Yay Jumpseat Wars!

yup, then kiss your regional routes goodbye.....the regionals are stuck in between a rock and a hard place on this one, definitely!

you'd expect fair play but honestly, UAL has the upper hand because they are the ones that feed you and they are the ones that can take that food away if you don't play nice.

so it's a nice idea, to be able to fight fire with fire, but in all reality, what's it going to get you when you bite the hand that feeds?
I guess we could just give up and allow our jumpseat to be co-opted by UAL and whichever other UAX carrier they want. Maybe next they'll not allow us to non-rev on our own aircraft.

UAL has an agreement with its UAX carriers, which it has breached. UALPA MEC is complicit in this situation and has decided that there is no downside to violating our agreements. This action has come after negotiations have stalled, with UALPA MEC taking the side of UAL. I have now had conversations with a couple UAL pilots who agree that UALPA MEC needs to stop its support of this violation of our jumpseat agreement.

I do not like this situation, and UAX pilots did not cause it.
I hope that cooler heads will prevail, but sometimes you have to get someone's attention before they will listen to reason.
 
I guess we could just give up and allow our jumpseat to be co-opted by UAL and whichever other UAX carrier they want. Maybe next they'll not allow us to non-rev on our own aircraft.

UAL has an agreement with its UAX carriers, which it has breached. UALPA MEC is complicit in this situation and has decided that there is no downside to violating our agreements. This action has come after negotiations have stalled, with UALPA MEC taking the side of UAL. I have now had conversations with a couple UAL pilots who agree that UALPA MEC needs to stop its support of this violation of our jumpseat agreement.

I do not like this situation, and UAX pilots did not cause it.
I hope that cooler heads will prevail, but sometimes you have to get someone's attention before they will listen to reason.

Agreed Dale. The whole situation sucks, but what else can we do? Our hands are tied. I count on UAL weekly to get to work, but I am willing to risk some hardship for what is right. What is so hard in honoring an agreement?

I have no problem giving mainline guys #2 priority on our jumpseat over other UAX carriers. Makes sense to me. Perhaps cooler heads will prevail and everything will work out. In the meantime things might indeed get interesting on 7/31.
 
Don't get me wrong, i'm not saying just give in....I'm pretty much saying what Bike21 is in that your hands are tied....you need to show optimum performance and professionalism to keep your lines, so do that....let the MECs duke this out for you. It's really not a great idea to take it to ground floor *right now* with the way things are going in the industry... you have people there to do that dirty work, use them so you can keep showing UAL that your bird is worth keeping around despite the inner turmoil.
 
The MEC's have been "duking it out" for over two years now... and the only thing that has happened is we've gone backwards.
 
I see your point, but what hasn't been properly pointed out is that it has been in the hands of the MECs for a loooong time. They have failed all of us.

Every channel has been exhausted, tempers have flared at JS committee meetings, ALPA national has been notified, etc. The letter that is currently being passed out does come off very strong. Well so be it. Just because we are the contract feed doesn't mean we won't stand up for what is right. It sucks being crapped on the way it is, let alone having a simple software issue and a few egos prevent our own pilots from getting a ride on our own jumpseat.
 
When I was a commuter I almost ALWAYS knew when there were other jumpseaters looking for a ride. I'd be willing to bet that more than one UAL guy knew there was a UAX guy there and still went down when called. In that way, they are not taking personal responsibility for their actions.

As a regional Captain, I finally started taking my potty break up in the terminal. Got everything ready then hopped up to go to the bathroom upstairs. I did this so if there was a problem I could try and solve it and bypass the gate agents. We didn't have this problem but we had lots of agents that didn't let jumpseaters down and then told them the Captains were denying them for weight and balance issues. All of this was so they didn't have to deal with them.

The UAL guys know what is right in this situation, they need to take some responsibility for it and allow the UAX guy the seat. On another note, try to identify other jumpseaters and TALK to each other. I once gave up the jumpseat to a guy because he was two legging and I had another flight in an hour I knew I could get on. He would have been stuck at the stop if he took that one so I let him have it. So stop peering at the others like they are your mortal enemy and talk to them. You would be surprised how you can work things out like that.
 
ahh i see, i thought this was just the beginning....that stinks knowing it's been going on for so long.
 
rjmore -

Well said. I am not seeing anyone as my enemy, that is a certainty. This is not a personal thing for me. I have offered to give up a seat and have had a UAL guy offer the same to me. This is about keeping everyone honest and letting the few bad apples know that we are serious about holding up our end of the agreement.

I go into the terminal nearly every leg and personally check to see if there are any pilots wanting to JS. Sometimes the gate agent tells the truth, and sometimes I get half-truths. For instance, there are jumpseaters but the agent is only telling me about his/her favored jumpseater. As you said, gate agents will often deny JS'ers on the basis of W&B issues without talking the captain first. That is another issue, but along the same lines of poor guys/gals unable to get work because of some BS issue.
 
Why would gate agents do that? what's their beef?

Lots of reasons...

Power trip, laziness, ignorance, actually not knowing, not caring...

The list goes on. At a lot of hubs it's hard to keep good labor around when they don't pay much more then minimum wage.
 
Kristie, I wish I knew. I've had an agent on her radio tell the agent up at the gate that I had said no to the jumpseater. Problem was, she didn't ask me. She also didn't know that I was standing right behind her when she made her radio call, she was looking out the window of the jetway door.

A lot of agents are very jealous of the jumpseat privilege and think they should have it too. Since they can't get it, they mess with it.
 
are you permitted to write them up? if so, then that could be leverage.

If you're a "express" pilot, you'd get laughed at.

The gate agents tend to openly mock the smaller planes (I've even heard them complain about working a 737 instead of a 767 before), and bad mouth express operations in front of customers.

Mainlines talk about seemless service and the importance of building a brand up to the point where the rubber meets the road. I've seen gate agents at a mainline tell express customers of the same brand, "That's not our flight, you need to go over there" (pointing to express gates)

I even got denied as a pilot of a regional on the jumpseat of another flying for the same carrier (DL)

I only witnessed this in the DL, US, UAL systems, though.
 
are you permitted to write them up? if so, then that could be leverage.

I made sure that the other agent and the jumpseater knew what she had done and reported her to the company.

I don't deal with that mess anymore since my current company doesn't have jumpseaters.
 
I don't see denying the UA pilots the jumpseat as a win. It's just going to piss off United. All the regionals involved need to get their captains to start regulating jumpseat riders. Screw the computer program. Whomever is operating that flight, their pilots get on first, UA second and the others on down the line. If there are UA or other pilots jumpseating and are onboard, but your own guys are sitting up in the terminal waiting, get things situated to reflect the correct priority per the contract. Tell the UA or other carrier jumpseaters that your sorry but your carriers pilots come first per the contract. If they have a problem take it up with their MEC and jumpseat commitee.
 
If there are UA or other pilots jumpseating and are onboard, but your own guys are sitting up in the terminal waiting, get things situated to reflect the correct priority per the contract. Tell the UA or other carrier jumpseaters that your sorry but your carriers pilots come first per the contract.

Again, the problem is that this isn't always possible. Gate agents control access to the captain, and if the captain is busy on a quick turn there may be no way for them to know the on-line pilot is getting bumped.

If they have a problem take it up with their MEC and jumpseat commitee.

Been done, apparently didn't help. I don't really like this course of action and would have liked to see a less-threatening letter to hand out first, but I don't blame the folks organizing this.
 
SAPA has a JS commitee?

(Serious question. . .)

Also, has SAPA recently become recognized by the NMB? (Also a serious question)
 
SAPA has a JS commitee?

(Serious question. . .)

Our JS committee is more of one very dedicated individual with a few helpers. They are doing a great job and stay on top of a lot of issues. So yes, we do have one.

Also, has SAPA recently become recognized by the NMB? (Also a serious question)

Not yet.
 
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