Eighteen Year Restoration - Then This

[Kingairer]

I have no problem with these vintage aircraft still flying. However, these deals where its "come take a ride in a vintage XXX", that has to stop. I know enough not to get on one of those things but the average joe public (and son) dont....Oh, and some of the biggest asses ive flown with have been warbird pilots.

 

[L-16B]

I have no problem with these vintage aircraft still flying. However, these deals where its "come take a ride in a vintage XXX", that has to stop. I know enough not to get on one of those things but the average joe public (and son) dont....Oh, and some of the biggest asses ive flown with have been warbird pilots.

Yeah warbird guys can think their you know what doesn’t stink. I’ve talked to many about how they got into it and how much volunteer time and all that stuff. A lot of it sounds political. I know my dad and his buddies in the confederate/commemorative Air Force back in the day all got fed up with the process.

 

[Bob Ridpath]

At what point do we decide it’s acceptable to relegate these things to a museum? Sure, it isn’t as cool as seeing them flying around....but do they still NEED to be flying around for us to remember history?

How many Sopwith Camels are still flying around? Or any WW1 aircraft for that matter? Are we just as upset about that as we are with some of these legacy WWII aircraft? The

I just don’t get it the outrage.

Can’t speak to anywhere else, but we’re hugely fortunate here in Dutchess County: Old Rhinebeck Aerodrome

 

[Kingairer]

Yeah warbird guys can think their you know what doesn’t stink. I’ve talked to many about how they got into it and how much volunteer time and all that stuff. A lot of it sounds political. I know my dad and his buddies in the confederate/commemorative Air Force back in the day all got fed up with the process.

My theory is, flying a warbird is probably considerably labor intensive. Flying an Airbus is not. But if you are the type that likes to fly warbirds, you like do the hard work of flying, and try to apply that same ideology to flying an Airbus and they end up trying to make something that is easy, hard, to make themselves feel like a hero. Also, I think old aircraft engine oil does something to the brain that makes them political extremists.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I have no problem with these vintage aircraft still flying. However, these deals where its "come take a ride in a vintage XXX", that has to stop. I know enough not to get on one of those things but the average joe public (and son) dont....Oh, and some of the biggest asses ive flown with have been warbird pilots.

Yup.

It isn’t an equivalent level of safety. It’s not even close. And the LHFEs are literally designed so that it isn’t an ELOS.

 

[MikeD]

One large problem is that the warbird movement contains its fair share of Walter Mitty types, guys who want to play military pilot never having been one or been through the training. These particular types want to be able to dress the part of fighter pilot, and they are wealthy so they have the dollars to not only do that, but to purchase a high dollar, and high performance, warbird to complete the picture.

Unfortunately like their wealth, they possess an equally large (or larger) ego that doesn’t allow them to have any realization that their knowledge, skill, abilities, training and currency may not be where it needs to be for having the SA to be piloting aircraft of this caliber, even though more experienced people may be telling them so. They end up getting themselves into a square corner that they can’t get themselves out of, resulting in killing themselves, killing others in the air or on the ground, and/or destroying an irreplaceable aircraft.

Have seen it happen before, 10 years ago at my old former airfield in fact, where a guy matching the above destroyed a warbird and morted himself in the process.

 

[Richman]

Even the sharp, dedicated, “academic” guys just have bad luck.

Jeff Ethel was one of the guys who preached safety and training, day in and day out, but still wound up a statistic.

May he RIP.

 

[Roger Roger]

Even the sharp, dedicated, “academic” guys just have bad luck.

Jeff Ethel was one of the guys who preached safety and training, day in and day out, but still wound up a statistic.

May he RIP.

I mean, I get what you’re saying about any of us being one bad day away from a statistic, but running a tank dry at low level is hardly “bad luck”.

 

[MikeD]

Even the sharp, dedicated, “academic” guys just have bad luck.

Jeff Ethel was one of the guys who preached safety and training, day in and day out, but still wound up a statistic.

May he RIP.

It does happen. Kind of like the guru of running, Jim Fixx; died of a heart attack while out on a run.

But these guys are usually the exception, the purely bad luck ones who are otherwise sharp and standards-oriented, who know their limitations.

 

[L-16B]

I mean, I get what you’re saying about any of us being one bad day away from a statistic, but running a tank dry at low level is hardly “bad luck”.

Maybe bad luck in being born with poor judgment or never having developed good judgment?

 

[Richman]

It does happen. Kind of like the guru of running, Jim Fixx; died of a heart attack while out on a run.

But these guys are usually the exception, the purely bad luck ones who are otherwise sharp and standards-oriented, who know their limitations.

It usually takes more than one singular thing to take down one of the sharp guys. Any one could be managed successfully.

It’s usually a bad confluence of events, like a thrown rod, a prop that won’t feather and a hydraulic system that picks that very time to piss itself. Usually those types of deals only work themselves out through a healthy dose of providence.

 

[FlySooner9]

One large problem is that the warbird movement contains its fair share of Walter Mitty types, guys who want to play military pilot never having been one or been through the training. These particular types want to be able to dress the part of fighter pilot, and they are wealthy so they have the dollars to not only do that, but to purchase a high dollar, and high performance, warbird to complete the picture.

Unfortunately like their wealth, they possess an equally large (or larger) ego that doesn’t allow them to have any realization that their knowledge, skill, abilities, training and currency may not be where it needs to be for having the SA to be piloting aircraft of this caliber, even though more experienced people may be telling them so. They end up getting themselves into a square corner that they can’t get themselves out of, resulting in killing themselves, killing others in the air or on the ground, and/or destroying an irreplaceable aircraft.

Have seen it happen before, 10 years ago at my old former airfield in fact, where a guy matching the above destroyed a warbird and morted himself in the process.

meh same could be said for the 60 hour super rich guy that goes and gets in a turbine airplane or HP twin and geta way over their head. (Especially before all this push a button and the plane will land itself stuff)

 

[NovemberEcho]

At least thIs crashed TBMs location is known.

Fun fact, this TBM is actually in the same markings as the flight lead for Flight 19

 

[MikeD]

Fun fact, this TBM is actually in the same markings as the flight lead for Flight 19

I want to find the one missing up in the northeast part of the state here. That’s a cool fun fact though, very interesting irony:

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

While we are at it, we should ban people from exploring the backwoods of the National Parks. Let the public view the Grand Canyon from the safety of the visitors center. No one needs to hike to the bottom just for the thrill or bragging rights.*


Something is missing from your soul if you call yourself a pilot and the sound of a Mustang doesn't inspire you.


* If I had it to do all over again, I still would have told my wife to go. A life without adventure is a life wasted.

People are all but banned from the backwoods of National Parks. Future plans are downright scary.

"This strategy narrowly focuses on trails and unpaved roads that do not play an integral role in the park’s mission and are already in poor condition. Candidate assets would not be located in popular park destinations and should have low utilization, although this has not been verified at the park level. The assets would be allowed to return to nature and would no longer be maintained by the NPS or any volunteer organizations. Nature would reclaim the areas over time."

https://www.pewtrusts.org/-/media/assets/2019/05/protecting-our-parks-report_low-res.pdf

 

[FlyingAccountant]

One large problem is that the warbird movement contains its fair share of Walter Mitty types, guys who want to play military pilot never having been one or been through the training. These particular types want to be able to dress the part of fighter pilot, and they are wealthy so they have the dollars to not only do that, but to purchase a high dollar, and high performance, warbird to complete the picture.

Unfortunately like their wealth, they possess an equally large (or larger) ego that doesn’t allow them to have any realization that their knowledge, skill, abilities, training and currency may not be where it needs to be for having the SA to be piloting aircraft of this caliber, even though more experienced people may be telling them so. They end up getting themselves into a square corner that they can’t get themselves out of, resulting in killing themselves, killing others in the air or on the ground, and/or destroying an irreplaceable aircraft.

Have seen it happen before, 10 years ago at my old former airfield in fact, where a guy matching the above destroyed a warbird and morted himself in the process.

There was a guy who killed himself out of FFZ a few years ago in an AT6 with a paying passenger aboard. IIRC, he was an AA pilot as his day gig.

 

[Low&Slow]

Should probably put a stop to all current and future military demonstration teams too. They were colliding with each other and with the planet on the regular before the pandemic put a stop to it.

 

[fholbert]

Should probably put a stop to all current and future military demonstration teams too. They were colliding with each other and with the planet on the regular before the pandemic put a stop to it.

This too, it's only a matter of time...

 

[Low&Slow]

This too, it's only a matter of time...

View attachment 58824

Yeah, those guys are INSANE!

 

[deadstick]

There are ZERO reasons that these World War II airplanes should still be flying.

Put them indoors in a museum.

...also pilots over 60 years old.

The FAA tried this with Bob Hoover. If the standard is met, carry on.

Can you imagine what AARP would do if everybody over 65 had to take an annual driving test?

One large problem is that the warbird movement contains its fair share of Walter Mitty types, guys who want to play military pilot never having been one or been through the training. These particular types want to be able to dress the part of fighter pilot, and they are wealthy so they have the dollars to not only do that, but to purchase a high dollar, and high performance, warbird to complete the picture.

Unfortunately like their wealth, they possess an equally large (or larger) ego that doesn’t allow them to have any realization that their knowledge, skill, abilities, training and currency may not be where it needs to be for having the SA to be piloting aircraft of this caliber, even though more experienced people may be telling them so. They end up getting themselves into a square corner that they can’t get themselves out of, resulting in killing themselves, killing others in the air or on the ground, and/or destroying an irreplaceable aircraft.

Have seen it happen before, 10 years ago at my old former airfield in fact, where a guy matching the above destroyed a warbird and morted himself in the process.

Sounds like the original CAF — everybody is a colonel, too.