Cathay Cadet Program

Just talked to my friend who finished the 3rd interview and offer for the position. He turned it down. He says they took away a lot of the perks and benefits the program used to have. You'll be making barely enough to get by, almost worse than US regional airline pay.
 
You'll be making barely enough to get by, almost worse than US regional airline pay.

Your friend is misinformed. Like I said, year 1 SO will make more than $87k in is first year. Year one FO (3 years after starting) will make more than $130k, given overtimes etc, closer to 155k.

Only a handful of regional captains make more than a year 1 SO. Hardly 'barely getting by', I would say. Factor take home pay (you'll pay <10% tax), year one SO pay equates to earning about US$100 in the US.

The difference between previous terms and these, is that the old scheme paid a larger housing allowance.

In the door at 87k, at the top at 330k. Let's be realistic, guys. Moving to HK isn't everyone's thing, but anyone who pretends that the financial aspect can be topped by the US majors is having a laugh. If you're looking up the ladder at US regionals, and even US majors, financial comparisons aren't the ones to make when considering this scheme.

What you need to be thinking about is moving to HK, and what goes with that, taking your wife/kids etc away from their family and comfort zone, dealing with extremely high training standards, where your SOPs do need to be perfect, as do your callouts, very stressful sim evals etc. Cx are extremely proud of their standards, which are certainly world-leading. Their command course is certainly the most difficult on the planet. They do expect you to be at the very sharp end of the industry, in your operational ability, and professional responsibility on the ground.

These are the things whereby folks should consider whether it is not for them. For a pilot in the US, it sure as hell isn't the money!
 
Good grief this sounds amazing! Fly a nice plane, work for a huge international company... Live in HK which would be fantastic... For now only in my dreams... *sigh*
 
None at all. The CRM models used are highly acclaimed, as are the CRM directors at the company. It is something Cx puts a lot of emphasis on. The crews are a great bunch, very motivated, bright and professional people. I've no doubt that just like any airline, there are the odd one or two who you wouldn't choose to spend 15 hours with, but such is life.

What I will say, is that the operation, from the very beginning, is a very focused and disciplined one. Briefings are punchy, and there is zero loose talk, until up high. This would get heads rolling! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HXpq02y7fPg&feature=feedrec_grec_index

So no, CRM is certainly not a problem here. The flight deck environment is far more formal than most carriers, until you're up top, but I certainly see that as a good thing - let's face it, on a 14 hour flight, you've ample time to sit and chat. The crews are a brilliant bunch, 50+nationalities, and a million and one backgrounds. Flights are extensively monitored with QARs, the CRM models and SOPs are very explicit, and as I said, CRM is a huge part of the Cx philosophy - and has generated very good feedback from line orientated safety audits, conducted by parties from other airlines.

Now, before this modern, touchy-feely world of CRM came about, rumor has it that CRM was an issue - as it was at many carriers. Assuredly, a thing of the (distant) past.
 
Well said Papoo. That reassures me a little bit more. The video just sounds like a crew having a good time. I've jumpseated on some flights and a lot do the same. Great to hear that CX has changed for the better, CRM wise.
 
Good grief this sounds amazing! Fly a nice plane, work for a huge international company... Live in HK which would be fantastic...
This is EXACTLY why the terms and conditions continue to go down the crapper.

Cathay LOVES people like you. Completely uninformed, head in the clouds, SJS to the max. Another cheap warm body to fill the relief seats.

- Fly a nice plane (SJS, check!)
- Work for a huge international company (the kind of company that continues to degrade conditions for employees and rules through intimidation and fear)
- Lin in HK which would be fantastic (fantastic to whomever you're paying rent to. Based on the significantly reduced housing allowance, you'll be committing financial suicide, you'll never be able to afford anything close to a middle class quality of life while there)

Sure, defend it with the idea, "hey i'm young, single, inexperienced, this would be a great place to start my career" -- except one day you won't be so young, likely married and perhaps a kid, and no longer inexperienced....but the terms of your SJS contract will still haunt you years after.

Sorry for the rant, you really need to gain some perspective, it'll save you heaps of grief in the future.
Good luck.
 
This is EXACTLY why the terms and conditions continue to go down the crapper.

Cathay LOVES people like you. Completely uninformed, head in the clouds, SJS to the max. Another cheap warm body to fill the relief seats.

- Fly a nice plane (SJS, check!)
- Work for a huge international company (the kind of company that continues to degrade conditions for employees and rules through intimidation and fear)
- Lin in HK which would be fantastic (fantastic to whomever you're paying rent to. Based on the significantly reduced housing allowance, you'll be committing financial suicide, you'll never be able to afford anything close to a middle class quality of life while there)

Sure, defend it with the idea, "hey i'm young, single, inexperienced, this would be a great place to start my career" -- except one day you won't be so young, likely married and perhaps a kid, and no longer inexperienced....but the terms of your SJS contract will still haunt you years after.

Sorry for the rant, you really need to gain some perspective, it'll save you heaps of grief in the future.
Good luck.

This is true, I was interviewed and the COL is huge. Hold out and let CX be forced to move conditions upwards.
 
This is EXACTLY why the terms and conditions continue to go down the crapper.

Cathay LOVES people like you. Completely uninformed, head in the clouds, SJS to the max. Another cheap warm body to fill the relief seats.

- Fly a nice plane (SJS, check!)
- Work for a huge international company (the kind of company that continues to degrade conditions for employees and rules through intimidation and fear)
- Lin in HK which would be fantastic (fantastic to whomever you're paying rent to. Based on the significantly reduced housing allowance, you'll be committing financial suicide, you'll never be able to afford anything close to a middle class quality of life while there)

Sure, defend it with the idea, "hey i'm young, single, inexperienced, this would be a great place to start my career" -- except one day you won't be so young, likely married and perhaps a kid, and no longer inexperienced....but the terms of your SJS contract will still haunt you years after.

Sorry for the rant, you really need to gain some perspective, it'll save you heaps of grief in the future.
Good luck.

I don't see how 330K is crappy... was it higher in the past?
 
I have some friends that are in Adelaide at this very moment and I talk with them every now and then. Based on what they have told me what they have experienced so far, the program isn't AS BAD as people think it is. However, yes it has changed significantly and it shows from the number of applicants being offered Second Officer positions, and then declining the offers. Out of 8 that interviewed and got offers including my friend, only two took them. This was about a year ago.
 
This is EXACTLY why the terms and conditions continue to go down the crapper.

Cathay LOVES people like you. Completely uninformed, head in the clouds, SJS to the max. Another cheap warm body to fill the relief seats.

- Fly a nice plane (SJS, check!)
- Work for a huge international company (the kind of company that continues to degrade conditions for employees and rules through intimidation and fear)
- Lin in HK which would be fantastic (fantastic to whomever you're paying rent to. Based on the significantly reduced housing allowance, you'll be committing financial suicide, you'll never be able to afford anything close to a middle class quality of life while there)

Sure, defend it with the idea, "hey i'm young, single, inexperienced, this would be a great place to start my career" -- except one day you won't be so young, likely married and perhaps a kid, and no longer inexperienced....but the terms of your SJS contract will still haunt you years after.

Sorry for the rant, you really need to gain some perspective, it'll save you heaps of grief in the future.
Good luck.

SJS? Perspective? Here's some perspective... HK is expensive, but US$87k isn't oh so bad now, is it, not to mention that it's $140k in nigh-on 3 years. Then it's over $200k as a captain, rising to $330k. Let's not even mention overtime, shall we.

18k a year to fly a regional? That's SJS. Have you seen the majors year 1 pay? That's barely better. Pretending that there isn't hugely better alternatives outside the US - that's a lack of perspective.

I know that FAA tests aren't in too focused on mathematics, but I'm astonished that some people try to pretend that money is the issue with this scheme. It's not. It's moving your life to a vastly different part of the world. You tell me, poledriver, which regional I should go to? the one that pays 18k, or the one that pays me 21k? What will I make as a captain? Substantially lower than a year 1 SO at Cx makes?

Yes, I'll concede that the housing allowance used to be greater. As a senior captain, you'd be taking in US$500+. That's great, but market forces dictate everything. What business in their right mind pays you double what they need to? Grow up. Pick on the scheme by all means, but don't for a moment make yourself look even more stupid by pretending it's about money.

Yes, HK is expensive. Rather, rent is expensive. Everything else is cheap, if you know where to look. Vastly cheaper, in fact. Given that year 1 SO take home is over 6k after tax (and a retirement plan which blows any US carrier out of the water), that's 4 times what you'd make at a regional, based in the North East. Don't be so ignorant to pretend that COL is 4 times more. It's far less, with the exception of rent.

I know this, I've lived in HK, London, NYC, LA and Dubai, and I can assure you that rent aside, my living costs FAR less than it did in any of the other places I've lived.

Yes, yes, but what about the people that turn it down? Utter nonsense. There are literally tens of thousands of applicants. I can tell you right now that the only folks to have turned it down, bar about 3, are those who were offered a DESO position back in '08.

Make of that what you will, but please don't harp on about the financial aspect. Harp on about the cultural difference, the pollution, the language barrier, the daunting prospect of moving across the globe, the relentless hustle and bustle of the place, or whatever else doesn't float your boat. But, given that the US airline industry is the biggest disgrace in the world in terms of contract erosion, and the most poorly paid (when compared to the Far East, China, India, Australia, Europe) in the world, I'd suggest you're either misinformed, looking up the wrong tree, or plain ignorant if you're pretending that the money in the US is anything but a fraction of being at Cx.
 
I just applied to the Cathay cadet program and I have a ton of questions:

Does anyone know when they will be conducting interviews in the United States? If I do not get selected for an interview, will I be notified?

I have *gasp* 0 flying hours. I do have an interest in flying though. What are my chances of getting accepted? Has anyone with 0 hours ever been accepted into their program?

Is there anything I can do in the meantime to prepare for a possible interview with CX? I have been studying the company, their business philosophy, their air routes, aircraft, etc. Is there anything else I should look at?

Are there any American pilots at CX? It seems like most of the pilots are Brits or Aussies.

I know some of you on here are complaining about the contract and the pay and the cost of housing in Hong Kong but I guess I have those areas "covered." I was in Hong Kong this past summer and starting dating a girl from there. I plan on getting married to her someday and would like to move to HK. My HK girlfriend is a nurse and makes an ok salary so if I did become a Second Officer with CX, I would have more than enough money to find a place to rent. I am sure I could find a simple apartment in the Mui Woa area of Lantau Island for less than $1,000 USD per month.

Becoming a pilot is my dream job and if I got on with CX, I would be the happiest man on the planet. I guess it's nice to have dreams, right? haha
 
I just applied to the Cathay cadet program and I have a ton of questions:

Does anyone know when they will be conducting interviews in the United States? If I do not get selected for an interview, will I be notified?

I have *gasp* 0 flying hours. I do have an interest in flying though. What are my chances of getting accepted? Has anyone with 0 hours ever been accepted into their program?

Is there anything I can do in the meantime to prepare for a possible interview with CX? I have been studying the company, their business philosophy, their air routes, aircraft, etc. Is there anything else I should look at?

Are there any American pilots at CX? It seems like most of the pilots are Brits or Aussies.

I know some of you on here are complaining about the contract and the pay and the cost of housing in Hong Kong but I guess I have those areas "covered." I was in Hong Kong this past summer and starting dating a girl from there. I plan on getting married to her someday and would like to move to HK. My HK girlfriend is a nurse and makes an ok salary so if I did become a Second Officer with CX, I would have more than enough money to find a place to rent. I am sure I could find a simple apartment in the Mui Woa area of Lantau Island for less than $1,000 USD per month.

Becoming a pilot is my dream job and if I got on with CX, I would be the happiest man on the planet. I guess it's nice to have dreams, right? haha

I say this respectfully but if you look through the previous 8 pages of this thread most of your questions about the program are answered in there. They do hire you with no flight experience and put you into they're cadet program and they do hire Americans, quite a few guys on here have been interviewed. Just read through the page and you'll learn quite a bit. Also go to pprune.org, its a better source of info for airlines around the world outside the US and theres quite a bit of info on CX in there.

Good luck.
 
I know a few pages back there is a bit (ok a huge) bit of delay when it comes to Cathay getting back to people.
 
Being a pilot for Cathay is my dream job. I don't care about the conditions or the six year training bond.

If I have enough money to stay in a small apartment and eat, then I will be happy.

I wish Cathay would at least give me the chance to interview but knowing my luck, they will interview all of the people who will complain about everything and not take the job.

Cathay please hire me!!!
 
I interviewed for the cadet SO earlier in the year. The pay comes out to 80-something and thats not even including the 1,200/month they give you for housing. After doing a little research I understood the pay and QOL is not what it was, but isn't that the case for most jobs in every industry. The captain interviewing me put it best, you basically babysit the plane while the captain snoozes during a long haul flight. It's not gonna be fun nor all that challenging, but a phenomenal learning opportunity. Now whether that's a good way to gain the experience your fellow pilots flying the same a/c in the states have is a whole different argument. But top of the line training, a pretty good salary, and the opportunity to become FO down the road, is not a bad deal. If anyone has questions about the process PM me.
 
I interviewed for the cadet SO earlier in the year. The pay comes out to 80-something and thats not even including the 1,200/month they give you for housing. After doing a little research I understood the pay and QOL is not what it was, but isn't that the case for most jobs in every industry. The captain interviewing me put it best, you basically babysit the plane while the captain snoozes during a long haul flight. It's not gonna be fun nor all that challenging, but a phenomenal learning opportunity. Now whether that's a good way to gain the experience your fellow pilots flying the same a/c in the states have is a whole different argument. But top of the line training, a pretty good salary, and the opportunity to become FO down the road, is not a bad deal. If anyone has questions about the process PM me.
Did you have a commercial? I'm going to try again after I finish my instrument rating.
 
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