The Attack on the 2nd Amendment Continues

Seggy said:
No it is an idea. Do you have a better solution?
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That depends on what you consider the problem. If you consider the problem that 'people get shot with guns' then there is no solution -- just like putting up with the Westboro Baptist Church is the price of liberty for our first amendment rights also having people get shot is a price of liberty for our second amendment rights. You could seek to have the second amendment repealed, I suppose.

You could seek to minimize violence generally by dismantling the tired and pointless drug war and help increase the quality of life in large metropolitan areas (where most gun violence occurs) through initiatives such as universal healthcare, increases to the minimum wage, repeals of right to work laws to increase union membership, increase education funding and especially trade and vocational skills schools and et cetera.


Or, I suppose... you could try to ban guns and drive away what I consider to be a fairly significant bloc of reliable Democrat voters and which case not only will we never get universal healthcare or any of the above but we might even exepect a contraction of what we already have.
 
Boris Badenov said:
Solution to what, exactly? Even assuming that a certain level of crime would necessitate the abrogation of our most basic rights (which I'd obviously dispute), the murder rate in the US is lower than it's been for ~50 years. What is this crisis of which you speak? Please use numbers.
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As a society I think we should continue to better ourself and drive the rate even lower than it has been in the past. With that, we need to look at solutions to problems. A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
 
Seggy said:
As a society I think we should continue to better ourself and drive the rate even lower than it has been in the past. With that, we need to look at solutions to problems. A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
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The only solution to that problem is the solution proposed by the NRA. Glad to hear you're on board.
 
Oh come on, you could have used A NUMBER. Just one. I mean, you could at least have Nancy Graced us and said "1 (ONE) DEAD CHILD IS TOO MANY!@". You're not even trying.
 
Seggy said:
As a society I think we should
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As opposed to what? As a shoe salesman convention? As a bunch of clowny Aviation Appliance Operators on the Internet? What value does "as a society" add to this conversation? And who is this "we", white man?

and drive the rate even lower than it has been in the past.
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Well there's a controversial and incisive position. You have won me over! I, too, am against Murder! Glad we got that settled.

With that, we need to look at solutions to problems. A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
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Again, you're absolutely right. I, like you, am against the murder of children. We've found some common ground at last. Perhaps now we could start talking about anything other than whether we all agree that murdering children is naughty?
 
Seggy said:
A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
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Yes, the mental health of the individual who brutally murdered his mother and innocent school children is a big problem that needs to be addressed. Sadly the politicians and other anti gun advocates seem to enjoy skipping over that small detail.

We lose around 40 people per day in this country thanks to distracted and drunk driving. When are we going to address those problems? Oh wait that's right, it doesn't make front page news, so we don't have to.
 
Where people live, people die. You can put it off for a while, but like everything else, it's a cost/benefit analysis. I stagger under the weight of the knowledge that some people don't seem to understand this. The darkest part of this realization (for me, anyway) is that there must be a significant part of the population who still labor under the adolescent fantasy that whilst everyone else is going to die, the rules don't apply to them. So here it is: You're going to die. Full stop. You're going to die and it's probably worth honestly considering NOW what you think will happen THEN. It's hard to come to terms with the notion that a significant portion of our supposedly "free" electorate is intellectually and emotionally 15 years old, but the evidence is overwhelming (witness this thread, for example). So consider, children...in the face of the fact that you are definitely, no question about it, certainly going to die: How do you want to LIVE? Me? I don't want to live what life I have under the boot of those so blinkered and anti-logical as to believe that if they just fantasize and goose-step enough, they'll live forever. Life is carcinogenic. Insofar as we're "built", we are most assuredly built to Die. Do you really want to spend the little time you have jumping through hoops for other soon-to-be-dead people who've determined that they can keep you safe from something that they know, to an absolute certainty, that they can't?

So, as I said, the question is "How do you want to live?" Anyone who tells you that there's another question is Selling Something.
 
Seggy said:
As a society I think we should continue to better ourself and drive the rate even lower than it has been in the past. With that, we need to look at solutions to problems. A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
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It is lower than in the past. Probably because of a lot of reasons, but with guns outstanding at 300 million I would say that the plummeting of murders have nothing to do with the amount of guns out there. So, a nutball steals his moms guns, kills her, then kills 26 kids which means we should defecate on the constitution? No thanks. The focus on guns has nothing to do with reducing crime, it is an ideological attack. Nothing more.
 
TowJoe said:
How about the F.O.I.D. card?

All you have to do is pay your money, get another background check, and carry your card to own a gun or buy ammo.
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Again -- we can't get consensus on having people even have ID in order to vote, which isn't even a Bill of Rights enumerated right. Why would it be deemed legal for this enumerated right -- especially the 'pay your money' part? Charging money to exercise a right?
 
Seggy said:
As a society I think we should continue to better ourself and drive the rate even lower than it has been in the past. With that, we need to look at solutions to problems. A problem, I would say is the Newton tragedy and we need to work to make sure that it doesn't happen again.
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Best way to fix crime issues, I'm convinced, is to fix the middle class, and fix unemployment.
 
Seggy said:
To begin here is what we can do........
How does the above work for y'all?
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Well, while you are trashing the constitutional rights of your fellow citizens why not go all the way?

Since most gun murders are committed by minorities....Blacks, Mexicans, and Chinks can't own guns at all.


Which if you look at the history of gun control is the reason that many of these laws were passed in the first place.
 
USMCmech said:
Well, while you are trashing the constitutional rights of your fellow citizens why not go all the way?

Since most gun murders are committed by minorities....Blacks, Mexicans, and Chinks can't own guns at all.


Which if you look at the history of gun control is the reason that many of these laws were passed in the first place.
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While a good point, you could have done without the racial slur.
 
Hacker15e said:
Again -- we can't get consensus on having people even have ID in order to vote, which isn't even a Bill of Rights enumerated right. Why would it be deemed legal for this enumerated right -- especially the 'pay your money' part? Charging money to exercise a right?
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After rereading my post I realized it made it sound like I was an advocate for the FOID card. I meant it to be sarcastic and failed at that (sounded right in my head). I am completely against it. I don't understand how it is even legal.
 
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