Furlough Estimates

CFIT99 said:
We are furloughing the highest percentage of any US carrier after being told dozens of times that were ready to take market share and run classes of 30 in August...we have 4 more planes to be delivered this year. The FA’s have been offered long term leaves BUT nothing has been offered to the pilots...we knew some kind of furlough was inevitable (around 8-10%) but not 32% ( 63% of the FO’s). I just didn’t add up and everyone was blown away by it.

the email from the union have stated that we have several more tools to use to mitigate furloughs but we have yet to hear from the company
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PSA has announced about 36% to be furloughed so far. 730 out of 2000ish. Hopefully none of us see the actual number of furloughs match the WARN letters that have gone out.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Will any airline actually provide furlough pay? Don't almost all contracts have an exception for Act of God / Natural cause?
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I think at B6 as part of the agreement we reached, (no furloughs/allowing AA codeshare) that they would pay any furloughed pilots after May ‘21 if due to the Covid pandemic.

That would be 6 months pay for me...
 
Baronman said:
I think at B6 as part of the agreement we reached, (no furloughs/allowing AA codeshare) that they would pay any furloughed pilots after May ‘21 if due to the Covid pandemic.

That would be 6 months pay for me...
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Yep. That's true. Part of the most recent LOA 'clarified' furlough pay and which of the two charts would be used after 30Apr21. IMHO it helps with future mitigation as the "break even" point gets pushed out a few more months. Basically looking at July '21 (all the way to Dec '21) load factors/block hours for min staffing for the 2nd half of next year. (depending on the longevity of the pilot)
 
DeltaAlphaNovember said:
I'm sure AA will want us to pay them furlough pay while we are out. Someone has to pay for all those nice new shiny buildings in Dallas. Or maybe APA will ask for more money to pay for that building in D.C.
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A friend of mine had a good idea. Your 0.5% of the negotiating dues to go into a COBRA/furlough chest, since there wont be any meaningful negotiating in the foreseeable future
 
BigZ said:
A friend of mine had a good idea. Your 0.5% of the negotiating dues to go into a COBRA/furlough chest, since there wont be any meaningful negotiating in the foreseeable future.
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See, I read this the first time and I got all annoyed at what I perceived to be your ignorance. But then I realized that most line pilots have no idea how the sausage actually gets made.

I've been doing more negotiating work over the last 4 months than I did during peak section 6 (except for maybe the final week) at two different properties. Just because pilots aren't getting pay raises and QOL improvements doesn't mean the union volunteers aren't doing stuff.
 
BobDDuck said:
See, I read this the first time and I got all annoyed at what I perceived to be your ignorance. But then I realized that most line pilots have no idea how the sausage actually gets made.

I've been doing more negotiating work over the last 4 months than I did during peak section 6 (except for maybe the final week) at two different properties. Just because pilots aren't getting pay raises and QOL improvements doesn't mean the union volunteers aren't doing stuff.
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I wonder what the percentage of pilots that give to the ALPA PAC is? I've only been paying for a couple years (I elected to pay as soon as I was on the property) but damn if that wasn't the absolute best investment I have ever made.

As far as I see it my union dues have already paid for themselves for my entire career. PAC as well.
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
I wonder what the percentage of pilots that give to the ALPA PAC is? I've only been paying for a couple years (I elected to pay as soon as I was on the property) but damn if that wasn't the absolute best investment I have ever made.

As far as I see it my union dues have already paid for themselves for my entire career. PAC as well.
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Century club
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
I wonder what the percentage of pilots that give to the ALPA PAC is? I've only been paying for a couple years (I elected to pay as soon as I was on the property) but damn if that wasn't the absolute best investment I have ever made.

As far as I see it my union dues have already paid for themselves for my entire career. PAC as well.
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If you ask your government affairs committee, they can tell you the percentage, at your carrier at least. There's a trophy that gets past around for highest PAC participation every year.
 
BobDDuck said:
See, I read this the first time and I got all annoyed at what I perceived to be your ignorance. But then I realized that most line pilots have no idea how the sausage actually gets made.

I've been doing more negotiating work over the last 4 months than I did during peak section 6 (except for maybe the final week) at two different properties. Just because pilots aren't getting pay raises and QOL improvements doesn't mean the union volunteers aren't doing stuff.
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So, as I too am ignorant of the sausage making process, if you don’t mind answering some questions...

If you weren’t in contract negotiations pre covid, would the union dues go up 0.5% during turbulent times such as these that require increased negotiation? If not, would you be reimbursed less for the hard work you’ve put in? Or would the union be adversely affected by the lack of increased union dues?

I also don’t know what 0.5% comes out to be, but do you think the union members are getting more out of that $$ than they would if it was in a “cobra/furlough” Fund?
 
HobGoblin said:
So, as I too am ignorant of the sausage making process, if you don’t mind answering some questions...

If you weren’t in contract negotiations pre covid, would the union dues go up 0.5% during turbulent times such as these that require increased negotiation? If not, would you be reimbursed less for the hard work you’ve put in? Or would the union be adversely affected by the lack of increased union dues?

I also don’t know what 0.5% comes out to be, but do you think the union members are getting more out of that $$ than they would if it was in a “cobra/furlough” Fund?
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I'm at an alpa carrier and have no idea what the .5% is. I'm guessing that's an APA assessment for contract negotiations? If it's in addition to the normal dues and specifically geared towards building a Section 6 war chest, just because times are bad, doesn't mean that you suddenly don't have to negotiate a new contract. The RLA doesn't care if the company is profitable or not.

As far as if the funds are worth it... I don't know what the specific payscales are, but for a mid to junior FO making $120K a year, who might be getting furloughed, it sure seems worth $600 a year to ensure you've got a full team working on furlough and displacements mitigation options and another team doing contract enforcement as the company tries to cut corners to save cash.
 
I would not mind paying the extra .5% if our union was not such a joke. The furlough mitigation they unanimously voted on is total garbage. But that is just my opinion.
 
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