Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's?
- Thread starter ThatOtherDude
- Start date
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
That is cool. I didn't realize that they did that. I just thought it was a website they put together. Glad to see you, and others, were involved in that committee. Hopefully you'll be back soon enough, and can continue. Best of luck!
That is cool. I didn't realize that they did that. I just thought it was a website they put together. Glad to see you, and others, were involved in that committee. Hopefully you'll be back soon enough, and can continue. Best of luck!
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Here's the problem. They'd do that speech at a university ONCE. Why? B/c they'd be saying things the universities and fast track problems don't want the students to hear. Kinda hard to sell the fast track to an RJ or the "the aviation degree will open doors for you" marketing when someone from the real world is contradicting it. The speaker wouldn't get invited back, and they'd likely tell all the other schools what was up. Kit Darby went around (not anymore since Air Inc. is gone) and pretty much was in lock step with the marketing boys at the schools.
Here's the problem. They'd do that speech at a university ONCE. Why? B/c they'd be saying things the universities and fast track problems don't want the students to hear. Kinda hard to sell the fast track to an RJ or the "the aviation degree will open doors for you" marketing when someone from the real world is contradicting it. The speaker wouldn't get invited back, and they'd likely tell all the other schools what was up. Kit Darby went around (not anymore since Air Inc. is gone) and pretty much was in lock step with the marketing boys at the schools.
flyingmaniac
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Sorry, but banks don't have money anymore. :nana2:
Planning on robbing a bank and getting caught?? What you up to Andy?
Sorry, but banks don't have money anymore. :nana2:
Cactus_Cutter
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9K4BKkLaCI
You guys think too much. Just be happy that most of you have a job and shelter in this economy...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l9K4BKkLaCI
You guys think too much. Just be happy that most of you have a job and shelter in this economy...
DavCo
Well-Known Member
DavCo
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
I don't like this attitude... Yes I am happy to have a job, but I feel bad working for $16/hr. I feel my four year degree and 40k invested in my licenses are worth more and that I am undercutting other pilots by even working for this low low pay. So granted I have a job and blah blah blah, I would make more on unemployment, enough for roof and food, unlike right now. So until pilots stop working for this amount of money, there will be no change in pilot pay.
That being said, I plan on staying at lakes until the economy because living off the government would only make the weight on my conscience heavier... and what else would I do?
I don't like this attitude... Yes I am happy to have a job, but I feel bad working for $16/hr. I feel my four year degree and 40k invested in my licenses are worth more and that I am undercutting other pilots by even working for this low low pay. So granted I have a job and blah blah blah, I would make more on unemployment, enough for roof and food, unlike right now. So until pilots stop working for this amount of money, there will be no change in pilot pay.
That being said, I plan on staying at lakes until the economy because living off the government would only make the weight on my conscience heavier... and what else would I do?
SpiraMirabilis
Possible Subversive
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
DavCo -- whats wrong with the GL ground people in GCC? Do they just don't have any training or what? I dunno if you fly into there.
DavCo -- whats wrong with the GL ground people in GCC? Do they just don't have any training or what? I dunno if you fly into there.
DavCo
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
HA, you think they are bad... try RKS. But I know exactly what you mean...
HA, you think they are bad... try RKS. But I know exactly what you mean...
SpiraMirabilis
Possible Subversive
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
I HAVE tried RKS!!
I still say GCC is the worst though. One of our Dashes going from GCC-DEN reported severe vibrations. Plane was written up on the ground. While taking it apart they found a lot of ice on/in the elevator and tail. Hmmm... "Your airplane is free of contaminants and you are free to taxi." Yeah, right. That's seriously dangerous, some of us have taken to doing a post-deice inspection of our own.
I HAVE tried RKS!!
I still say GCC is the worst though. One of our Dashes going from GCC-DEN reported severe vibrations. Plane was written up on the ground. While taking it apart they found a lot of ice on/in the elevator and tail. Hmmm... "Your airplane is free of contaminants and you are free to taxi." Yeah, right. That's seriously dangerous, some of us have taken to doing a post-deice inspection of our own.Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
From the standpoint of someone on the outside (instructing and still a student) looking in, I can see a future for the airlines. As mentioned before, things will hopefully be moving next year. This will be the time that I'll be hitting the regionals. I like to think that I'm fairly competitent and can make a decision that I'll be happy with. Honestly, I'm one of those people that as long as I'm getting paid to sit in the seat, I'm happy. Now I haven't experienced regional life yet, but I can imagine. At the moment I'm sitting here waiting for class, with no students to instruct but stuff I pick up every once in a while, wishing I was at the airlines.....while the people at the airlines wish they were out....
From the standpoint of someone on the outside (instructing and still a student) looking in, I can see a future for the airlines. As mentioned before, things will hopefully be moving next year. This will be the time that I'll be hitting the regionals. I like to think that I'm fairly competitent and can make a decision that I'll be happy with. Honestly, I'm one of those people that as long as I'm getting paid to sit in the seat, I'm happy. Now I haven't experienced regional life yet, but I can imagine. At the moment I'm sitting here waiting for class, with no students to instruct but stuff I pick up every once in a while, wishing I was at the airlines.....while the people at the airlines wish they were out....
DavCo
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Well Crism, I am willing to bet you are single and can live on a limited salary, commute whenever where ever, and pretty much do what you want. But you have to look at this from another perspective. People make it to the airlines and build up seniority and start living lives (i.e. get married, kids, dog, fish etc...) and then poof, it hits the fan. There life is flipped upside down. I don't think its a matter of not wanting to fly but a better QOL to fly professionally. And its the guys like us, single and young, that allows the airlines to pull the crap that they do...
Well Crism, I am willing to bet you are single and can live on a limited salary, commute whenever where ever, and pretty much do what you want. But you have to look at this from another perspective. People make it to the airlines and build up seniority and start living lives (i.e. get married, kids, dog, fish etc...) and then poof, it hits the fan. There life is flipped upside down. I don't think its a matter of not wanting to fly but a better QOL to fly professionally. And its the guys like us, single and young, that allows the airlines to pull the crap that they do...
Airdale
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Good attitude for the internet world, but it won't do anything for you in the real world. In the real world, people who are "just happy" to be sitting fat dumb and happy in the cockpit are the same people who don't understand why cut throat salaries and non-union airlines destroy the very career they are fat dumb and happy with.
These is a classification of people who for the most part, couldn't give two pennies as to the state of the industry and ignore the reality that the ship is sinking around them. That entire industry continues to cycle down like a turd in a toilet bowl. These less than genetically stellar folks blindly handing places like Gulfstream $25,000 to be fat dumb and happy in an airliner are a bacterial fungus on the lifeline to the quality of life we have in our career.
As long as people continue to have the fat dumb and happy attitudes, we will continue to be pushed into the realm of burger king workers wearing pretty uniforms and pushing cool buttons. Don't take this information the wrong way. I'm not implying you are less than genetically stellar, but I do offer this advice - better check that "happy to be getting paid cuz I fly" attitude. You are a well trained and educated aviator, you should *deserve* a respectable wage, not just be *happy* to get a check. There are business suit wearing lifeless maggots who love nothing more than to hear their employees making those remarks. If only I was smarter and opted out on this flying career and went into business. The best airline job in the world is the guy running the company, because he knows there are plenty of happy-go-lucky pilots that would pay him for a chance to fly a shiney jet, thus giving him all the bargaining power in the world to rape the pensions, the salaries and the benefits from his workers. Gulfstream is the best business plan I think I've ever seen in this industry. I mean..really...why PAY 2 pilots, when you can pay 1 and have the other one PAY you!!! Terriffic!!!! :cwm27:
Good attitude for the internet world, but it won't do anything for you in the real world. In the real world, people who are "just happy" to be sitting fat dumb and happy in the cockpit are the same people who don't understand why cut throat salaries and non-union airlines destroy the very career they are fat dumb and happy with.
These is a classification of people who for the most part, couldn't give two pennies as to the state of the industry and ignore the reality that the ship is sinking around them. That entire industry continues to cycle down like a turd in a toilet bowl. These less than genetically stellar folks blindly handing places like Gulfstream $25,000 to be fat dumb and happy in an airliner are a bacterial fungus on the lifeline to the quality of life we have in our career.
As long as people continue to have the fat dumb and happy attitudes, we will continue to be pushed into the realm of burger king workers wearing pretty uniforms and pushing cool buttons. Don't take this information the wrong way. I'm not implying you are less than genetically stellar, but I do offer this advice - better check that "happy to be getting paid cuz I fly" attitude. You are a well trained and educated aviator, you should *deserve* a respectable wage, not just be *happy* to get a check. There are business suit wearing lifeless maggots who love nothing more than to hear their employees making those remarks. If only I was smarter and opted out on this flying career and went into business. The best airline job in the world is the guy running the company, because he knows there are plenty of happy-go-lucky pilots that would pay him for a chance to fly a shiney jet, thus giving him all the bargaining power in the world to rape the pensions, the salaries and the benefits from his workers. Gulfstream is the best business plan I think I've ever seen in this industry. I mean..really...why PAY 2 pilots, when you can pay 1 and have the other one PAY you!!! Terriffic!!!! :cwm27:
jynxyjoe
Queso King
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
News to me. You guys are the only one?
Mesaba still has 0 furloughs to my knowledge, and 0 downgrades. Maybe some other folks can chime in at their respective airlines. To my knowledge we are also resuming hiring in late '09. First year pay will be just over $25 (+$30 an hour second year) an hour after the DOS in dec. I thought I heard eagle was going to start up too as well as republic. Doesn't republic have growth in the future as well with the Midwest stuff? Pinnacle is also a vaild option, I would think, unless maybe you are worried about a merged list.
Anyhow, just wanted to make the point that if you aren't happy at Colgan there are lots of other companies out there. If you like the bases at Colgan, though, I understand staying. Certainly I think there is a valid argument that Colgan's contract will improve enough to keep your loyalty, Seggy is one of those guys that gets what he wants 95% of the time somehow.
Personally I still think the new Q's will goto Pinnacle as contract sugar. That is not a rumor, just a cynical thought about pcl holdings and how they abuse you guys.
News to me. You guys are the only one?
Mesaba still has 0 furloughs to my knowledge, and 0 downgrades. Maybe some other folks can chime in at their respective airlines. To my knowledge we are also resuming hiring in late '09. First year pay will be just over $25 (+$30 an hour second year) an hour after the DOS in dec. I thought I heard eagle was going to start up too as well as republic. Doesn't republic have growth in the future as well with the Midwest stuff? Pinnacle is also a vaild option, I would think, unless maybe you are worried about a merged list.
Anyhow, just wanted to make the point that if you aren't happy at Colgan there are lots of other companies out there. If you like the bases at Colgan, though, I understand staying. Certainly I think there is a valid argument that Colgan's contract will improve enough to keep your loyalty, Seggy is one of those guys that gets what he wants 95% of the time somehow.
Personally I still think the new Q's will goto Pinnacle as contract sugar. That is not a rumor, just a cynical thought about pcl holdings and how they abuse you guys.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Don't worry. The way personal wealth is collapsing, the rich kid who got in "just to fly" and his parents won't be sending them off to burger king air any time soon. The only way this pilot shortage gets avoided now is if the FAA takes away hour requirements from a comm. license.
Don't worry. The way personal wealth is collapsing, the rich kid who got in "just to fly" and his parents won't be sending them off to burger king air any time soon. The only way this pilot shortage gets avoided now is if the FAA takes away hour requirements from a comm. license.
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Take a look at the part you bolded. I said we were ONE OF the only airlines.
Well I heard Eagle was going to furlough. I heard this, I heard that. No one knows if you will be hiring next year. Are you guys bringing more aircraft onto the property? I read the threads too about other regionals with DL or NW painted on the side of their planes, and I feel for you guys doing the shuffle on who will be the next owner of new RJs.
We have firm orders for new Qs next year, as well as a place already to put them. Its isnt a rumor, its a fact. If it falls through for some reason then I have a feeling Ill have to worry about something other than movement in a company.
Things will get better once the union builds up more speed. The crash put a damper on the focus. I talk to Seggy all the time, and there is alot going on behind the scene thats going to make this place better.
Take a look at the part you bolded. I said we were ONE OF the only airlines.
Well I heard Eagle was going to furlough. I heard this, I heard that. No one knows if you will be hiring next year. Are you guys bringing more aircraft onto the property? I read the threads too about other regionals with DL or NW painted on the side of their planes, and I feel for you guys doing the shuffle on who will be the next owner of new RJs.
We have firm orders for new Qs next year, as well as a place already to put them. Its isnt a rumor, its a fact. If it falls through for some reason then I have a feeling Ill have to worry about something other than movement in a company.
Things will get better once the union builds up more speed. The crash put a damper on the focus. I talk to Seggy all the time, and there is alot going on behind the scene thats going to make this place better.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
Yeah you said you were the only one with growth and one of the few not furloughing. I think i stated in there pretty clear u weren't the only ones with growth. Maybe I should have reversed the order of that paragraph so it makes more sense.
I pity you as much as you pity us i suppose when it comes to the aircraft shuffle. Your holding is pinnacle ours is delta. Neither has a good history. Contracts take a while, and while I'm sure there is "plenty going on behind the scene", that behind the scene stuff is easy. It's the stuff at the table that takes 90% of your time. What is the old saying? 90% of the work takes 10% of the time and 10% of the work takes 90% of the time.
Does anyone know at your company "know" you are hiring? I mean my company thinks they are starting up hiring, so does yours. Has Colgan started up classes or something. I hope my post made clear I wanted OTHERS to chime in. I'm at mesaba so i can barely speak intelligibly about that, I thought republic and eagle were on their way to hiring. Mistakes is. Hoe jets too *shiver*.
Yeah you said you were the only one with growth and one of the few not furloughing. I think i stated in there pretty clear u weren't the only ones with growth. Maybe I should have reversed the order of that paragraph so it makes more sense.
I pity you as much as you pity us i suppose when it comes to the aircraft shuffle. Your holding is pinnacle ours is delta. Neither has a good history. Contracts take a while, and while I'm sure there is "plenty going on behind the scene", that behind the scene stuff is easy. It's the stuff at the table that takes 90% of your time. What is the old saying? 90% of the work takes 10% of the time and 10% of the work takes 90% of the time.
Does anyone know at your company "know" you are hiring? I mean my company thinks they are starting up hiring, so does yours. Has Colgan started up classes or something. I hope my post made clear I wanted OTHERS to chime in. I'm at mesaba so i can barely speak intelligibly about that, I thought republic and eagle were on their way to hiring. Mistakes is. Hoe jets too *shiver*.
ready2fly
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
FWIW: Eagle (so far) has had 0 furloughs and 0 downgrades. We did have displacements so that's not a positive thing. However, it does seem that our company has gone out of its way not to furlough. Let's hope that continues.
FWIW: Eagle (so far) has had 0 furloughs and 0 downgrades. We did have displacements so that's not a positive thing. However, it does seem that our company has gone out of its way not to furlough. Let's hope that continues.
v1valarob
Well-Known Member
Re: Is there light at end of the tunnel for us regional FO's
My post was merely pointing to the original poster that if he is stuck at any airline at the bottom of the barrel, Colgan might be the only place where movement or even upgrade is within site. If it wasnt for the new Qs coming on, my decision on wether or not I feel like weathering this storm would be already made.
As for Eagle running classes, Im just looking at the recent displacement thread in which today someone mentioned that displacements were on hold and possible furloughs instead due to decrease in flying.
My post was merely pointing to the original poster that if he is stuck at any airline at the bottom of the barrel, Colgan might be the only place where movement or even upgrade is within site. If it wasnt for the new Qs coming on, my decision on wether or not I feel like weathering this storm would be already made.
As for Eagle running classes, Im just looking at the recent displacement thread in which today someone mentioned that displacements were on hold and possible furloughs instead due to decrease in flying.