Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule included

[scooter2525]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Nice to see that coming to fruition. I was starting to think it was forever stalled. Score.

Thats for sure. I might have missed it but, details?



I agree 800 hours seems so... arbitrary. ATP would be a good min to set. At least that sets the crew on a closer level of experience. If the senate want to have some end result of 1500 hours, why not set that instead of, "800.... or 1500, depends on if you (feds) get your act together."

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Does the interview process get easier as an assumption of competency is made as one 'progresses through the industry', etc?

It does, and I think that's a mistake. Some of the most professional pilots I've flown with in my career were some of the the lowest-time captains at GIA, while some of the most unprofessional and nonstandard were some of the most senior and experienced at Pinnacle. There shouldn't be any assumption of competency merely because someone has 10 years experience flying jets, or whatever the metric may be. Everyone should be evaluated thoroughly.

Thats for sure. I might have missed it but, details?

Details aren't out yet. Just some statements by Administrator Babbitt about how he wanted to beef up the rest requirements prior to releasing the NPRM, which is apparently what he did. We'll see the full thing soon.

 

[scooter2525]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Details aren't out yet. Just some statements by Administrator Babbitt about how he wanted to beef up the rest requirements prior to releasing the NPRM, which is apparently what he did. We'll see the full thing soon.

it will be interesting to see how "beefed up" they make them. If it's anything like the new "experiance" requirements, probably going to be wattered down. Either way, it's good to see progress. After that congress hearing on cspan a few months ago it seemed like the Feds had it handed to them about progress.

 

[kellwolf]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Plus, (I'm not sure this horse is quite dead yet...) nobody cares. Joe Sixpack doesn't care how tough our jobs are or aren't, and they certainly don't give a toss how well we're remunerated for our efforts. As far as The Invisible Hand is concerned, if we're still showing up for work, we're being adequately compensated. The road to improvement isn't through convincing everyone that we're steely-eyed aces cheating death at every turn, it's through flexing political will and muscle.

You don't just find this in aviation, either. No one cares about safety until something happens. Let's look at theme parks. People complain all day about how Disney's prices keep going up and up, but they also inspect their rides NIGHTLY. If Disney had a coaster and, not knocking the company just using them as an example, Six Flags had the SAME coaster, both in Orlando, but Six Flags charged $10 less for admission, people would FLOCK to Six Flags to ride the coaster. Now, why does Six Flags charge less? (Again, just using Six Flags as an example, not saying this is an actual practice) They only inspect their rides annually: the minimum required by law. Let's say the coaster both parks has encounters a catastrophic structural failure due to lack of maintenance. That $10 everyone saved isn't worth it anymore. You'll find the same thing in airlines. Everyone assumes all airlines are on a level playing field when it comes to safety and training, and it SHOULD be a valid assumption. However, reality shows us there are differences in the training departments of airlines, sometimes very LARGE gaps.

 

[SlumTodd_Millionaire]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

What you've just discussed is the failure of capitalism. Without regulation, capitalism is a dangerous system. There is always someone willing to come along and do something half-assed, knowing the long-term risk, but willing to take it for the market edge. The people in this thread arguing for "true deregulation" are advocating a nightmare scenario.

 

[Firebird2XC]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

What you've just discussed is the failure of capitalism. Without regulation, capitalism is a dangerous system. There is always someone willing to come along and do something half-assed, knowing the long-term risk, but willing to take it for the market edge. The people in this thread arguing for "true deregulation" are advocating a nightmare scenario.

Aye. Capitalism without due regard to the health of the system as a whole is asking for a downward spiral into an arms race to anarchy.

 

[Ian_J]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

True, it's a stereotype, but it goes to show- you can't replace stick time with a degree, regardless of what it's in, and that was my underlying point.

No doubt about that. To the unknowing though, it could seem your point implied that Commissioned Army Officers had to have degrees to fly or that their degrees had something to do with them being pilots. As you know, and for the benefit of others, ALL Army Officers are required to get or possess bachelor degrees no matter if they are pilots, tank commanders, infantrymen, or logisticians.

 

[risemeyer]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Im at my freshman year at ASU/Mesa Pilot Development (yeah i know), and im wondering if there will be some sort of grace given to those schools and flight training programs that are in the 141 (abbi/abby?) syllabus

 

[cmill]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Im at my freshman year at ASU/Mesa Pilot Development (yeah i know), and im wondering if there will be some sort of grace given to those schools and flight training programs that are in the 141 (abbi/abby?) syllabus

do you feel that you should still be allowed to enter a 121 cockpit with 300 hours because you went to a 141 program?

 

[risemeyer]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

do you feel that you should still be allowed to enter a 121 cockpit with 300 hours because you went to a 141 program?

To be honest with you, not at all, i think 300 hour's is extremely low and at our program you finish in 2 years with 300 hours and instruct your last 2 years and most pilots finish and head to there RJ training at our school(CAE full level D) with over 800 hours in there logbook. Yes, i know that 2 years of being a CFI will have 800 hours or more, but my question is mostly for the price, 141 is more expensive and if there is no grace for them, why pay SO much more while i could go to a 61 school.

 

[SpiraMirabilis]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

You get a degree out of it, which you don't get at a pt 61 school. *shrugs*

 

[cmill]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

why pay SO much more while i could go to a 61 school.

Exactly, but a 141 school will drill it in your head that you're so much more better off, which is false. I started at a 141 school, so i know what im talking about for once on here. I wish someone would have told me to skip the 141. When you get your ATP, or even private certificate for that matter, its not going to say anything about 141 on there, and frankly, no one really cares.

That fancy RJ course may swing you an interview at mesa, but then again, mesa isnt somewhere i would aspire to go.

 

[challenger]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

If that really is how it ends up. . . That's just what we need only people who were 141 in the cockpits with lower hours.

AGHH, the stupidity of these people.

Flying 141 for me has made me decide, that I would become a better pilot flying 61. What do I know though, I just refuse to get fooled into thinking I am actually getting a good education at UND.

College has become extremely worthless in a lot of areas in this day and age, because of bad teachers. So anywho, worthless degree=worthless education I suppose

Rant over. . . . .

 

[Patrick]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

To be honest with you, not at all, i think 300 hour's is extremely low and at our program you finish in 2 years with 300 hours and instruct your last 2 years and most pilots finish and head to there RJ training at our school(CAE full level D) with over 800 hours in there logbook. Yes, i know that 2 years of being a CFI will have 800 hours or more, but my question is mostly for the price, 141 is more expensive and if there is no grace for them, why pay SO much more while i could go to a 61 school.

Might want to work on the English Proficient bit.

As to the price, there is no reason to pay more to go to 141 school. The only time it holds any water, is when you qualify for Veteran's benefits and Uncle Sam is paying the bulk of it, where he requires that you train at a Part 141 school.

 

[Boris Badenov]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

As to the price, there is no reason to pay more to go to 141 school. The only time it holds any water, is when you qualify for Veteran's benefits and Uncle Sam is paying the bulk of it, where he requires that you train at a Part 141 school.

Not true, a 141 school gives you experience with micromanagement of every detail of flying, wrangling with "dispatch", and generally taking the fun out of flying. Experience which will be invaluable when you finally get to the Airlines.

 

[ChasenSFO]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Reading through it, I'm not sure how a person is going to actually meet all these requirements. Should have just kept it simple with ATP mins IMO.

 

[germb747]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Not true, a 141 school gives you experience with micromanagement of every detail of flying, wrangling with "dispatch", and generally taking the fun out of flying. Experience which will be invaluable when you finally get to the Airlines.

:rotfl:

Reason #543 to train Part 61

 

[Mark815]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Yes, i know that 2 years of being a CFI will have 800 hours or more

Don't be so sure. I know guys that worked for FSA and other colleges that barely worked 30hrs\month while under their contract.

but my question is mostly for the price, 141 is more expensive and if there is no grace for them, why pay SO much more while i could go to a 61 school.

This stuff just drives me crazy! Do people actually know the difference in 141 vs 61? You know the FBO I trained and work at has 141 training. I did my instrument 141 but I wasn't in a 'college program'. I had students that wanted to train under 141 rules instead of 61, so we 'enrolled' (filling out some paperwork) them in our 141 training, and guess what, it doesn't cost more! I've heard guys say 'well I wanted 141 training so I went to [insert overpriced school here], yet they looked shocked when I say I did some of my training 141 at home at an FBO. I've actually gotten a 'wait, how did you do that if it's not a college?'.

Some people need to actually pickup a copy of the FARs and READ what 141 actually means. Nowhere in there do I see anything about 'college program' or 'costing more'.
:soapbox:

 

[challenger]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Don't be so sure. I know guys that worked for FSA and other colleges that barely worked 30hrs\month while under their contract.

This stuff just drives me crazy! Do people actually know the difference in 141 vs 61? You know the FBO I trained and work at has 141 training. I did my instrument 141 but I wasn't in a 'college program'. I had students that wanted to train under 141 rules instead of 61, so we 'enrolled' (filling out some paperwork) them in our 141 training, and guess what, it doesn't cost more! I've heard guys say 'well I wanted 141 training so I went to [insert overpriced school here], yet they looked shocked when I say I did some of my training 141 at home at an FBO. I've actually gotten a 'wait, how did you do that if it's not a college?'.

Some people need to actually pickup a copy of the FARs and READ what 141 actually means. Nowhere in there do I see anything about 'college program' or 'costing more'.
:soapbox:

Well, I stand corrected. I guess what I should have said is UND is a (expletive deleted) hole and I hate it! :insane::bandit:

 

[400A]

Re: Senate Passes FAA Reauthorization Bill, 800 hr rule incl

Don't be so sure. I know guys that worked for FSA and other colleges that barely worked 30hrs\month while under their contract.

This stuff just drives me crazy! Do people actually know the difference in 141 vs 61? You know the FBO I trained and work at has 141 training. I did my instrument 141 but I wasn't in a 'college program'. I had students that wanted to train under 141 rules instead of 61, so we 'enrolled' (filling out some paperwork) them in our 141 training, and guess what, it doesn't cost more! I've heard guys say 'well I wanted 141 training so I went to [insert overpriced school here], yet they looked shocked when I say I did some of my training 141 at home at an FBO. I've actually gotten a 'wait, how did you do that if it's not a college?'.

Some people need to actually pickup a copy of the FARs and READ what 141 actually means. Nowhere in there do I see anything about 'college program' or 'costing more'.
:soapbox:

Don't be silly. We cannot expect anyone to take responsibility and do a minimum of homework about how things work, if it isn't filimed for MTV on some kind of "My life as...." special.