Non-Union airlines..
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SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
I'll go for the union protection everytime. They simply can't pay me enough to go without career protection from a union.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
There isn't a company in existence where management is benevolent enough to be trusted all the time with your livelihood. A union is a necessity, no matter how friendly your management is.
That argument used to make sense, but nowadays the legacies pay less than the union LCCs in many cases. Yes, that's because the legacies came down to LCC pay after the concessions, but that's not really relevant to pilots looking for jobs today. Pilots that worked at LCCs prior to the legacy concessions really don't have much room to criticize, since they're part of the reason that the legacies had to come down in pay, but pilots hired in the last couple of years and onward at the union LCCs took no part in bringing down industry standards. Remember, the highest paid pilots now work at SWA, where a 737 Captain makes over $200/hr. He most certainly has room to criticize if another pilot group were to sign a new contract with rates at a fraction of his pay.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
We have new union leadership, so all the old figures aren't really valid anymore, so I'm honestly not sure what they're shooting for. We just did some new polling, but I didn't get called in this batch. If they call me in the next round, then I'll certainly be asking for it. Our last TA that got voted down had the top rate at $183 when SWA's was $199, so we were in the ballpark. The FO pay was where the big disparity was, and the new union leadership has already stated that that will be a much bigger priority with them. We'll just have to wait and see how things go. As of right now, we aren't even back to the negotiating table until some time next year.
Geez folks.
Holiday spirit anyone?
Confession time.
I went to work for a non-union carrier back in 1996.
Sometimes I'm afraid some of you guys can't see the forest for the trees.
However, we were able to get ALPA on campus and got a contract after a short strike and I volunteered on the communications committee during my tenure at Skyway.
I think when we lump an entire group together, we're probably maligning people that may be working on the inside to change the situation.
Don't read this as me being in defense of Virgin, Skybus and Jetblue, because I'm not. JB's got a union drive going on, at least a far as I've heard, but then, by in large, Virgin and Skybus are filled with pilots whoring themselves out because they think that "Oh, management cherishes me!" as per the retired AA pilots (hopefully) drunken missive after he retired to go to work for Virgin America.
And yes, my donger's bigger than all of yours.
Seriously. We can stand around in a circle and have a "circle jerk" or we can bust the anti-labor/anti-union koolaid pitcher and make things better for professional pilots.
Holiday spirit anyone?
Confession time.
I went to work for a non-union carrier back in 1996.
Sometimes I'm afraid some of you guys can't see the forest for the trees.
However, we were able to get ALPA on campus and got a contract after a short strike and I volunteered on the communications committee during my tenure at Skyway.
I think when we lump an entire group together, we're probably maligning people that may be working on the inside to change the situation.
Don't read this as me being in defense of Virgin, Skybus and Jetblue, because I'm not. JB's got a union drive going on, at least a far as I've heard, but then, by in large, Virgin and Skybus are filled with pilots whoring themselves out because they think that "Oh, management cherishes me!" as per the retired AA pilots (hopefully) drunken missive after he retired to go to work for Virgin America.
And yes, my donger's bigger than all of yours.
Seriously. We can stand around in a circle and have a "circle jerk" or we can bust the anti-labor/anti-union koolaid pitcher and make things better for professional pilots.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
It's my understanding that they do, yes. I wouldn't expect any scope concessions in our next TA.
Gonzo
Well-Known Member
I hope you are right, but I do not trust AT management.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
Hey, you don't have to tell me. There's a reason that we always put Scope & Recognition as the very first section in CBAs. Without the scope, everything else is worthless.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
I don't trust any management.
Apparently, you've had a look around the Southernjets system, eh?
Slapping the brand on anyone willing to do the work for the lowest cost damned near put me permanently out of a job. At least now they're concerned about quality. Somewhat.
SlumTodd_Millionaire
Most Hated Member
Apparently, you've had a look around the Southernjets system, eh?
If I had a dime for every time that Atlanta ground told me to "follow the really big Delta RJ," then I'd be a very rich man.
OldTownPilot
Well-Known Member
If I had a dime for every time that Atlanta ground told me to "follow the really big Delta RJ," then I'd be a very rich man.
That still doesn't narrow it down much
So much for helpful ATC
A Union is only as strong as the local leadership. Contract oversight is where its at. Anything near the words "the company will" or "the company may" mean jack squat. I aught to show you guys the PBS section of the CAL contract. Actually I ran out of toilet paper and used it
Velocipede
New Member
You know, I agree with you 100%. But you can't bust the anti-Union crowd unless you take proactive steps to punish them for their actions.
And my little contribution is denying them free rides to work if they're at a non-Union Company who is undercutting my contract.
Again, they will never "get the message" as long as there are Union pilots willing to extend the miscreants Union negotiated privileges. They're laughing at you all the way to work as they get off your jet. And they're sticking it to you as they leave on their 4 day trip flying YOUR passengers around.
Think about it.
jynxyjoe
Queso King
used to be we could beat the hell outa people like that in the streets. thats what i like to call the good old days (btw, i'm 26yrs old, i really can't back any of that up).
surreal1221
Well-Known Member
And those are the days that need to come back . . .
Of course, they don't need to be out in the streets, but instead in the back shops and protect areas.
Enough of this Mr. Nice ALPA guy.
You rip on a guy because he helps clean his airplane?
Do you look down on me because I unload my Lear?
Netjets pilot clean their planes and gasp unload bags.
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