Jumpseat Fun

[kilo]

Just ask the gate agent to run you in CASS. When they do that it should print out a jumpseat pass form saying FLT DESK ACCESS AWARDED that should at least get them to let you go ask the crew. A page reference in the FOM would not be very useful to give to the gate agents, since they don't have a copy of their own, but the reference there definitely says "United Express Pilots and Dispatchers," and you are authorized to ride in the cockpit jumpseat. Once or twice Express pilots have seemed surprised that I'm allowed to ride up front but seeing the CASS form has satisfied them. It sounds to me like the gate agents who have told you that you can't ride up front are assuming that only pilots are in CASS (which is a fairly common assumption, even among pilots) because non-CASS pilots and dispatchers do have to occupy a seat in the main cabin. Attached is a copy of the form in question (with personal information removed) so people can see what it looks like.

This sounds plausible. But I always refer to CASS when I begin talking to gate agents about requesting the seat. "Hi im so and so, and I'm a dispatcher for small-plane airlines. I'm in CASS and would like to request the jumpseat." Then again, on one occasion, the gate agent (one that was actually trying to help me) kept printing off standby tickets but not cockpit access tickets, which left us both puzzled. Then some low-level supervisor came around and said that dispatchers aren't allowed, because that was an easy answer that solved his problem without spending any brainwaves. (I wanted to tell him he should consider working in middle-management at a regional airline.) Looking back, it sounds like the agent may have skipped the whole CASS thing entirely, either accidentally or ignorantly. I bit the bullet on leaving the terminal to go to another airline elsewhere in the airport.

The FOM thing is usually brought up by whatever United calls their "Red-Coats," as Delta calls them. They go behind the counter and take over the computer after being hailed via walkie-talkie by the confused gate agent, spend a few minutes hunting for something, and then tell me to f@k off because im wrong, in so many words. Anyways, for the most part I have given up on jumpseating with United mainline. I have found that I can save myself from all of the mental gymnastics of trying to explain myself to their gate agents by riding with airlines that invest more in their above-wing personnel.

 

[manniax]

I have found that I can save myself from all of the mental gymnastics of trying to explain myself to their gate agents by riding with airlines that invest more in their above-wing personnel.

That situation you described with the red coats is actually very similar to what I encountered in Maui, which started off this thread. Gate agent hadn't heard of offline dispatchers jumpseating, supervisor she called on the radio said it needed to be authorized by dispatch - so that's when I left, got the HA dispatch number, called them and verified that no, I didn't need authorization, went to a different gate to get my CASS thing done, and then went back to the original gate agent with a name of the person from dispatch I'd talked to along with my CASS authorization. It was much more of a pain than it should have been, but I did get a seat. It sucks that we sometimes have to put so much effort into the process, but you have an idea now what to do if you ever need to jump on United again. And FWIW, I've had issues with gate agents from many different airlines who don't know that other airlines' dispatchers are allowed to jumpseat, not just Hawaiian (or United, in your case.)

 

[BayouMLU]

This sounds plausible. But I always refer to CASS when I begin talking to gate agents about requesting the seat. "Hi im so and so, and I'm a dispatcher for small-plane airlines. I'm in CASS and would like to request the jumpseat." .

Here's your issue. You gave them too much information. You simply walk to the gate agent, show them your badge and ask that you be listed for the jumpseat. Point out your employee number and they go straight to CASS.

I worked in ground ops for well over a decade and I had no idea dispatchers could ride in the cockpit. Even in GSC training over the years, you're quizzed on who has cockpit access and jumpseat never came up that I recall. It's just not something that's really promoted or common.



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[PHL_Approach]

I credit @manniax for posting years ago on here soon after I got my first Dispatch gig that if you ever receive flak from an agent just say "I'm in CASS" and if they are insistent on you not being able to Jumpseat just keep repeating "I'm in CASS". That short statement has worked wonders for me over the last 5+ years.

 

[kilo]

Here's your issue. You gave them too much information. You simply walk to the gate agent, show them your badge and ask that you be listed for the jumpseat. Point out your employee number and they go straight to CASS.

I worked in ground ops for well over a decade and I had no idea dispatchers could ride in the cockpit. Even in GSC training over the years, you're quizzed on who has cockpit access and jumpseat never came up that I recall. It's just not something that's really promoted or common.



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I mean, maybe....but I doubt that would solve any of these actual scenarios. The information they need is presented to them without convolution. I do the same thing with every airline that I ask for jumpseat access. United mainline is the only airline that has ever failed to at least put me on the list for the seat, and they do so with regularity. That's why I asked the forum if there was any truth to the idea that this was an FOM issue with UA and any UAX carriers. It seemed too consistent and too specific to one airline to be a series of flukes. But I guess it is.

 

[manniax]

I credit @manniax for posting years ago on here soon after I got my first Dispatch gig that if you ever receive flak from an agent just say "I'm in CASS" and if they are insistent on you not being able to Jumpseat just keep repeating "I'm in CASS". That short statement has worked wonders for me over the last 5+ years.

Thanks for the shout out (and Lord knows I am a strong advocate for dispatchers being able to jumpseat OAL) but I think that it was @belgiumania who posted that advice.

http://forums.jetcareers.com/threads/dispatcher-jumpseating-diaries.161675/#post-2029724

 

[PHL_Approach]

Thanks for the shout out (and Lord knows I am a strong advocate for dispatchers being able to jumpseat OAL) but I think that it was @belgiumania who posted that advice.

http://forums.jetcareers.com/threads/dispatcher-jumpseating-diaries.161675/#post-2029724

Shucks I was gonna post a disclaimer that I wasn't positive it was you or not. Drinking has destroyed my memory!

 

[womanpilot73]

I credit @manniax for posting years ago on here soon after I got my first Dispatch gig that if you ever receive flak from an agent just say "I'm in CASS" and if they are insistent on you not being able to Jumpseat just keep repeating "I'm in CASS". That short statement has worked wonders for me over the last 5+ years.

Except in my case with AA. The gate agent actually looked me up, stared at the computer screen that showed me in CASS and still repeated over and over that because I'm not a pilot, I'm not allowed in the cockpit. Lady...do you not see I'm in CASS? Omg...

 

[nyk]

Except in my case with AA. The gate agent actually looked me up, stared at the computer screen that showed me in CASS and still repeated over and over that because I'm not a pilot, I'm not allowed in the cockpit. Lady...do you not see I'm in CASS? Omg...

Haha that's a regular thing when I JS on anyone. I'm a bad stigma for JS.

 

[BruinsFan]

Except in my case with AA. The gate agent actually looked me up, stared at the computer screen that showed me in CASS and still repeated over and over that because I'm not a pilot, I'm not allowed in the cockpit. Lady...do you not see I'm in CASS? Omg...

If you run into this problem on AA....tell the gate agent the reference is F*PSM, then F*69, then F*2...after that one MD will show a note that reads "OA Dispatchers are Eligible for Cockpit Jumpseat under the D6 Program." That should spell it out clearly.

 

[pilotmike327]

What do you guys think of creating a new thread and sticky it for individual airlines jumpseat. For example: where in the FOM it states we can jumpseat, or BruinsFan awesome step by step for gate agents, and tips to avoid as much hassle as possible.

 

[ctab5060X]

If you run into this problem on AA....tell the gate agent the reference is F*PSM, then F*69, then F*2...after that one MD will show a note that reads "OA Dispatchers are Eligible for Cockpit Jumpseat under the D6 Program." That should spell it out clearly.

If you get past the AAgent and the Captain has issues, the references are as follows:

Flight Manual Part I -

15.3.3
Mentions diapatchers in the first sentence. There is also a paragraph that covers CASS Approved Flightdeck Jumpseat travel.

15.3.4 F.
The entire section is devoted to pilots and dispatchers of other airlines.

15.3.5

Priority list. Second page specifically lists diapatchers of CASS approved airlines.

 

[pljenkins]

What do you guys think of creating a new thread and sticky it for individual airlines jumpseat. For example: where in the FOM it states we can jumpseat, or BruinsFan awesome step by step for gate agents, and tips to avoid as much hassle as possible.

+1

 

[Mainline_or_bust]

I find it helps to keep my jumpseat authorization from the previous flight handy. I fly from an outstation to DTW and then to MBS on Delta and on the way back I go from MBS to ORD to said outstation. In the outstations they know my face at this point and do not question it, even TSA lets me use the crew line because I have told them enough times that the FAR for Jumpseat states that any jumpseater is part of the crew... and yes I am in uniform because no company requires a pilots uniform to sit in the OCC.

However I can't tell you how many times proof that I just jumpseated on a plane to get to DTW or ORD is enough to get the Gate Agent to give CASS a try in the unlikely event that I'm not lying and can really jumpseat. Its always their surprised reaction and my "I told you so..." look.

 

[747Dispatcher]

Skywest Gate agent: Sir, are you a pilot ?
Me : No, i am a dispatcher with ( )
Skywest Gate agent: you can't jump seat if you are not with us
Me: yes i can, I've been jump-seating with you every week for the last 3 months
Skywest Gate agent: i find that hard to believe
Me: ok , get that jump seat request form , great , now look at the back of it - priority of boarding
look at # 7 (other airline dispatchers) !!!
Skywest Gate agent: hmmmm , let me call my supervisor
Me ( head bang on the wall)

 

[dispatchguy]

For JSing on AAL, I have never had a problem because I can tell the agent my boarding priority, D6U. When you create the listing thru the online tool it knows what your correct priority is, but it helps things with the agents somehow.

 

[manniax]

For JSing on AAL, I have never had a problem because I can tell the agent my boarding priority, D6U. When you create the listing thru the online tool it knows what your correct priority is, but it helps things with the agents somehow.

Good information to know, thanks. Having to be pre-listed for the jumpseat at AAL has kind of discouraged me from using them, since they are usually a "backup" airline for me. I know it's not hard to do, but it can be a pain to get it done while running from one terminal to another. I'll keep this in mind if I ever do end up needing to fly with them though.

 

[757Geek]

Maybe I just too much time on my hands, but I always go to the front ticket counter and ask to be listed for the jumpseat pre-TSA (which means I don't have to put up with all of the usual questions and explaining myself to a supervisor) and just make sure that the gate agent is showing me in the system. Works really well for me.

 

[Luigi]

Maybe I just too much time on my hands, but I always go to the front ticket counter and ask to be listed for the jumpseat pre-TSA (which means I don't have to put up with all of the usual questions and explaining myself to a supervisor) and just make sure that the gate agent is showing me in the system. Works really well for me.

I've never had a problem with an AA gate agent. It's always the captain who questions whether I can JS or not.

 

[Socks and sandals]

For that matter, TSA doesn't really seem to know what lines I'm allowed to use. What lines are dispatcher actually allowed to use? Is there anything to do with your airline needing to sign up for precheck in individual airports? I got that from TSA. I told him I'm in CASS and he was going to let me through, but not my wife, which is strange because they usually allow me to escort.