Pinnacle Status?

citationCJ1 said:
What is the latest news regarding displacements, scheduling and staffing? Is there lots of open time?
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All I can say is it's like spring of 07 all over again this weekend. Flights CXling for lack of crews, guys getting JMed, RSVs spread out everywhere.

I just got a call "offering" to let me stay in DTW to work a STL turn on my day off, and they'd DH me home tomorrow night. They know I'll refuse an extension, they can't assign my DTW RSV stuff since I'd be out of domicile (ha ha! take that LOA expiration!) and it's up in the air as for as JMing someone for something out of domicile. Basically, there's not much of a way they could do it without making it an extension. They could DH me home tonight, then JM me for a DH back to DTW in the morning, but I wouldn't make it to DTW in time to do the flight. Essentially, some poor DTW CA is gonna get JMed for a STL turn tomorrow......

As for open time, I looked at the 5 days I'm on RSV for next week. 70 CA pairings in open time just for those days. Oh, yeah. And the displacements don't even take effect until March 2nd, so this is WITHOUT the 31 guys going back to the right seat. March is gonna be FUUUN!
 
I am still having a hard time understanding. There are flight cancellations, open time, JMs etc... with the current staffing. How will this work when CA's are displaced? Is everyone breaking guarantee? To me this sounds like being short staffed and they should do something quick to get things back online. Probably the management knows something that no one else does.
 
citationCJ1 said:
I am still having a hard time understanding. There are flight cancellations, open time, JMs etc... with the current staffing. How will this work when CA's are displaced? Is everyone breaking guarantee? To me this sounds like being short staffed and they should do something quick to get things back online. Probably the management knows something that no one else does.
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Stop thinking... You need to give mgmt a head start.
 
citationCJ1 said:
I am still having a hard time understanding. There are flight cancellations, open time, JMs etc... with the current staffing. How will this work when CA's are displaced? Is everyone breaking guarantee? To me this sounds like being short staffed and they should do something quick to get things back online. Probably the management knows something that no one else does.
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Management knows we're overstaffed by Pinnacle standards. That's actually NORMALLY staffed for an airline. If guys aren't breaking guarantee by flying 90-95 hour lines, RSVs breaking guarantee and they STILL need to JM or extend, well, we're overstaffed. FOs are really bad right now, and I think THAT is major force behind the CA displacements. Rather than hire more people, thus having to pay more for health insurance and training costs right now, they'd rather displace CAs to save some $$$. They can always just run every RSV right up to 75 hours or a little above, and they wind up saving money that way rather than hiring new FOs to cover the shortage.

The thing I've noticed is our management rarely looks more than 30-45 DAYS into the future. If it's something that could be a problem down the road (like being short staffed on CAs even more come summer), well, they'll just cross that bridge when they come to it.

The latest in the saga of YGTBFSM is they've declined to allow for leave for a couple of our Air Safety guys to help out with Colgan 3407. So much for "never compromise safety" as a guiding principle. Like it or not, that's a Pinnacle CORP plane down, but they won't even give leave to pilots to help with investigation.....
 
Meanwhile if you want to have a line built more than 75-77 hours and are in the top half of the bid list you are SOL.

The safety committee issue is another load of BS.


O... the first guy FAILED A LOFT by a PRO-INSTRUCTOR! Mgmt said that couldn't happen?:banghead:


Things are about to get interesting...
 
higney85 said:
Meanwhile if you want to have a line built more than 75-77 hours and are in the top half of the bid list you are SOL.

The safety committee issue is another load of BS.


O... the first guy FAILED A LOFT by a PRO-INSTRUCTOR! Mgmt said that couldn't happen?:banghead:


Things are about to get interesting...
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I wonder if he didn't drop the gear and go flaps 30 when he was one dot below the glideslope 15 miles out? Or some other ridiculous "follow the profile" bizshiz.
 
cencal83406 said:
I wonder if he didn't drop the gear and go flaps 30 when he was one dot below the glideslope 15 miles out? Or some other ridiculous "follow the profile" bizshiz.
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No, from my source the details of the event were not profile but it was a large mistake. The issue is not whether the crew made a simply mistake, but the fact that this LOFT is NOT pass/fail and is designed to create more realistic training vs. the canned V1, stalls, a fire, etc. If you can fail a loft, a pro-instructor should not be able to conduct a LOFT. It's a simple issue that has many HUGE factors as a spin-off. 30 CA's being downgraded and being evaluated in "Real world" training by someone who has never flown the plane and has never been in our "Real world" all in what becomes a jeopardy situation. Our contract is clear, the last time this company tried this in 2003? a judgement came back saying the company was wrong- this is not rocket science, but it is a violation to a mutually agreed upon contract. It will be unfortunate if the company must lay off pro-instructors, but these factors are directly on mgmt's table to deal with.
 
higney85 said:
The issue is not whether the crew made a simply mistake, but the fact that this LOFT is NOT pass/fail and is designed to create more realistic training vs. the canned V1, stalls, a fire, etc. If you can fail a loft, a pro-instructor should not be able to conduct a LOFT. It's a simple issue that has many HUGE factors as a spin-off.
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I know someone who failed a LOFT here before. They no longer work here. This person had successfully passed their checkride, failed LOFT, and when given a new checkride, failed that. Poof! Gone! See ya. Bummer. :-/
 
higney85 said:
No, from my source the details of the event were not profile but it was a large mistake. The issue is not whether the crew made a simply mistake, but the fact that this LOFT is NOT pass/fail and is designed to create more realistic training vs. the canned V1, stalls, a fire, etc. If you can fail a loft, a pro-instructor should not be able to conduct a LOFT. It's a simple issue that has many HUGE factors as a spin-off. 30 CA's being downgraded and being evaluated in "Real world" training by someone who has never flown the plane and has never been in our "Real world" all in what becomes a jeopardy situation. Our contract is clear, the last time this company tried this in 2003? a judgement came back saying the company was wrong- this is not rocket science, but it is a violation to a mutually agreed upon contract. It will be unfortunate if the company must lay off pro-instructors, but these factors are directly on mgmt's table to deal with.
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Bottom line is the LOFT is required by 121 regs to remain qualified in the aircraft. Don't pass, you're no longer qualified since the company is subbing this new LOFT format for PCs. They think just by changing the name from "PC" to "LOFT" they can let non-seniority list pilots administer the sims. Contract specifically states that checkrides, PCs or evaluations are to be conducted by company check airmen, FAA inspectors or 3rd party check airmen contracted by the company and meeting certain FAA requirements. The last one really only comes into play on the -900 when people get sent to Montreal. Pro sim instructors are NOT check airmen. Therefore, they can't do evaluation that are jeopardy events, with the LOFT CLEARLY is.

I'm sure it'll take a while to get this one resolved. Last I heard it was on the "fast track" since the system board had already heard it and ruled in our favor years ago. I'm sure the company will just deny the grievance along with the other 100s that are sitting in the "denied" pile....
 
pilotlight said:
I just had the loft and I found it to be a good experience. I did not have a pro instructor I had a line pilot though.
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Yeah, I like the IDEA of them doing the training that way. I just wish they'd follow the contract as to who is in the evaluation seat.
 
I just talked to a 9E captain at ORD and he said that for the last 3 months he is been flying only 40-50 hours a month. He said maybe next month he will break guarantee and will fly around 90 hours due to displacements. I am sure he is happy about displacements
 
Well, to throw more gas on the fire, for the second weekend in a row, I'm doing highspeeds out of DTW. The scheduling comments? You guessed it: "short on DTW CAs." Last weekend when I stepped off the DH, at least FOUR high speeds were canceled, including mine and the other MEM RSV CA that DHed up with me. The other guy was assigned a State College highspeed, and they didn't have anything for me. Why? They had already JMed guys to cover high speeds, and you can't replace a JM with a reserve after they've reported at their show time. The others, from what I gathered from CS, were canceled due to lack of crews.

The least amount I've flown since I finished upgrade in May was 45 hours. Since December, it's been steadily going up. For Jan, I was over 60. If it weren't for doing mostly DHs to DTW for high speeds, I'd break guarantee this month. I'm already WAY over my TAFB for Jan, and I've still got 8 more RSV days left. So far, there's been ONE RSV day this month they didn't use me for something. I could have had a sweet 4 day starting Thurs morning, but the show time was like 5:50 am. With the wife in at 4:30 am, that would leave my 4 year old walking to day care. They needed my okay for it since the trip started prior to my RSV period.

If we're already running short on CAs, they're just gonna be running OUT when the displacements hit in March.

Edit: Just ran the numbers for CAs per airplane. We're running on a 4.6 CAs per airplane ratio, which isn't overstaffed. That's COUNTING the ATL operation in with NWA, and they want 7 crews per airplane in ATL (or at least DID to make sure the operation runs smoothly). When we dropped below the 4 per airplane point is when we canceled so many flights we wound up paying penalties to NWA......
 
I just lost my gig flying a citation right seat. Was hoping that 9E would call me for interview as they said they would in January. I guess I will have to get back to flight instruction again. I believe Pinnacle has approximately 1300 pilots with 140 airframes. During summer time, do the marketing hours increase? If so, I could be looking forward for the interview around March. If not, then I will have to wait for next year.
 
kellwolf said:
Well, to throw more gas on the fire, for the second weekend in a row, I'm doing highspeeds out of DTW. The scheduling comments? You guessed it: "short on DTW CAs." Last weekend when I stepped off the DH, at least FOUR high speeds were canceled, including mine and the other MEM RSV CA that DHed up with me. The other guy was assigned a State College highspeed, and they didn't have anything for me. Why? They had already JMed guys to cover high speeds, and you can't replace a JM with a reserve after they've reported at their show time. The others, from what I gathered from CS, were canceled due to lack of crews.

The least amount I've flown since I finished upgrade in May was 45 hours. Since December, it's been steadily going up. For Jan, I was over 60. If it weren't for doing mostly DHs to DTW for high speeds, I'd break guarantee this month. I'm already WAY over my TAFB for Jan, and I've still got 8 more RSV days left. So far, there's been ONE RSV day this month they didn't use me for something. I could have had a sweet 4 day starting Thurs morning, but the show time was like 5:50 am. With the wife in at 4:30 am, that would leave my 4 year old walking to day care. They needed my okay for it since the trip started prior to my RSV period.

If we're already running short on CAs, they're just gonna be running OUT when the displacements hit in March.

Edit: Just ran the numbers for CAs per airplane. We're running on a 4.6 CAs per airplane ratio, which isn't overstaffed. That's COUNTING the ATL operation in with NWA, and they want 7 crews per airplane in ATL (or at least DID to make sure the operation runs smoothly). When we dropped below the 4 per airplane point is when we canceled so many flights we wound up paying penalties to NWA......
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Do you ever wonder if they are counting on losing NWA flying for more Delta flying. Then just telling delta when they get the bill, "Hey does this company even exist anymore?"

I'm willing to bet they'll bank on making Papa Delta happy so they can grab up some flying from them... which will be the NWA flying.

This sounded a lot more intelligent in my head before I wrote it all down.
 
jynxyjoe said:
Do you ever wonder if they are counting on losing NWA flying for more Delta flying. Then just telling delta when they get the bill, "Hey does this company even exist anymore?"

I'm willing to bet they'll bank on making Papa Delta happy so they can grab up some flying from them... which will be the NWA flying.

This sounded a lot more intelligent in my head before I wrote it all down.
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If they were smart, they'd be trying to get flying with someone OTHER than Delta. The whole reason we bent over backwards to get the okay to fly for other carriers in the NWA ASA was so we wouldn't be tied to one customer. Well, here we are again. It's easy to run an airline when the industry is going well and you're spoon fed flights hand over fist. The real challenge comes when the industry hits the skids and you have to fight for flying. I don't have one iota of confidence that our current management can even do their jobs to a decent extent in that environment. At least, so far their showing has been poor in that realm, and up until recently, they've never had to operate in that sort of arena. If they lose an RFP, they'll turn and blame it on the pilots for not having signed a sub-par contract. They've done it once already. Apparently, there was some phantom flying we "lost" a while back, and it was due to us not having signed a contract. They also like to point the finger at us for "losing" the -900s to XJ and the 17 -200s getting moved over there as well. Apparently, they have no mirrors in their houses since that negotiating table has two sides.

I honestly have no idea WHAT they're thinking on the staffing model. I'm guessing our block hours are going to increase in the summer, as they normally do. I'm not even going to wager how much, though. It's really dependent on Delta at this point. If I were PT, I'd be SERIOUSLY concerned about keeping my job and down in ATL grovelling every chance I could to insure we kept what flying we have and have a good shot at getting more. Seeing as the shareholders haven't even seen fit to question his "leadership" in losing massive amounts of money in a stock market gamble (shoulda just gone to the craps tables in Tunica), I doubt that losing his job has even crossed his mind.....

Damn, I need a vacation. First week of March can't come soon enough. :)
 
kellwolf said:
If they were smart, they'd be trying to get flying with someone OTHER than Delta. The whole reason we bent over backwards to get the okay to fly for other carriers in the NWA ASA was so we wouldn't be tied to one customer. Well, here we are again. It's easy to run an airline when the industry is going well and you're spoon fed flights hand over fist. The real challenge comes when the industry hits the skids and you have to fight for flying. I don't have one iota of confidence that our current management can even do their jobs to a decent extent in that environment. At least, so far their showing has been poor in that realm, and up until recently, they've never had to operate in that sort of arena. If they lose an RFP, they'll turn and blame it on the pilots for not having signed a sub-par contract. They've done it once already. Apparently, there was some phantom flying we "lost" a while back, and it was due to us not having signed a contract. They also like to point the finger at us for "losing" the -900s to XJ and the 17 -200s getting moved over there as well. Apparently, they have no mirrors in their houses since that negotiating table has two sides.

I honestly have no idea WHAT they're thinking on the staffing model. I'm guessing our block hours are going to increase in the summer, as they normally do. I'm not even going to wager how much, though. It's really dependent on Delta at this point. If I were PT, I'd be SERIOUSLY concerned about keeping my job and down in ATL grovelling every chance I could to insure we kept what flying we have and have a good shot at getting more. Seeing as the shareholders haven't even seen fit to question his "leadership" in losing massive amounts of money in a stock market gamble (shoulda just gone to the craps tables in Tunica), I doubt that losing his job has even crossed his mind.....

Damn, I need a vacation. First week of March can't come soon enough. :)
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Well have a good vacation man. The XJ side is the same old same old. Overstaffed and everyone just shrugs. Only good side is management has no desire to cut down staffing levels at this time. After the summer it might be interesting (but i'll have a great schedule as an FO).
 
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