AIN/Bob Hoover honoring a scab!

pete2800 said:
Meh... You kind of missed why people were upset. I think it was more to do with the fact that Delta tried to sue for the right to use proprietary approaches...
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Meh, why buy the cow when you can get the milk for free. Didn't work, so we just went and built our own approach.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Didn't Delta pull out of Juno to a seasonal-only status? Did Alaska KDA on that one? ;):p
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No, only a fool continues to fly daily service when there's no profit in it.

ferengi_profit_by_aweswanky-d5du6p4.jpg
 
pete2800 said:
Sure, that's all anyone expected DAL to do.

Well, someone continues daily service and has a 25% profit margin while doing so...

:D
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And during the winter months, with two in the market, both would probably lose money. If Delta was truly predatory, they could dump seats in that market and subsidize the loss against more profitable routes.
 
Cptnchia said:
And during the winter months, with two in the market, both would probably lose money. If Delta was truly predatory, they could dump seats in that market and subsidize the loss against more profitable routes.
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For sure.

I'm just kind of a troll.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
No, they are regular dues paying ALPA members. I don't see how anyone would find out you had a scab jumpseat on your plane, unless your CA or you the FO pull out the "list."

And I'd like to see the union rep who refuses to help a pilot if he's called into the CP office because he let a scab jumpseat. That rep should be recalled (fired) for refusing to protect a non-scab, good-standing, dues-paying, regular ALPA member. You have been elected by the people to do a job... so do that job. Or step down and let someone else do it.

I still don't see what legal grounds you would use to deny someone access to protection that they are paying for with their dues as regular good-standing ALPA members.
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I've seen the list pulled out. I've quietly asked the captain, "did you check the scab list?" And, get called into a disciplinary hearing with a union rep, and they sit there quietly, but they were then present at the meeting. That's not denying them anything. Then, they can throw up their hands at the end of the meeting and say "there isn't anything we can do." And all because you decided to help a scab.

You don't get it. You are listening to respond, not to understand here. But go ahead, keep doing what you're doing. I'm sure the guys below you won't mind moving up a number when the union does a "bad" job at defending/helping you. By not denying someone a seat who you know is a scab, you put your integrity, and your whole pilot group and union representation integrity into question.
 
Just curious here, with all the vitriol present, has anyone here actually denied the jumpseat to a scab or is this something we beat our chests about but has little actual practical relevance?

Most of these scabs date back to actions taken back in the 80s, right? Most of these guys have to be nearing retirement age if not already retired.

(Are GoJets guys still treated like scabs?)
 
FlyingAccountant said:
Just curious here, with all the vitriol present, has anyone here actually denied the jumpseat to a scab or is this something we beat our chests about but has little actual practical relevance?

Most of these scabs date back to actions taken back in the 80s, right? Most of these guys have to be nearing retirement age if not already retired.

(Are GoJets guys still treated like scabs?)
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I've made sure a few weren't scabs. Never come across a guy who was a though.
 
av8tr1 said:
So basically you believe everything you read on the internet?

And take no responsibility for your actions because a list from the internet is the gospel?

After all you're "just following orders"
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WTH? The internet? The unions publish the names and info of who flew struck work. ALPA was even sued for libel by some of the EAL scabs who crossed in '89 and the Judge determined that the truth is not libel. The "master list" was compiled from sanctioned lists and the ALPA golden pages. It goes back to the 1930's. The lists were eventually merged. It isn't just "some list off the internet".
 
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Cptnchia said:
You're conjoining two issues. There's the CO scabs, who were forgiven by ALPA, and let back in. They had to pay back dues and are considered members in good standing. Not much you can do about it.

Then there are the other scabs still out there, who haven't been forgiven. Those are the ones we're talking about. And again, it's not a Jumpseat war. That takes a concerted effort by a pilot group. You're describing a one off incident that may effect you personally. You're call but I would never ride a scab's Jumpseat. Hell, I took myself off a flight and waited for a later one when, introducing myself to the captain, discovered it was JC Lawton. That dude can burn in Hell, for all I care.

For the record, I did have to allow a scab to jump once. Dude was an Eastern scab, but was now an FAA ASI. No chance to deny him. Funny thing was, as he was deplaning, here comes another FAA ASI, who was a rEAL, who just about beat the ever loving snot out of him. They had an epic, foul vocabulary laced shouting match on the ramp.
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What if you were a paying passenger in the back? Would you remove yourself from the flight?

And sorry man, I just can't agree with your last couple thoughts. Give the silent treatment, fine, but NOBODY deserves or should have to put up with verbal harassment at work. Scab or not, you harass someone at work you better be willing to pay the consequences, whether it be loss of employment or a lawsuit.
 
MikeOH58 said:
What if you were a paying passenger in the back? Would you remove yourself from the flight?
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I don't pay for airline tickets. If it was a scheduled DH, then I guess I gotta go, unless I can deviate and still make the rotation. Jumping or non rev, you bet I'll get off the flight.


MikeOH58 said:
And sorry man, I just can't agree with your last couple thoughts. Give the silent treatment, fine, but NOBODY deserves or should have to put up with verbal harassment at work. Scab or not, you harass someone at work you better be willing to pay the consequences, whether it be loss of employment or a lawsuit.
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You must have me confused with someone else. I haven't said one word about harassing anyone. What I did do was relate a humorous story of two federal employees, who were former fellow employees, who had a verbal spat. Far be it for me to counsel a government employee in his or her daily conduct. Much like two cat ranchers who get into a kerfuffle in the back. No way in hell am I getting involved in that domestic disturbance.[/QUOTE]
 
Cptnchia said:
I don't pay for airline tickets. If it was a scheduled DH, then I guess I gotta go, unless I can deviate and still make the rotation. Jumping or non rev, you bet I'll get off the flight.




You must have me confused with someone else. I haven't said one word about harassing anyone. What I did do was relate a humorous story of two federal employees, who were former fellow employees, who had a verbal spat. Far be it for me to counsel a government employee in his or her daily conduct. Much like two cat ranchers who get into a kerfuffle in the back. No way in hell am I getting involved in that domestic disturbance.
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[/QUOTE]

Must have read your post wrong, my bad.

But back to he first part, just for the sake of argument suppose you did pay for a ticket. Captain Scabby McScabbet is up front. What do you do?
 

Must have read your post wrong, my bad.

But back to he first part, just for the sake of argument suppose you did pay for a ticket. Captain Scabby McScabbet is up front. What do you do?[/QUOTE]

Irrelevant. I refuse to buy airline tickets. Haven't bought one since 1984.
 
This thread reinforced my desire to never work for a Unionized Airline. I admit, I don’t understand, nor care to understand the Union complexities of an airline. I know when I worked in the construction field, the union workers were some of the laziest people I ever worked around, nevertheless... Seriously, denying your fellow pilot a Jump seat? Never to be forgiven? I know I will be blasted, but I cannot morally accept this system. Were all humans here. Let’s treat each other with the greatest respect. I recently helped a guy who was in prison for over 30 years for a murder of a fellow human being. I shook his hand, he shook mine. We treated each other respectfully. Do I agree what he did? no. Will I argue, discuss my views, and try to persuade my points? yes. Am I going to disrespect, a fellow human because they think or acted differently? Were better than this...
 
Fly_Unity said:
Were all humans here. Let’s treat each other with the greatest respect. I recently helped a guy who was in prison for over 30 years for a murder of a fellow human being. I shook his hand, he shook mine. We treated each other respectfully. Do I agree what he did? no. Will I argue, discuss my views, and try to persuade my points? yes. Am I going to disrespect, a fellow human because they think or acted differently? Were better than this...
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A more accurate analog would be if that individual you helped had murdered your wife while you watched. Would you have that same respect for him?
 
Fly_Unity said:
This thread reinforced my desire to never work for a Unionized Airline. I admit, I don’t understand, nor care to understand the Union complexities of an airline. I know when I worked in the construction field, the union workers were some of the laziest people I ever worked around, nevertheless... Seriously, denying your fellow pilot a Jump seat? Never to be forgiven? I know I will be blasted, but I cannot morally accept this system. Were all humans here. Let’s treat each other with the greatest respect. I recently helped a guy who was in prison for over 30 years for a murder of a fellow human being. I shook his hand, he shook mine. We treated each other respectfully. Do I agree what he did? no. Will I argue, discuss my views, and try to persuade my points? yes. Am I going to disrespect, a fellow human because they think or acted differently? Were better than this...
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Scabs aren't fellow pilots nor human beings. Since you neither understand or care to understand, then having a discussion about it is moot. I'd shake a murderers hand first too, over a scabs.
 
Cptnchia said:
Scabs aren't fellow pilots nor human beings....
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I do not understand this way of thinking. I accept that my viewpoints are different than yours and further discussion is moot, so I will bow out of the thread since I clearly do not "understand" the system.
 
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