than certain areas after the Pan Am crash, but I might be mistaken and that just applies to rooftops

if that’s the case, City ordnance, then that is potentially what could jam this pilot up. But nothing from the FAA that I could think of offhand based on what has been described/reported.

And if the former is the case, then interesting the NYPD helo merely made contact and seemingly released the pilot (unknown if a citation or not). I’m thinking the PD helo mainly wanted to see if there was anything nefarious based on the unusual circumstance; when found that there wasn’t, then if there’s a city ordnance at play, it might become an officer discretion on how to go about with that

Paranoid me thinks this was totally-not-explicitly sponsored by one of the air taxi companies looking to disrupt a regulated market.

that’s not an entirely paranoid possibility. Wouldn’t put it past one of those places.

 

[inigo88]

To expand on what Mike said, people can and do land helicopters off airport at their own house, friend’s houses and properties, etc. fairly frequently. Barring a specific municipal code or city ordinance (of which I’m sure there are many around the country) this should be perfectly legal IF you are the property owner or have the owner permission.

I’m sure the sticking points in the NYC case are going to be city ordinances and whether they had the permission of whoever owns that vacant lot (which they probably didn’t). But as Mike said those are citations, not arrests.

Examples:

Im definitely jealous, helicopter pilots have all the fun!

 

[Richman]

The post 9/11 media (social and otherwise) has people wound so tight that the slightest thing outside their little bubble sends them into an absolute panic.

I’d hate to see what happens if something bad really happened…oh, wait, where’d all the toilet paper go?

 

[knot4u]

If I recall correctly many government agencies (PD, ICE, FBI, CIA, CBP) work under a different set of rules, although they seem to follow the FARs most of the time out of courtesy to anyone else airborne they're not bound by them?

 

[MikeD]

If I recall correctly many government agencies (PD, ICE, FBI, CIA, CBP) work under a different set of rules, although they seem to follow the FARs most of the time out of courtesy to anyone else airborne they're not bound by them?

Many are operated under public use provisions and not under the oversight of the FAA.

 

[dustoff17]

Many are operated under public use provisions and not under the oversight of the FAA.

Which saved me one dark night BTW……..

 

[A Life Aloft]

I think NYC banned all non-authorized (ie pd/fd) helicopter landings inside the city other than certain areas after the Pan Am crash, but I might be mistaken and that just applies to rooftops

We could both be wrong, but I remember it as just roof top helipads as well.

 

[knot4u]

We could both be wrong, but I remember it as just roof top helipads as well.

I don't know about NYC but sometimes after working the second shift at a KBUR FBO I'd accompany some of the helicopters landing on the tall buildings in downtown LA to pick up checks. It was awesome.

 

[Baronman]

I don't know about NYC but sometimes after working the second shift at a KBUR FBO I'd accompany some of the helicopters landing on the tall buildings in downtown LA to pick up checks. It was awesome.

Manhattan has a number of heliports along the rivers. Can’t say I’ve seen many choppers landing on rooftops… and can’t say I’ve seen many choppers landing in the outer boroughs aside from landing at a school soccer field.

 

[knot4u]

Manhattan has a number of heliports along the rivers. Can’t say I’ve seen many choppers landing on rooftops… and can’t say I’ve seen many choppers landing in the outer boroughs aside from landing at a school soccer field.

I'm not a huge fan of heights (odd thing for someone who has a pilots cert to say) and in the air I had no issues, sitting on top of the buildings in downtown LA in the middle of the night was a bit nerve wracking, especially when the pilot would jump out and start throwing bags. Once we got airborne again I was fine until we landed on the next building. I wouldn't trade the experiences of my youth for anything, sad, good, exhilarating, and humbling. It was all worth it.

 

[NovemberEcho]

No rooftop helipads in NYC since this

5 KILLED AS GOPTER ON PAN AM BUILDING THROWS ROTOR BLADE (Published 1977)

5 killed and 7 critically hurt as NY Airways helicopter landing gear collapses during passenger embarkation at heliport atop Pon Am Bldg, NYC; 5th victim is Madison Av pedestrian struck by pieces of rotor blade; witnesses describe accident; scene described; criticisms over safety of Pan Am...

www.nytimes.com

 

[mrivc211]

I think NYC banned all non-authorized (ie pd/fd) helicopter landings inside the city other than certain areas after the Pan Am crash, but I might be mistaken and that just applies to rooftops

That’s what I was guessing but didn’t know for sure

 

[CFI A&P]

To expand on what Mike said, people can and do land helicopters off airport at their own house, friend’s houses and properties, etc. fairly frequently. Barring a specific municipal code or city ordinance (of which I’m sure there are many around the country) this should be perfectly legal IF you are the property owner or have the owner permission.

I’m sure the sticking points in the NYC case are going to be city ordinances and whether they had the permission of whoever owns that vacant lot (which they probably didn’t). But as Mike said those are citations, not arrests.

Examples:

Im definitely jealous, helicopter pilots have all the fun!

Bingo. Off airport operations are popular with helicopters, seaplanes, bush flying, etc. There is a reason Part 91 doesn't specify that helicopters must operate from helipads, airplanes must operate from runways, etc... How many HEMS operations occur on roads and fields? I have a friend that has landed a helicopter in the parking lot of a very popular strip club, with permission. No harm, no foul.

As others have said, it may get sticky if there is a local ordinance prohibiting it.

 

[MikeD]

I land all the time on random roads and in random places. Standard ops, just not what people are always used to seeing.