250 knots below 10,000

[KLB]

When? Never even heard of such a thing.

At XOJET we generally blazed through the area at 250 encouraged by ATC.

Also I did hear people get admonished by ATC for slowing to early.

IIRC the 200 below bravo applied when one descends from 4000 to 3000 on the west to east arrival....

After making all the crossing restrictions while being asked to slow or speed up +\- 100 knots of course.

LOL

Yeah. The class bravo doesn't start until 1800ft out of there. So of course the biggest deal with it is while departing 24 and leveling at 1500ft. But flying a light 300 and going the other way can get sporty if you're slacking also. Haha

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Yeah. The class bravo doesn't start until 1800ft out of there. So of course the biggest deal with it is while departing 24 and leveling at 1500ft. But flying a light 300 and going the other way can get sporty if you're slacking also. Haha

Well one must always be careful crossing DANDY on the ILS for one of the approaches. If you follow the glideslope of the ILS you basically get a warning letter.

I forget the waypoint to level at 1500' on the departure but yeah lol plan on at least knowing what happens when the FMS takes you there.

NO SLEEP TILL BROOKLYN!!!

 

[KLB]

Well one must always be careful crossing DANDY on the ILS for one of the approaches. If you follow the glideslope of the ILS you basically get a warning letter.

I forget the waypoint to level at 1500' on the departure but yeah lol plan on at least knowing what happens when the FMS takes you there.

NO SLEEP TILL BROOKLYN!!!

Yep! And don't trust VNAV to level ofF like it should!

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Yep! And don't trust VNAV to level ofF like it should!

OMG

"Hey at least wait until we leave NY airspace to get buried in your iPad."

 

[spbrian]

Curious what the FAA folks are taught about what they can get away but here is a legal interpretation from 2010. In brief, the Chief Counsel does not believe that the administrator grants an ATC controller the ability to waive the 250 KAIS below 10,000 feet rule except for within class D or below Class C airspace. So without there being a performance reason elsewhere and not one of just not willing to fly the plane dirty it should be at 250?

http://www.faa.gov/about/office_org/headquarters_offices/agc/pol_adjudication/agc200/interpretations/data/interps/2010/seltzer - (2010) legal interpretation.pdf

Amended my above statement for underneath class C or within class D airpsace.

 

[jtrain609]

Even a heavier MD-90 has a clean speed above 250.

When SLC changed the departure procedure speed restrictions because the CRJ's loved to fly below 250 in initial, it was havoc. Nothing like an extended climb burning gas with the slats out because they didn't sequence departure traffic appropriately (IMHO).

I'm not entirely sure why the 230 knot restriction exists, since every time I check in with departure I always get normal speed an an unrestricted climb to FL230.

 

[derg]

I'm not entirely sure why the 230 knot restriction exists, since every time I check in with departure I always get normal speed an an unrestricted climb to FL230.

My pilot math brain remembers before the restriction, they'd issue a lot of "don't exceed 230 for in trail spacingl" and then it showed up on the departure procedures a few years later.

"Pilot Math Brain" means that I accept that I have a myopic perspective on a much larger picture and I may be talking straight out of my ass!

 

[ClarkGriswold]

I'm not entirely sure why the 230 knot restriction exists, since every time I check in with departure I always get normal speed an an unrestricted climb to FL230.

Because the controllers in SLC suck?

 

[amorris311]

Because the controllers in SLC suck?

Rainman!

 

[NovemberEcho]

Well one must always be careful crossing DANDY on the ILS for one of the approaches. If you follow the glideslope of the ILS you basically get a warning letter.

I forget the waypoint to level at 1500' on the departure but yeah lol plan on at least knowing what happens when the FMS takes you there.

NO SLEEP TILL BROOKLYN!!!

Dandy is a 1500' ft mandatory crossing restriction to keep you under EWR departures off of 4. The TEB Ruudy departure off 24 has you cross Wentz at 1500 to keep you clear of EWR 22 arrivals descending to 2500 above you. The only pilot deviations I've ever filed were guys busting the SID and climbing to 2000 or even worse 3000 straight through EWR final. One of those (Mexican Air Force Gulfstream) was one of the scariest things I've seen, especially since the bastard was lost in frequency land between the switch from tower to departure.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Dandy is a 1500' ft mandatory crossing restriction to keep you under EWR departures off of 4. The TEB Ruudy departure off 24 has you cross Wentz at 1500 to keep you clear of EWR 22 arrivals descending to 2500 above you. The only pilot deviations I've ever filed were guys busting the SID and climbing to 2000 or even worse 3000 straight through EWR final. One of those (Mexican Air Force Gulfstream) was one of the scariest things I've seen, especially since the bastard was lost in frequency land between the switch from tower to departure.

Ah WENTZ that's it. Royer!

Haven't visited the Best Western for a while now. I'm forgetting the important stuff:

LVZ at FL180
WENTZ
DANDY

don't mess up the circle to land

Rutherford has an awesome breakfast place.

Cheers mate! I'm still in the game!

 

[derg]

Because the controllers in SLC suck?

I think they're just a little behind the power curve that we're not flying metros and classic 737's. I'll give them a single runway change outside of a 15 circle of the airport. I got changed four times and ended up on the cusp of conducting a missed.

Hell, the last time it was cleared LDA/DME 35, about 5 miles out "Do you have the airport?" "yeah" "Cleared visual 34R, traffic on a 3 mile final" "Unable"

Advantages at that point: Nothing.

 

[derg]

And I had to call the tower supervisor after my "unable" to explain to him why.

New co pilot, required going 'heads down' to make a bunch of changes so FiFi is happy, laterally displace, find that traffic, make sure spacing is appropriate AND he hopefully gets off the runway and doesn't do the "new regional pilot aerobrake" upon landing, just too much.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I think they're just a little behind the power curve that we're not flying metros and classic 737's. I'll give them a single runway change outside of a 15 circle of the airport. I got changed four times and ended up on the cusp of conducting a missed.

Hell, the last time it was cleared LDA/DME 35, about 5 miles out "Do you have the airport?" "yeah" "Cleared visual 34R, traffic on a 3 mile final" "Unable"

Advantages at that point: Nothing.

Count me amongst the guys doing them zero favors as well.

Switching us to the other runway on a 7 mile final doesn't save us anything, and might cost us a lot.

 

[PhilosopherPilot]

Greater than 250 below 10k is cool, if more than twelve miles offshore. Done it a hundred times, it is specifically mentioned in the FLL/MIA arrivals.

Maybe MikeD can verify, but I'm told that the F-5 is also a member of the +250 below 10k club for operational considerations.

The HPN departure also has a max speed for turning radius, probably sound too.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Depends on your SOPs. Ours specifically prohibit 250 below 10,000 even when the regs allow it.

 

[KLB]

Depends on your SOPs. Ours specifically prohibit 250 below 10,000 even when the regs allow it.

Wow! Even when off the shores of South Florida on an arrival? You guys are messing up the flow in the conga line.

 

[derg]

Wow! Even when off the shores of South Florida on an arrival? You guys are messing up the flow in the conga line.

Turn that radar on, draw the coastline and speed of heat until you enter US airspace! Although I haven't done that in quite some time.

 

[KLB]

Turn that radar on, draw the coastline and speed of heat until you enter US airspace! Although I haven't done that in quite some time.

I don't even have to jack with the radar. You'll see if you ever get a chance to ride on that new bombardier product you guys are getting. That thing makes beautiful moving maps with all types of geopolitical stuff on it.

 

[Cptnchia]

Depends on your SOPs. Ours specifically prohibit 250 below 10,000 even when the regs allow it.

Nothing like getting a "high speed authorized" climbing out of Aruba or St Maarten

 

[PhilosopherPilot]

Wow! Even when off the shores of South Florida on an arrival? You guys are messing up the flow in the conga line.

Yup. It's illegal for us to fly >250 below 10,000 feet in any circumstance.