Ian_J
Hubschrauber Flieger
500 total or 500 FW?
Most Army rotor guys who can scrap out 250 FW on their own can go straight to an LCC or AMCI these days with an R-ATP. JetBlue and Frontier types are gobbling them up much to the chagrin of big Army.
UAL Mil Pilot Program
- Thread starter MikeD
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Most Army rotor guys who can scrap out 250 FW on their own can go straight to an LCC or AMCI these days with an R-ATP. JetBlue and Frontier types are gobbling them up much to the chagrin of big Army.
Pilot Fighter
Well-Known Member
Can’t a 121 carrier provide 100 hours of sim time towards ATP?
smack300
Well-Known Member
500 Total. I told them they could get into the LCCs but they are all wrestling with staying another 5 years or less for that retirement or get their seniority number now for the big guys.
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
haha no, I just like to collect jobs and work 30 days per month
Though when I start getting year 3 pay this spring, I think it will be time to re-assess, and start enjoying some of my "days off". I was mostly trying to trigger Cherokee "Here's my W2" Cruiser
I’m still buying if you keep me out of trouble
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///AMG
Well-Known Member
That's a tough call, 5 years is a long time. A lot of mil RW guys, even with pretty significant RW time, were having to take the RTP route even just a few years ago and do a lap through the regionals. You guys are right about the LCCs/ACMI, but I imagine that could go away in a heartbeat if the economy coughs or whatever else. Then again, the difference between an active retirement and a reserve retirement is a lot of future money paid out over time. The difference between an active retirement and none at all is even more dramatic
Ian_J
Hubschrauber Flieger
Holy crap. 10-15 years in and only 500 hours? Sure there’s a lot of units out there and a lot of special circumstances, but in my over 20 years of army flying experience that low a number is an outlier.
Ian_J
Hubschrauber Flieger
In 2017 even with a healthy amount of quality FW time, I had to take a lap. These days they really don’t. AA offered 97 CJOs at the recent RTAG conference. And that was just AA. Mil rotary is the new fabulous now just a half step down from you fancy Navy and AF types. Although none of us are as desirable as the 24 year old riddle kid with extra curriculars. I kid!That's a tough call, 5 years is a long time. A lot of mil RW guys, even with pretty significant RW time, were having to take the RTP route even just a few years ago and do a lap through the regionals. You guys are right about the LCCs/ACMI, but I imagine that could go away in a heartbeat if the economy coughs or whatever else. Then again, the difference between an active retirement and a reserve retirement is a lot of future money paid out over time. The difference between an active retirement and none at all is even more dramatic
That said, yeah, the calculus to get out and get seniority vs. a mil retirement can be tough. The best advice I can think of these days for AD pilots is to bail as soon as you can and joint the Guard/ Reserves.
although the guard/reserve is, in many different respects, just mini active duty now.
Ian_J
Hubschrauber Flieger
Sure. But if you want a seniority number and be a member of the check of the month club, thems the breaks.
(Sighs in retirement relief)
My unit for example, wanted a minimum of 9 flights a month from pilots, plus drill weekend. Throw in TDYs that constantly came up, and the 2 weeks per year; and managing the reserve gig and working a full time job was a heavy lift, even with both jobs located at the same airport. Burning through mil leave and into regular leave just to make those happen, if I wanted to have any actual days off from both jobs, was another pain. Was glad to put the mil behind me. Reserve , even as a part timer, was damn near a full time commitment. It was like leaving active duty, just to move over to active duty that was only different because of no PCS.
///AMG
Well-Known Member
To be fair, I know a few people that by chance, not really by plan, hopped back on the FTS/TAR/AGR (full time reserve) path during COVID, and were SELRES for a short enough time prior, that they will walk away in a couple years with active retirements. Turns out big DoD doesn't play the same f*** f*** games with them and sanctuary that we do in normal reserve land.
@ mike's point, I think you would have a hard time convincing my airline that I am not near full time military. Hardware (flying) in the reserves, particularly not in heavies, is a whole different ball game. On a light month, I drop 1-2 trips, just to not fall out of our 30 day currency window. And I'm basically almost no value added to actual student production in those months.
To Ians point, that number does seem REALLY low for someone at 15+ years in any airframe/service. There must be more going on than that. And if I were an outlier like that, I'd absolutely strike while the iron is hot at the airlines.
@ mike's point, I think you would have a hard time convincing my airline that I am not near full time military. Hardware (flying) in the reserves, particularly not in heavies, is a whole different ball game. On a light month, I drop 1-2 trips, just to not fall out of our 30 day currency window. And I'm basically almost no value added to actual student production in those months.
To Ians point, that number does seem REALLY low for someone at 15+ years in any airframe/service. There must be more going on than that. And if I were an outlier like that, I'd absolutely strike while the iron is hot at the airlines.
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Ian_J
Hubschrauber Flieger
For sure. I was a Battalion Commander and then a Group OPs officer while at the airline. It was a nightmare. Zero time off. Even on airline layovers I was working.
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
50 hours, I believe, is what they can do, in the context of the training program. If the approved training program was longer, perhaps they could do more, but that's an area I'm fuzzy in.
///AMG
Well-Known Member
My buddy is our XO right now, soon to be CO, and I know he has to set reminders for himself to actually log drills and get paid, because he is always doing stuff and not being paid for it, while on layovers/trips
///AMG
Well-Known Member
my memory might be slightly off, but I believe our new hire training footprint included 12 full flight sims, each roughly 4 hrs of box time. So that number checks out
Lawman
Well-Known Member
9 months in CENTCOM netted a lot of my PIs 25-40 hours total time. This last deployment was truly negative as far as developing aviators.
It’s obscene how little total and how easily wavered the standard ATP requirements are now. Funny enough it’s the D model Apaches that are flying obscene hour counts because they’ve got this huge backstock of parts with all the other units switched to E’s.
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///AMG
Well-Known Member
Nobody knows what this means. There is some clapped out chopper that is flying more than another one now? Are you more helo trash with more hours or less?
Lawman
Well-Known Member
Nobody knows what this means. There is some clapped out chopper that is flying more than another one now? Are you more helo trash with more hours or less?
There are only two types of aircraft brave enough to be operating at the bleeding edges of the atmosphere, the U2 and helicopters. And there is a lot more crap to run into on our end.
I keep trying to convince our young guys about to PCS to go to one of the D model units. “I don’t want to fly the old, underpowered, busted D model!”
Then I explain to them the Battalion Commanders (not just line pilots) at 10th mountain both just flew 140 hours in their semi annual. Meanwhile we are in deployment train up and my Stands IPs aren’t logging those kinds of numbers.
It’s surprising to a lot of new people, but the old Gun truck soldiers on the harder you beat on it, just like it would on deployments to the desert.
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AA ran a television advert in the late 1980’s early 1990’s featuring a military pilot choosing to go fly with America. “Well, they’re getting an awfully good pilot“ sort of thing, followed by “American, we only have the best”.
The outrage was so bad concerning a corporation poaching military pilots that the ad was pulled.
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