A worthy adversary, my friend.
Night VFR in Arizona has taken a lot of unsuspecting people.
Plane from Scottsdale, AZ crashes enroute Telluride
- Thread starter Cherokee_Cruiser
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A worthy adversary, my friend.
Night VFR in Arizona has taken a lot of unsuspecting people.
"Get OFF my table, Daffy!"
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
Yep it almost got me. But I got scared, turned around and landed at the origin airport.
After failing my CFI initial.
I wound up sleeping in the plane. Good times.
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AAPalmTree
Well-Known Member
Cirrus
rockman2343@aol.com
Well-Known Member
I can't believe someone would take a risk like that with their kids. This is just sickening and heartbreaking.
U_of_I_Tweak
Well-Known Member
What risk exactly did he take?
Flying a single engine?
Flying a single engine cross country?
The facts as I understand them are: 210 Scottsdale to Telluride; crashed enroute where surface conditions were low IFR.
If, and at this point it's a huge if, he flew VFR into IMC, I agree it's sickening. Otherwise I'm going to hold back my condemnation of another pilot until the facts are in
If you can't do something smart, do something right
rockman2343@aol.com
Well-Known Member
Flying single engine, at night, over that terrain, with your kids, in my opinion, is risky. Even if whatever went wrong was not technically his fault, his options are severely limited over that terrain, at night.
I agree, we don't know all the facts, but I don't like what I'm reading so far. I feel like we've seen this play out before. You are right though, we may read something in the report that suggests some other cause.
U_of_I_Tweak
Well-Known Member
I respect your opinion on that. I don't necessarily have the same one, but I respect that.
One of the news articles above days they departed at 0930, so night wasn't a factor in this case. I think the plane wasn't reported missing until late in the day.
If you can't do something smart, do something right
rockman2343@aol.com
Well-Known Member
Gotcha, I didn't see that. The news I saw in Arizona said night, but we know how reliable the media is when it comes to aviation related reporting.
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
I'm still here to talk about it so. Yep.
touch-n-go
Well-Known Member
Yes indeed. Kathryn's Report is saying the accident took place around 1636 Zulu which would be about 9:30 AM local.
http://www.kathrynsreport.com/2017/01/cessna-210-centurion-fatal-accident.html
rockman2343@aol.com
Well-Known Member
https://app.ntsb.gov/pdfgenerator/R...D=20170103X14851&AKey=1&RType=Prelim&IType=FA
Preliminary report is out.
Preliminary report is out.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Who doesn't file a flight plan, is a PPL, and flies into known instrument conditions? Filing a flight plan, amongst many other things of note. Could have prevented this tragedy.
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
What would filing a flight plan have done to prevent this?
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z987k
Well-Known Member
I think a more relevant question would be why did he try to get under the weather in a turbo 210. What's the ceiling on that 250?
BEEF SUPREME
Well-Known Member
Couple thoughts:
No IFR rating so they can't climb through a layer.
No O2. So they have to stay below 12.5
Just bad decision making.
Seems as if the engine was running and they had gas based on the preliminary. So much for the engine out at night theory.
killbilly
Vocals, Lyrics, Triangle, Washboard, Kittens
I kind of figured that's what you were alluding to. But what you're really talking about is flight planning - which can (and should be diligently) done. Whether he files a flight plan or not doesn't enter into it because VFR flight plans aren't real useful in my opinion.
I'd be willing to bet a crisp Benjamin that he knew those things already, and this is a result of poor ADM.
Maximilian_Jenius
Super User
Been awhile, since I've done a PPL flight plan. But filing a flight plan he would have had to look at a sectional to know about the terrain between his departure airport and his destination. We fly to KPAN for my simulated instrument time occasionally. I'll do the heavy lifting and create the fight plan and my instructor will file. So I know what MSA to be at. Again I know that the guy wasn't IFR rated. But still. I know a PPL flight plan isn't as detailed as a IFR flight plan. But it has to involve knowledge of terrain in the area, right?
I know when we fly to KPRC, I'm going to need to be on the V-105 and that I need to be at or above 10k in order to clear the mountains in-between my departure airport and my destination. He was flying at night, shouldn't he have known to be at an altitude above the tops of the mountains? When I did my night x-country, ages ago terrain knowledge was a biggie for my instructor, with all the mountains in and around KTUS.
That's my point, if I'm wrong. Correct me.
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