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derg said:
This is actually true. There’s an airline that people I know keep tabs on at SouthernJets that has an issue with new hires… just quitting. Not getting hired anywhere else, just leaving the profession.
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It’s bizarre, before I would just assume that these individuals got pushed into flying by a parent and they really didn’t want to do it. Now idk what to think. I will say good on them though, I’ve seen enough people in and outside of aviation who were just MISERABLE with their jobs/careers and stuck it out because that’s what they’ve been taught to do.
 
I can tell in about five minutes if they were pushed into aviation.

I talked to a guy at a job fair one day that literally said, "Please don't give me an interview, I don't want to fly anymore" that was basically drug there by his father. So we just talked about hiking for about five minutes.


He literally failed almost every checkride he's ever had, did poorly in aeronautical science and had a joyless stare because he was getting his ass kicked at the regionals for a profession he didn't want to be in so dad can have that photo.

I hope he manned up and took control of his own life for once.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
ONLY because they have options. Unlike mostly any other time in recent history. They can be picky. Or walk away from a major airline. Because they have something else lined up. Once that dries up - and indications are we are headed there - you’ll see the new generation get hit with reality hard in the face.

This younger generation hasn’t seen tough times.
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Depending on their age they might not have been on this earth long enough to experience tough times. In my uneducated opinion it’s also easier to be well rounded today outside of aviation with evolution of technology.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
ONLY because they have options. Unlike mostly any other time in recent history. They can be picky. Or walk away from a major airline. Because they have something else lined up. Once that dries up - and indications are we are headed there - you’ll see the new generation get hit with reality hard in the face.

This younger generation hasn’t seen tough times.
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I don’t care how much you try to sound like one, you are not allowed to call yourself a Boomer. :mad:
 
There's a few on here that seem to wish for an industry downturn just so the newer generation can experience tough times. Talk about cutting your nose off to spite your face. Your own career progression and QOL will be affected negatively as well, but hey at least you get to tell junior "I told you so!". Here's the thing, many in the newer generations are not willing to go through the destruction of their pay and QOL that comes with a big downturn and will most likely leave the industry. I see that as a good thing. We shouldn't be willing to accept the way airline labor was treated in the past. Just because that's how it was before doesn't make it right. Since in this world you get what you negotiate, maybe having people just walk out and never come back is what we need to avoid this profession getting gutted again. I know I'm definitely not going to take it. Since my earliest memories I remember being obsessed about airplanes and flying, and I truly feel the deep fulfillment that comes with having made it to the career I've always wanted from the very beginning. However the moment the pay and QOL advantage disappears, I'm out. I'm not going to go through years of abuse just to be able to put on a fancy uniform and tell people I fly jets. In that case I'll go back to sitting behind a desk and flying a 182 on weekends just like I did during the lost decade, and I'm staying there until things get back to how I left them. Being an airline pilot is great but my family and life outside of work come first. If anything I'm happy to see more people thinking like this now.
 
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luke3 said:
There's a few on here that seem to wish for an industry downturn just so the newer generation can experience tough times. Talk about cutting your nose off to spite your face. Your own career progression and QOL will be affected negatively as well, but hey at least you get to tell junior "I told you so!". Here's the thing, many in the newer generations are not willing to go through the destruction of their pay and QOL that comes with a big downturn and will most likely leave the industry. I see that as a good thing. We shouldn't be willing to accept the way airline labor was treated in the past. Just because that's how it was before doesn't make it right. Since in this world you get what you negotiate, maybe having people just walk out and never come back is what we need to avoid this profession getting gutted again. I know I'm definitely not going to take it. Since my earliest memories I remember being obsessed about airplanes and flying, and I truly feel the deep fulfillment that comes with having made it to the career I've always wanted from the very beginning. However the moment the pay and QOL advantage disappears, I'm out. I'm not going to go through years of abuse just to be able to put on a fancy uniform and tell people I fly jets. In that case I'll go back to sitting behind a desk and flying a 182 on weekends just like I did during the lost decade, and I'm staying there until things get back to how I left them. Being an airline pilot is great but my family and life outside of work come first. If anything I'm happy to see more people thinking like this now.
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Thank you. I was planning on writing the first half of what you wrote and you saved me the trouble.
 
Ian_J said:
Speaking of generations, I think it’s hilarious knot4u is our age. He writes like he’s almost as old as Cherokee pretends to be.
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Ian got them CLAWS out! :)

tenor.gif
 
ChasenSFO said:
My bet is a crap ton will bypass recall and leave the profession, which will be a nice seniority boost for those who stay.
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phill1174 said:
This! The younger generation seems to be less tolerant of the games and QOL gut punches than the past.
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Leave the profession for what though?

Unless they either have a somewhat lucrative side or family business they can walk into or reaaaaally hate the job—which I hope they wouldn’t given the time and effort it takes to get to a major—my guess is that walking away from a major is going to lead to a lot of regret.

There’s simply very, very few fields that offer equivalent compensation and quality of life right now…especially ones that most pilots will be able to plug into quickly.

Even most regionals’ starting pay is close to the median household pay for a bachelor’s degree, with major CA pay doubling the median for those with a professional degree.
 
zmiller4 said:
Leave the profession for what though?

Unless they either have a somewhat lucrative side or family business they can walk into or reaaaaally hate the job—which I hope they wouldn’t given the time and effort it takes to get to a major—my guess is that walking away from a major is going to lead to a lot of regret.

There’s simply very, very few fields that offer equivalent compensation and quality of life right now…especially ones that most pilots will be able to plug into quickly.

Even most regionals’ starting pay is close to the median household pay for a bachelor’s degree, with major CA pay doubling the median for those with a professional degree.
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Just go into real estate. Easy for anyone.
 
zmiller4 said:
Easy to make $150k-200k a year?
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I'm sure that is well within reach in a hot market, given the 3% or 6% they pull. But that is a LOT of damn work. Not the actual work of closing, but the work of getting the work in the first place. There has to be an insane ratio of unpaid vs paid hours. Which probably boils down to about what normal salaried people are doing on a given week. They just get their pay in random lumps. But to your point, I wouldn't consider any of that to be "easy".....certainly not as easy as airline pilot
 
///AMG said:
I'm sure that is well within reach in a hot market, given the 3% or 6% they pull. But that is a LOT of damn work. Not the actual work of closing, but the work of getting the work in the first place. There has to be an insane ratio of unpaid vs paid hours. Which probably boils down to about what normal salaried people are doing on a given week. They just get their pay in random lumps. But to your point, I wouldn't consider any of that to be "easy".....certainly not as easy as airline pilot
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It's not...been there, done that...it's a $h!t ton of work, and stupid long hours. Even with working somewhere that has a program in place, streamlined procedures, and people that help coordinate all the transaction stuff...it's a pain.

There for a while, people in Seattle were putting 7-8 offers on houses before they got an offer accepted.
 
SurferLucas said:
There for a while, people in Seattle were putting 7-8 offers on houses before they got an offer accepted.
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Hah we contacted a realtor about the house we ended up buying on Whidbey. We were in Washington DC on a family trip at the time, while we were still living in VA, I think maybe in Dec 2019. Just wanted to know more info. Realtor was like, "put an offer in now". We didn't quite do that, but we found a friend local to the house to have a look and photo/video record it for us the next day. And then we put in an offer. Laughably, we offered below asking. I think what we got was asking, but with a seller credit towards closing costs. But in hindsight, she was 100% right. This house wouldn't have sat for more than 5 days on the market. And it is amazing that they accepted our eventual offer at all. They allowed a home inspection too. I remember watching the ridiculous spectacle of realtor showings of our neighbors houses in 2020-2021, you'd count a new car/family every 30 mins for an entire weekend, and they sold after a bidding war in like 2 days. Spoiler alert, only old boomers with cash won. So we now have only old people in our neighborhood.

Anyway, good to know. I hadn't thought about becoming a real estate agent, but now I will never think of it. But I never thought of it because it has always sounded like a lot of hours spent hustling for nothing.
 
///AMG said:
Hah we contacted a realtor about the house we ended up buying on Whidbey. We were in Washington DC on a family trip at the time, while we were still living in VA, I think maybe in Dec 2019. Just wanted to know more info. Realtor was like, "put an offer in now". We didn't quite do that, but we found a friend local to the house to have a look and photo/video record it for us the next day. And then we put in an offer. Laughably, we offered below asking. I think what we got was asking, but with a seller credit towards closing costs. But in hindsight, she was 100% right. This house wouldn't have sat for more than 5 days on the market. And it is amazing that they accepted our eventual offer at all. They allowed a home inspection too. I remember watching the ridiculous spectacle of realtor showings of our neighbors houses in 2020-2021, you'd count a new car/family every 30 mins, and they sold after a bidding war in like 2 days. Spoiler alert, only old boomers with cash won. So we now have only old people in our neighborhood.

Anyway, good to know. I hadn't thought about becoming a real estate agent, but now I will never think of it. But I never thought of it because it has always sounded like a lot of hours spent hustling for nothing.
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I got my broker's license in WA State back in 2020 when things looked like they were going to hell in a handbasket, and real estate was going gang busters...like, you just needed a license and half a brain, and you'd sell 2-3 houses a month.

When we got our house in 2021...it came on the market on a Wednesday, we saw it Thursday evening...Sunday we did a pre-buy inspection and Monday our offer won. It was stupid fast, but we were lucky enough to be pre-approved and pre-underwritten, so we could close faster than the other offers.
 
zmiller4 said:
Leave the profession for what though?

Unless they either have a somewhat lucrative side or family business they can walk into or reaaaaally hate the job—which I hope they wouldn’t given the time and effort it takes to get to a major—my guess is that walking away from a major is going to lead to a lot of regret.

There’s simply very, very few fields that offer equivalent compensation and quality of life right now…especially ones that most pilots will be able to plug into quickly.

Even most regionals’ starting pay is close to the median household pay for a bachelor’s degree, with major CA pay doubling the median for those with a professional degree.
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A lot of people who worked a lot harder to get to a 121 cockpit than a lot of these kids left after 9\11 and the RJ apocalypse of the 2000s to follow. If you went from no driving interest to become an airline pilot to mainline pilot in 5 years or less, and you are part of an instant gratification generation in an era where a lot of the country is very expensive to live in...there will be a lot of people that don't come back if we had a 9/11 type hit. I'd bet money on it.

Hell, I know plenty of people who did get into flying with realistic expectations who I seriously think would quit tomorrow if they could maintain a similar level of income with travel perks. Imagine a mid-to-late 20s legacy FO who first touched a plane a few years prior getting a tech job or something during a 1+ year furlough and adjusting to being home and having a more normal social life. I seriously know more people than I can count who started training and got hired at a major in the same decade now(6-8 years). When I got my PPL, SkyWest had a 7-year upgrade still...easy come, easy go.
 
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derg said:
Ok, Generation Z, stop filming your 'slickback dance' video and let us know if you'd take Cherokee.
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I’m 1984, millenial by birth.

But I identify as a boomer :)

@SteveC when you’re old and alone in Michigan, you let me know and imma drop by and join the boomer campfire. We can bring dacuj too for added hilarity. :)
 
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