Any rumors of PUBNAT 8?

bippoptl said:
I know everyone thinks I'm being a jerk, but it's Good that they are finally washing more people out and making the screening process harder. There are literally hundreds of trainees that have failed out at the facilities and now the FAA is trying to place them in other Easier places. Hopefully this cuts Down on the facility washouts.
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Yep. When it comes to training, I've never heard a controller, young or old, say "You know, I wish they would send us more people from OKC. There just aren't enough passing." Seems to be one of the few things that nearly everyone agrees on. Course, it's never a pleasant moment when someone gets cut -- a friend of mine failed his second PV just this week -- but it happens. Have a drink with them, let them feel bad about it for a bit, and move on.

Along with being safer and less expensive in the long run for the FAA to make sure the standard's in the right place at the Academy, it'd be easier on the people who won't cut it as well. If that's something I've got to face, I'd much rather find out after three or four months than a few years.
 
queeno said:
yea you may be smarter than me but i was somthing youll never be , and air traffic controller and a retired one at that.
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NEVER is a pretty powerful word. You nothing about me Queeno. I can guarantee you my resolve and determination to become an Air Traffic Controller will not stop until one of either two things happen. Either I turn 31 in 10 months, 18 days without a T.O.L.; Or, I get a T.O.L. before April 15th 2011, Actually pass my P.V. this go around, and go on to certify at my facility and SUCCEED. Queeno the odds are TRULY stacked against me. I have no illusions, but I am pursuing every avenue available to me.

Henry Ford was bankrupted 3 times before he successfully invented the model T and went on to create the first mass produced AMERICAN made automobile. There are many more stories like his, I'm only hoping mine will be similar in the same rite. I'm trying to use MY failure to learn something as well as an inspiration to myself. If it doesn't happen for me, then there will not be a shadow of a doubt that I tried as hard as I could. Your words have only added fuel to the fire that burns within me and I'm sure as hell not about to give up now.

Peace.
 
blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah blah , blah blah blah blah blah blah blah,blah blah blah blah blah blah blahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh. iam sorry did you say something ?
 
ATC RET 2003 said:
Don't worry OG, I'm probably the dumbest one of the lot since I came along in the 70's. That seven year's worth of pension payments doesn't make me feel so dumb, though.
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i hear you brother, thank god us stupid people kept the system going long enought for the FFA to finaly hire all these really smart people, just wish i worked smarter.oh well 3 more days till this stupid guy gets paid for doing nothing but enjoying life.

OG
 
Like Queeno or not he's usually right. Doesn't mean his opinion always is ;).

If your waiting to get hired or sitting with your TOL, you just won't get it until your done with OKC and at your facility for awhile. You'll understand where Queeno and Bip are coming from then. OKC is all sorts of stupid... everything boiling down to one day, where someone bad can get lucky and someone good can have a bad day. They were supposed to be changing that earlier this year to a graded over time system.. but the FAA does nothing on time so I doubt that's happening yet. For whatever reason the standards at OKC are MUCH lower today, than back in the 70's and 80's. Any veteran FPL will attest to that. Somewhere around 1/2 used to pass, because they didn't want to waste time on trainees who "might" make it. One of the younger supervisors at the center even said "OKC was such a joke when I was there."

Everyone who hasn't been there yet or who has failed a PV needs to stop taking the "OKC is a joke" thing to heart. We just mean the screening process compared to what it used to be. Myself and many others got through on the new system, who knows what we would have done on the old system... I consider myself lucky to have landed this job at the time I did. I'm truly sorry to anyone who has failed their PV, it must be a miserable feeling, and it was tough to see classmates fail.

We have people washing out before even getting a single D side, probably should not have gotten through OKC, ya think?

As for the CTI, VRA, OTS battle. VRA's are the only ones with actual experience... but trainers seem to agree they are the toughest to train because of their attitudes and the need to "untrain them." I've seen some real dumbasses get through who are CTI's.. and some very smart OTS flying through training. An area in my center has had 7 deals in the past year, 3 or 4 of those are from the same VRA... it really does not matter which way you get in. What matters is how smart you are.

Not that the AT-SAT is the best tool, but I'm taking the OTS with a 97 over the CTI with an 82 EVERY TIME. Let's face it... the OTS is 99/100 times a smarter person with a better chance to succeed than the CTI student. The CTI student only gets hired because the FAA is bound to hire a certain amount of CTI's from their total hirings.

Good luck to anyone who is in OKC or waiting to go. It is a wonderful opportunity. But please... quit working your panties in a bunch because people actually doing/have done the job say things. Because if you make it to your facility... your going to be surrounded by people like that.
 
You'd think retired controllers would have something better to do with their time than poke fun at us ret@rds who can't seem to pass a PV.

I'm making more money than most controllers who are CPC do now, and my job is a hell of a lot less stressful. So when you go on about your pension payments and yadda yadda, I'm happy for you, but I'm not having to bust my rear to get what you did.

Everything happens for a reason. I think about my PV from time to time, but I don't let it get me down.

On another note..

Rosstafari, when you coming into to town for a beer? LOL
 
Rosstafari said:
Um... I'm gonna have to refer you to HR for that one, boss. That, or when JetBlue starts flying there, which at last check was never.

Keep it on ice for me, homes.
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You got it. I'll overnight it to you on ice.. Sound good? Oh wait, Texas beer is better than the stuff we have here anyways.

Next time I'm down that way I'll send you a PM.
 
swinte00 said:
You'd think retired controllers would have something better to do with their time than poke fun at us ret@rds who can't seem to pass a PV.

I'm making more money than most controllers who are CPC do now, and my job is a hell of a lot less stressful. So when you go on about your pension payments and yadda yadda, I'm happy for you, but I'm not having to bust my rear to get what you did.

Everything happens for a reason. I think about my PV from time to time, but I don't let it get me down.

On another note..

Rosstafari, when you coming into to town for a beer? LOL
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did someone just flush the toilet??????
 
Everybody done here? I'd expect people my age to be having a little pissing match.

Get hired by the FAA, and get on. If you dont, continue to get on. The FAA isnt everything, being a controller isnt everything. People have and will continue to find happiness is other venues outside of their predisposed plans. If you cant, seriously evaluate your priorities in life.
 
Just to put my 2 cents into the academy debate...

I know the FAA does say it's something like a 97-98% pass rate but from my experience (my class and sister classes) it was lower than that. I've seen people in my class fail for stuff that was a judgement call on the pass / fail line and heard of other classes having students pass that should have been a guaranteed fail. When I was there, I would say the pass rate was about 80%. The thing I think that sucks about the current process is the PV examiners are stupervisors who some have never controlled traffic, don't have the ability to control traffic, and never will control traffic... yet they are there to examine it. That really sucks. Let's say you get one of these people with a boner for failing people, that will really skew a PV. That's why they give you that 2nd chance graded by academy instructors, who are more familiar with the process. I know it's entirely possible for people who were at the top of their class let their nerves get the best of them and run consecutive bad problems and fail their PV and retake. I truly feel bad for those people, as I know they are out there. Then there are people at the bottom who stink up the place and have a fluke of a PV and pass. I saw people like that too. Then they go on to their facility to wash out. I think a progressive grading system would be better. Ultimately, however, if you do not pass the PV at the academy, you will not do well at the facility as it is not that hard.

I also do have a lot of respect for the people that passed "back in the day." I know it definitely was a lot harder than it is now. I've heard the horror stories of the old "Screen," which is what my senior instructors called it. One instructor told me first day of class they were told look around you... less than 50% of the people around you will leave with jobs, and that was the truth. Although that system may not have been fair, I know for damn sure they found the best people that way. Props to anyone who went through that system successfully. I think I would have had the drive and determination to make it through that system, as I have lived and breathed aviation my whole life and this is what I have wanted for a long time. Failure just would not have been an option for me. Does the current system do a good job of finding people with intense drive and determination needed for the job? I think not. I've seen plenty of people at facilities that don't know the difference between a Cessna and a 747 that applied just to apply make it through the academy. Those are the people that really struggle.
 
Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaanyway...

What's that I heard about geoprefs coming out in June? Did that happen? Anyone get them? Still waiting?
 
Yeah by that, they meant never.

If people are still serious about entering the field, your best shot is CTI, stop holding out for OTS.

I'm kinda glad this all worked out the way it did, because now i'm going to be going back to school to get at least my BS.
 
I think that OTS is getting a bad rap personally. While I'm not disagreeing that CTI increases your chances of getting selected, OTS have in the past and still will be selected, at least through PUBNAT 8. Maybe at smaller numbers, but it will happen. Whether or not there will be PUBNAT's in the future is a question (and a totally different topic). I have my B.S. in Aviation Management (Magna Cum Laude) and I have 4 personal friends, 3 that were former room mates in college that were selected OTS and all are well on their way to becoming a CPC at various level facilities.

To write off OTS would be an ignorant mistake by the FAA in my opinion. I'm not discrediting any CTI Programs nor VRA applicants both groups have made sacrifices to pursue those avenues, but there are many qualified OTS candidates that are very capable of becoming a controller.

And since I graduated over 6 months ago; have applied to over 100 jobs both in and out of the aviation industry throughout the country, without getting a single interview, and have student loan companies nipping at my heels, maybe ATC is all I have to currently hang on to. Regardless of the outcome good luck to all OTS, CTI, and VRA during the panels if they ever meet.
 
I got a weird email about that, but for the most part, I have no idea!

Have any of you guys trained this summer?
 
I heard about August 19 geopref on the other website. That's what they were told from OKC, but as with everything, I'll believe it when I get it.
 
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