Beech 1900 versus Metroliner

[Dan208B]

I concur with a lot of this information. Being ex-ameriflight they're both good aircraft. So, take the money and schedule first. But if it is AMF (or if its not) and those are equal, I'd personally suggest the Metro. A lot of folks would disagree with me on this, but particularly if you're coming from the BE-99, it is a more challenging aircraft single-pilot. Not an airplane you should have any problem with, but a great airplane for skill-building. The 1900 is certainly an easier "comfy" airplane to fly, but the metro is a good plane. As far as "street-cred" goes... well, I think it's not as much of a consideration as it used to be because not many folks are flying metros around anymore. However, I've talked to several people that have interviewed at desirable "career" companies over the last few years and have been asked about their metro time in a good way. One person had a chief pilot ask him how it was to fly single-pilot, as he felt like it was a busy airplane 2-crew. Anyways, do whatever you feel is best. There isn't a right answer here. You'll be happy with either airplane and when you make the choice, there are plenty of folks on here that can help you with either airplane if you have any questions. Best of luck!

 

[Tommay85]

I've never flown a metro but unless an engine fails you shouldn't need anything but a castering nosewheel.

In my experience airplanes with Garretts were designed for a pilot. Airplanes with pratts were designed for lawyers.

It doesn't caster like the 99. The nose gear is staight up and down and the axel isn't very far behind the pivot point. Not impossible, but it requires more thinking ahead and annoying people outside even more. Landing is exactly the same down to about 40 knots and after that, lots of braking is required to keep it straight. Taxiing can be a bish too. At least for me so far. Brakes aren't a high point on the metro.

 

[Tommay85]

I concur with a lot of this information. Being ex-ameriflight they're both good aircraft. So, take the money and schedule first. But if it is AMF (or if its not) and those are equal, I'd personally suggest the Metro. A lot of folks would disagree with me on this, but particularly if you're coming from the BE-99, it is a more challenging aircraft single-pilot. Not an airplane you should have any problem with, but a great airplane for skill-building. The 1900 is certainly an easier "comfy" airplane to fly, but the metro is a good plane. As far as "street-cred" goes... well, I think it's not as much of a consideration as it used to be because not many folks are flying metros around anymore. However, I've talked to several people that have interviewed at desirable "career" companies over the last few years and have been asked about their metro time in a good way. One person had a chief pilot ask him how it was to fly single-pilot, as he felt like it was a busy airplane 2-crew. Anyways, do whatever you feel is best. There isn't a right answer here. You'll be happy with either airplane and when you make the choice, there are plenty of folks on here that can help you with either airplane if you have any questions. Best of luck!

I think the issue is that there's not many "old people" that are on hiring boards that have metro(or 1900 time, or old POS airplane time for that matter) anymore. If they did, I feel like that'd be an instant connection. Children of magenta just don't know. I'm a child of magenta, and I sure as heck didn't know! ​

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I don't jumpseat often, but am often asked about about "that single pilot metro stuff" we(Ameriflight) do. No answer until now. Training and more importantly, valuable previous experience is how. I've personally found that once your senses get "immune to the newness", it's just another airplane. The majority of the ADM habits, knowledge, and skills have transferred from previous airplanes/jobs.​

 

[Cass]

Hundo.

 

[spbrian]

The 1900 or the SA227 will land you both the same job when you leave AMF, it will come out to how you sell yourself and the experience you gained while flying either airframe. Therefore, the deciding factors are what you want out of your time in either airplane. There are many bases where there is only one 1900 and many SA227's, so being in that airplane will offer you some different places to go. Also with 46 SA227's, you may be able to go to TDY depending on need and visit different places.

Training also needs to be thought about, the 1900 cockpit will look highly familiar, and except for a few extra systems checks that the BE-99 does not do (CLIP CHECK, etc. etc.) the systems will feel very familiar and the cockpit more so. Also a bonus is that you will train in a full motion simulator which AMF does not do for the 1900. When you go on to the next job and step foot into a full motion sim, having the knowledge of how it messes with your inner ear and generally how the simulators fly does help to prep for future training.

The SA227 looks like nothing you have ever seen before, and except for the tail numbers ending in DH (244DH, 245DH, etc0) each airplane is slightly different than each other airplane.. Also each airplane can have highly different operating characteristics, which can help to keep you on your toes.

Operating the airplane will require a slightly deeper knowledge of systems than the 1900, the airplane will tell you when it breaks and what breaks but you have to understand how the system is supposed to work to know when some of them go wrong. it's not difficult, but just know that a few systems do not have annunciator lights indicating that they are broke.

I have spent a great many years around that airplane and it has been a great plane that I still enjoy flying.

 

[Tommay85]

The 1900 or the SA227 will land you both the same job when you leave AMF, it will come out to how you sell yourself and the experience you gained while flying either airframe. Therefore, the deciding factors are what you want out of your time in either airplane. There are many bases where there is only one 1900 and many SA227's, so being in that airplane will offer you some different places to go. Also with 46 SA227's, you may be able to go to TDY depending on need and visit different places.

Training also needs to be thought about, the 1900 cockpit will look highly familiar, and except for a few extra systems checks that the BE-99 does not do (CLIP CHECK, etc. etc.) the systems will feel very familiar and the cockpit more so. Also a bonus is that you will train in a full motion simulator which AMF does not do for the 1900. When you go on to the next job and step foot into a full motion sim, having the knowledge of how it messes with your inner ear and generally how the simulators fly does help to prep for future training.

The SA227 looks like nothing you have ever seen before, and except for the tail numbers ending in DH (244DH, 245DH, etc0) each airplane is slightly different than each other airplane.. Also each airplane can have highly different operating characteristics, which can help to keep you on your toes.

Operating the airplane will require a slightly deeper knowledge of systems than the 1900, the airplane will tell you when it breaks and what breaks but you have to understand how the system is supposed to work to know when some of them go wrong. it's not difficult, but just know that a few systems do not have annunciator lights indicating that they are broke.

I have spent a great many years around that airplane and it has been a great plane that I still enjoy flying.

The annunciator panel in the metro was WAY ahead of it's time. The metro isn't outdated compared to the 1900/king air. The metro/merlin design is so superior, it didn't need to be updated all the way through until the last unit was produced in 2003. No really, money aside, the merlin/metro is superior to beechcraft.

I don't know about the full motion sim being an advantage though. The metro sim just feels like you're in light chop if things are going nasty.

 

[Tommay85]

If you're flying beechtrash now the metro might show you can handle different airplanes. Plus king airs have to be the most boring thing to fly. I really do hate it. When they talk about pilots falling asleep flying they're talking about king airs.
If you do fly a fly a garrett you'll know why we love them the first time you taxi it. You'll love them once you're in the air.

I think you should add how much you think the 99 is similar to the king air.

 

[spbrian]

I don't know about the full motion sim being an advantage though. The metro sim just feels like you're in light chop if things are going nasty.

Some individuals have had a real issue with it the first half hour or so in the box, especially the level B sim for the SA227. It does a poor job replicating ground handling and acceleration/deceleration logic that will mess with your inner ear if you think about it. Having the feeling down from prior experience can make the first time in a level D sim a little easier to get used to and faster to get past the something isn't right feeling.

I have at least 100 hours in the hot seat of that level B SA227 sim and possibly a couple thousand in the back of it and it feels exactly the same as the two different level D sim's I have been in within the last 8 months..

 

[Tommay85]

Some individuals have had a real issue with it the first half hour or so in the box, especially the level B sim for the SA227. It does a poor job replicating ground handling and acceleration/deceleration logic that will mess with your inner ear if you think about it. Having the feeling down from prior experience can make the first time in a level D sim a little easier to get used to and faster to get past the something isn't right feeling.

I have at least 100 hours in the hot seat of that level B SA227 sim and possibly a couple thousand in the back of it and it feels exactly the same as the two different level D sim's I have been in within the last 8 months..

That's interesting. Looking accross the room at the Q400 sims and then the poor metro sim hidden in the corner(should be out in the lobby, showcasing it's badassness ) with, what looks like, A LOT less capability, I would think it'd be different. Though, I can't say we did any sims with the door open, nor would I have been looking back to see what it was doing.

 

[z987k]

The Level D sim I've been through flies better than any other sim I've ever flow. The motion I could take or leave but it was possible to trim it out and it was possible to hand fly without looking like a moron.

I think you should add how much you think the 99 is similar to the king air.

I pretty much hate beechcraft at this point so.... I'm note sure they could make a good airplane if Ed Swearingen, Ted Smith or even Burt Rutan designed it for them. If it were possible to never fly one of their products again, I'd be happy. Unfortunately, there seems to be some money in it, so as long as they keep paying me, I'll keep flying the piles of crap.

 

[Tommay85]

The Level D sim I've been through flies better than any other sim I've ever flow. The motion I could take or leave but it was possible to trim it out and it was possible to hand fly without looking like a moron.



I pretty much hate beechcraft at this point so.... I'm note sure they could make a good airplane if Ed Swearingen, Ted Smith or even Burt Rutan designed it for them. If it were possible to never fly one of their products again, I'd be happy. Unfortunately, there seems to be some money in it, so as long as they keep paying me, I'll keep flying the piles of crap.

Haha, all my FLX brethren will probably say they liked the 210. I HATED it except for the 15 minutes after take off and before landing. It was a fun airplane during those times. The 1.5 hours in between I wanted OUT! Particularly on those Wichita nights. STP-OMA-ICT-OMA-STP in a 210 meant ZERO nap time. Naptime is my favorite time. In the LeBaron, I could get 2 hours of sweet recliner and/or Marlboro time. However, the Chrysler flew like crap compared to the 210. Between the Baron and the 99, I'm not a fan of beechcrap either.

I'm such a nerd that even AMF pay doesn't bother me one bit to fly an airplane on my bucket list. If someone hires me to fly a Gulfstream III/IV/V/550/650/Citation X/757/727/L-1011/MD-XX afterwards, all is well. If not, #$%@!

 

[LucasM]

Honestly, it's similar to asking if a 1988 Honda civic with a manual transmission is better than one with an automatic. Personally, I prefer the manual (metro), and i think it is likely more fun then the automatic (1900), but both are worth zilch anymore. The automatic may have a bit more resale value, but it's worth 1200 bucks vs. the 5 speed worth 900. I have 5,000 hours in a metro and have been offered jobs in both 1900's and king airs, so the metro time is not worthless. If you want to move into more advanced equipment quickly, neither is the way to go. Both likely have 6 packs and limited avionics. Moving to Delta from either airframe, although not theoretically impossible, is highly unlikely anymore without glass time. That being said, part of the reason I've been flying a metro for 7 years is I truly love it. I honestly get excited to go to work almost every Monday (a line of storms from Canada to Mexico will kill that feeling, but it wouldn't matter what I was flying). I absolutely love it. It make me happy to fly.

As far as glass time goes, would the EMB-120 count for any of that? Considering SkyWest flies them they can't be all bad, right?

 

[JayAre]

As far as glass time goes, would the EMB-120 count for any of that? Considering SkyWest flies them they can't be all bad, right?

I hear the FAA rejected AMF's request for single pilot authorization in the Bro. The Feds are wussies......

 

[JayAre]

Back to Doug's question!
Yeah it's nothing more than a big dick contest at AMF on both planes on which is better.
Outside of AMF..... no one cares
I hear it every morning from the metro pilots how bad ass and better their plane is. They generally shut up during really crappy weather when I'm at FL230 with a load of ice and they are struggling to climb thru 15000 in the ice. But they are fast and loud!

 

[KLB]

As far as glass time goes, would the EMB-120 count for any of that? Considering SkyWest flies them they can't be all bad, right?

I have to admit that the Bro is a fine flying machine. I don't enjoy it as much as the metro, but it's not bad at all.

 

[KLB]

Back to Doug's question!
Yeah it's nothing more than a big dick contest at AMF on both planes on which is better.
Outside of AMF..... no one cares
I hear it every morning from the metro pilots how bad ass and better their plane is. They generally shut up during really crappy weather when I'm at FL230 with a load of ice and they are struggling to climb thru 15000 in the ice. But they are fast and loud!

The metro can get up there! It would just take a bit of time. I've buzzed around at FL230 and more on a daily basis.

 

[SpiraMirabilis]

Metroliner vs 1900... at Ameriflight they pay you the same on either airframe which means they are exactly the same.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I hear the FAA rejected AMF's request for single pilot authorization in the Bro. The Feds are wussies......

Erm, well, you can't free-fall the gear from the left seat, which is a pretty valid thing for the Feds to freak out about, and the type certification requires two pilots as well.

And sure you CAN fly it single pilot in normal operations, but you probably shouldn't, since normal operations have a habit of becoming abnormal every once in a while.

I have to admit that the Bro is a fine flying machine. I don't enjoy it as much as the metro, but it's not bad at all.

It really is. It's hell for stout and designed to be maintained by the Third World. Me likey.

 

[derg]

Real airplanes have round engines. If you don't have a blown jug or two under your belt go home!
Be18's used to be the lexicon of freight dogs. What has this world come to?

Modern turbine engines?

I remember when whips were meant to be used alongside a horse drawn carriage. Now they're something that goes along with a "safe word". What HAS the world come to?

 

[derg]

99 is just an 18 with backwards engines and training wheels.

The preferred nomenclature is "reverse flow turbine".

Good day, SIR!