Cockpit View of Idaho Plane Crash

[RICHARD5]

One thing that went "right" was that he didn't try to pitch up to out climb the trees and stall - if he had.....well, the outcome ptobably wouldn't have been as good as it was..

Just a minor observation.

Bp244

I don't think that is minor. Great observation! Quite possibly it was a life or death decision whether made conciously or not. Dropping in from that agl alt would have been even more tragic.

 

[RICHARD5]

inigo88, what I found particularly maddening is after that incredibly long take off roll and bounce he had to have seen the approaching trees. It even appeared he tried to bank left until he realized he lost alt in the turn. So instead of fixing it, perhaps he fixated on the trees. Obviously the pilot was motivated to outclimb the obstacle. Wishful thinking...like stretching a power off glide. I wonder if not for the trees would he have arrived to the scene of an even more tragic outcome?

 

[RICHARD5]

Sorry, I'll stop... Not really.

Enjoying yourself? Keep it rolling, this is entertaining. Indulge us.

 

[RICHARD5]

I don't get it. A Stinson 108 on a hot day with four people up high - it won't work right. I don't get why he'd continue.

Me neither. Consider a hot day at elevation, moderate dehydration, fatigue, brain fizzle. What human factors supported a motivation to continue inspite of numerous red flags? Concerned wives back at home? Whiney passengers? Lack of food? Zombies on war path? Bears chasing them?

This budding Jedi didn't have the force.

 

[fholbert]

New item for my check list:

• After accident destroy all video evidence.

 

[fholbert]

I just do not understand how pilots "forget" to lean.

Not only lean for taxi out, don't go full rich when landing. At Big Bear (6700') you see planes clearing the runway trailing black smoke.

 

[MikeD]

Didja ever see the Connies at Havasu? As part of his real estate business McCollough used three Constellations to fly in persons interested in buying lots in his new city.

BTW: the last vestiges of that airfield were rendered invisible in 2008. That was when the site was graded for new homes. The old terminal was torn down later that year and so ended every trace of that field. I do have LA sectional charts from 1964 which clearly show the A-N routes and Site Six.

For some reason, I seem to remember the old "short" Connies......749 series.

Thats too bad the old airport is gone. And yes, old Site Six at the penninsula tip.

 

[rframe]

I believe this was near Stanley, Idaho. Elevation is 6,500'.... I do not know what the temp was at the time of the crash, but even at a moderate 80F, density altitude would be over 9,000'.

If that wasn't enough of a clue, the rule is you have at least 70% of flying speed by the time you reach 50% of your takeoff run or you abort

If that wasn't enough of a clue, the 20 foot per minute climb might've caught his attention.

I generally don't like to make assumptions about other pilots, but this guy was an idiot.

 

[Champcar]

The density altitude issue is one thing, but he clearly is flying towards rising terrain the entire time. At what point do you listen to your puckering arse, swallow your pride, and put the thing down safely when you have the chance?

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

I couldn't keep watching the video after the first bounce. It was like watching a train wreck in slow motion. I'm glad no one was killed. A couple of rules of thumb I discovered after I nearly did the same thing about 6 years ago.

100hp per person in the mountains. No exceptions. If you can't take what you need due to this rule, don't go.

Always walk the field and know the terrain. That's what saved me.

*my near accident was due to high winds aloft interacting with terrain near the departure end of the runway. It wasn't evident on landing.

 

[z987k]

Not only lean for taxi out, don't go full rich when landing. At Big Bear (6700') you see planes clearing the runway trailing black smoke.

There is an article I read in some flying magazine about a 400 series cessna crossing the rockies(at night) up at some flight level. He experiences an engine failure in one engine and (as trained) immediately goes mixtures props throttles all full. Other engine quits. He feathered the first one, but left the second windmilling. Lucky that he did because when he had glided down to about 7000', the windmilling engine restarts. By pushing full mixture way up high, he flooded the engine enough to kill it. Didn't restart until it could burn again.
Moral - THINK!

 

[z987k]

I couldn't keep watching the video after the first bounce. It was like watching a train wreck in slow motion. I'm glad no one was killed. A couple of rules of thumb I discovered after I nearly did the same thing about 6 years ago.

100hp per person in the mountains. No exceptions. If you can't take what you need due to this rule, don't go.

Always walk the field and know the terrain. That's what saved me.

*my near accident was due to high winds aloft interacting with terrain near the departure end of the runway. It wasn't evident on landing.

100hp per person? Are you kidding me? So a 150hp 7GCBC is inadequate for mountain flying?
100hp 7AC?

 

[Ajax]

A rule of thumb that was taught to me: if you aren't within 10kts of rotation speed at your halfway mark shut it down. Then again I fly in TX, I have high temps but not real high elevation or comparative DAs, so it's easy for me to say. I have no mountain flying experience or training(so if this isnt accurate or safe let me know, I'd love to learn a bit more), but I would use the performance charts plus a nice +10-15% insurance policy

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

100hp per person? Are you kidding me? So a 150hp 7GCBC is inadequate for mountain flying?
100hp 7AC?

This mostly applies to high wing all metal aircraft that starts with C. 1 person in a 150 or 172, 2 in a 182 etc...

Its a rule of thumb. That means it doesn't apply to everything and you have to use your brain a little to apply it. So yay for you, you found an exception to my rough guide line rule of thumb. Do you want a merit badge?

 

[Nark]

If you haven't flown in mountainous regions, why do you think your 'rules of thumb' work?

For those reasons above, is why I didn't fly with lower48 pilots up front with me.
You don't know what your talking about, then are quick to pass judgement.

This dude crashed because of any number of reasons.

 

[JayAre]

Dumbass.

Easy there cowboy you will be warned with that tone of voice...unless your in the circle

 

[Cptnchia]

Do you want a merit badge?

Got one if you need it.

 

[Ajax]

If you haven't flown in mountainous regions, why do you think your 'rules of thumb' work?

Simple, because we don't know any better, and some rules of thumb work out fairly well. Just because I have been taught a rule of thumb doesn't mean I would count on it saving me, if I were to do it I would do plenty of research and get some proper instruction beforehand.

 

[z987k]

This mostly applies to high wing all metal aircraft that starts with C. 1 person in a 150 or 172, 2 in a 182 etc...

Its a rule of thumb. That means it doesn't apply to everything and you have to use your brain a little to apply it. So yay for you, you found an exception to my rough guide line rule of thumb. Do you want a merit badge?

Well it doesn't work in a 172 either.... or a 182.... or a 206.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

If you haven't flown in mountainous regions, why do you think your 'rules of thumb' work?

For those reasons above, is why I didn't fly with lower48 pilots up front with me.
You don't know what your talking about, then are quick to pass judgement.

This dude crashed because of any number of reasons.

Is this directed at me? If so, how do you know anything about my background? Just wondering