What Keeps you at a 135?

Derg said:
If you get a check with an appropriate amount of zeroes, why the deuce were you on Jerry Springer opposite that rotund lady screaming about you not being a real man because you don't pay your child support?

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(Heavy amounts of :sarcasm: )
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Didn't you see? It wasn't his.

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Dugie8 said:
Did medivac for 8 years.

Although one should never say never in aviation.

Never again.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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I'm curious as to why you say this. I have found medevac much more enjoyable than pax and the QoL is fairly good with above NBAA average pay.
 
Never had a desire to work for an airline. My goal has always been a 91 job but in my area of the country right now there's no stability there and the 135 company I'm at now offered a more steady paycheck, good experience, and the opportunity to have half the year off to do 91 contract work.

I see a lot of talk about job security online but it doesn't seem to me from looking at the past that going 121 is guarunteed success either.

My first job as a pilot paid more than I would make at a regional for a couple years, then I made some moves pretty quickly that increased my pay even more. At this point I do what, take a big pay cut for the next couple years to do a job that never interested me? With no guaruntees when I'll upgrade, that I could make it to a major, or that the airline I decide to make a career at is going to be able to take care of me until retirement? There could always be furloughs, bankruptcies, economic downturns, etc.

The few jobs I've had I got because people knew me and liked me. I didn't have the times they said they wanted, but I was the kind of person they were looking for and the chief pilot/owner told me that face to face. I like that, and I'd like for all of my future jobs to come about as a result of someone asking me to come work for them because they know me rather than sending in a resume and crossing my fingers. It's definitely a control/fear thing, based on being unemployed outside of aviation because an online application didn't separate me from the people they hired instead. I hated the way that made me feel and that's a big reason why I don't want to enter a system where I would feel like just a number.

My eyes are wide open to how 135/91 gigs work, but I've enjoyed my short career so far, have been extremely lucky with the opportunities I've gotten, and haven't had to deal with a scumbag operator. I'm also fine with having to change jobs for a pay raise and understand that when I get that dream 91 job it could be gone in 3 years. That's just my personality.

I've never failed a checkride, gotten a DUI, killed a hooker, or crashed an airplane btw.
 
Lots of money can be made at a 91/135 in the short term even when compared to a major airline. But the conversation stops when you look 10 years ahead. Too many people look at the short term benefits and ignore the long term.
 
Inverted said:
Lots of money can be made at a 91/135 in the short term even when compared to a major airline. But the conversation stops when you look 10 years ahead. Too many people look at the short term benefits and ignore the long term.
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I think it also has to do with being ridiculously easier to get hired at a 91/135 and then those have to pump their ego saying they can't take a paycut to goto a major (that they can't get a call from).
 
Inverted said:
Lots of money can be made at a 91/135 in the short term even when compared to a major airline. But the conversation stops when you look 10 years ahead. Too many people look at the short term benefits and ignore the long term.
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Precisely why I've changed my mind a bit on going 121...I'm considering heading to an airline sometime in the next 6 months.
 
Inverted said:
Lots of money can be made at a 91/135 in the short term even when compared to a major airline. But the conversation stops when you look 10 years ahead. Too many people look at the short term benefits and ignore the long term.
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1. Compound interest.

2. I know a handful of guys who make "good money" part 91 even compared to major airline captains.

3. Aren't there guys who've gotten stuck in the right seat of certain regionals for close to 10 years. How much money are they losing out on in that 10 years, and hasn't it happened in the past that guys go somewhere with a 2-3 year expected upgrade that somehow turned into much longer?
 
mikecweb said:
I think it also has to do with being ridiculously easier to get hired at a 91/135 and then those have to pump their ego saying they can't take a paycut to goto a major (that they can't get a call from).
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I won't rule out ever trying to go the airline route, but expecting to never hear a peep from a major is a big part of my thinking. I don't have a degree and am never planning on spending the money on one so I'm automatically stuck with the prospect of career regional captain.
 
Inverted said:
Lots of money can be made at a 91/135 in the short term even when compared to a major airline. But the conversation stops when you look 10 years ahead. Too many people look at the short term benefits and ignore the long term.
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Reference my (probably TL;DR) post earlier, but a lot of people have forgotten just how bad things sucked 8 years-ish ago when the only career progression in sight at the 121 airlines was, well, 8 years of slogging it out in the right seat of an RJ (a la @Screaming_Emu ) busting your butt to make 40-50 a year and hoping to avoid a furlough and maybe even starting again at a new seniority list. Under those circumstances the guys that stumbled into some of the more decent 135 jobs looked like they hit the jackpot and the preachers of the coming pilot shortage were still looked on with skepticism.
 
Bonanzaman said:
1. Compound interest.

2. I know a handful of guys who make "good money" part 91 even compared to major airline captains.

3. Aren't there guys who've gotten stuck in the right seat of certain regionals for close to 10 years. How much money are they losing out on in that 10 years, and hasn't it happened in the past that guys go somewhere with a 2-3 year expected upgrade that somehow turned into much longer?
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The last 10 years screwed everyone. Let's talk about now and beyond. For somebody looking at a career in aviation and you're 25 years old or so and you have the time to be competitive flying jets in 135/91 or go to a regional and have a short stey before going to a major in this market, there is absolutely no comparison that can be made to where going 91/135 is more financially beneficial. Obviously the economy will dip again, nobody can predict the future. But holding onto a job at 120k for the next 40 years because you're worried that the airlines will furlough is again, short sided.

The amount of 91 jobs where you make 250k and get good retirement, benefits and good QOL can be counted on 1 hand and I bet only a couple of members of JC at best have jobs like that. It's a simple Numbers game. Sure everyone would love to fly a G650 only 10 days a month, make 300k, full pension after 30 years and full benefits paid, who wouldn't? Just go ahead and show me that flight department :)
 
Bonanzaman said:
I won't rule out ever trying to go the airline route, but expecting to never hear a peep from a major is a big part of my thinking. I don't have a degree and am never planning on spending the money on one so I'm automatically stuck with the prospect of career regional captain.
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Competitive hiring criteria changes. In 5 years who knows what a competitive applicant will have on his or her resume. I don't know if a single respectable 91 flight department that will hire you without a degree.
 
Roger Roger said:
Reference my (probably TL;DR) post earlier, but a lot of people have forgotten just how bad things sucked 8 years-ish ago when the only career progression in sight at the 121 airlines was, well, 8 years of slogging it out in the right seat of an RJ (a la @Screaming_Emu ) busting your butt to make 40-50 a year and hoping to avoid a furlough and maybe even starting again at a new seniority list. Under those circumstances the guys that stumbled into some of the more decent 135 jobs looked like they hit the jackpot and the preachers of the coming pilot shortage were still looked on with skepticism.
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Again though, nobody saw that company to the severity that it hit with. And for those that schleped it in an RJ for 8 years, where are they now? I now lots of pilots that crawled through he weeds during the recession and most have leftcto legacies/majors. Because of the recession, the competitive applicant median is the 7,000 hour RJ pilot lol.

Making more money at a 135 is again, a short term gain. I'm not saying it's a bad thing, it's what I did for goodness sake. But that decision has cost me in the long run I think.
 
Inverted said:
The last 10 years screwed everyone. Let's talk about now and beyond. For somebody looking at a career in aviation and you're 25 years old or so and you have the time to be competitive flying jets in 135/91 or go to a regional and have a short stey before going to a major in this market, there is absolutely no comparison that can be made to where going 91/135 is more financially beneficial. Obviously the economy will dip again, nobody can predict the future. But holding onto a job at 120k for the next 40 years because you're worried that the airlines will furlough is again, short sided.

The amount of 91 jobs where you make 250k and get good retirement, benefits and good QOL can be counted on 1 hand and I bet only a couple of members of JC at best have jobs like that. It's a simple Numbers game. Sure everyone would love to fly a G650 only 10 days a month, make 300k, full pension after 30 years and full benefits paid, who wouldn't? Just go ahead and show me that flight department :)
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I see your points. I don't disagree with anything you're saying, I still don't have a desire to go 121 at the moment and as I said above I more than likely don't have a shot at making a major anyway. Were I giving advice to someone wanting to get into this career I'd tell them what you're saying, but the topic of the thread was why am I personally at a 135, and those are just my own personal reasons.
 
Inverted said:
Again though, nobody saw that company to the severity that it hit with. And for those that schleped it in an RJ for 8 years, where are they now? I now lots of pilots that crawled through he weeds during the recession and most have leftcto legacies/majors. Because of the recession, the competitive applicant median is the 7,000 hour RJ pilot lol.
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Oh I know, lots of guys are getting their reward for putting in work now. I'm just pointing out that there was at one time a good reason to go 135, and it's not out of the realm of reality that some guys might have got comfortable there, maybe been able to make the place a little better, live somewhere they want, etc and even the prospect of going to an LCC if they're qualified might be daunting. And some are as previously discussed completely disfunctional.
 
Inverted said:
Competitive hiring criteria changes. In 5 years who knows what a competitive applicant will have on his or her resume. I don't know if a single respectable 91 flight department that will hire you without a degree.
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I don't know many people on JC, and I don't know what 135 and 91 operators are like around the country, I just know the area I am in which is unique I think.
 
Bonanzaman said:
I see your points. I don't disagree with anything you're saying, I still don't have a desire to go 121 at the moment and as I said above I more than likely don't have a shot at making a major anyway. Were I giving advice to someone wanting to get into this career I'd tell them what you're saying, but the topic of the thread was why am I personally at a 135, and those are just my own personal reasons.
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I totally get what you're saying. I'm not trying to convince you or anyone to do something you don't wanna do. There is something for everyone in aviation.
 
Roger Roger said:
Oh I know, lots of guys are getting their reward for putting in work now. I'm just pointing out that there was at one time a good reason to go 135, and it's not out of the realm of reality that some guys might have got comfortable there, maybe been able to make the place a little better, live somewhere they want, etc and even the prospect of going to an LCC if they're qualified might be daunting. And some are as previously discussed completely disfunctional.
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Oh I get it. Look at NetJets! NetJets should be renamed to "the land of disenfranchised airline pilots." The vast vast vast majority of pilots here are all 135 die hards because of the industry taking a dump. It is filled with ComAir, ACA and Midway pilots. And of course other commuters that furloughed or died. Now lots of them are anti 121 and think NetJets is the greatest but that has more to do with them being put on the street more than it actually being better.
 
Inverted said:
I totally get what you're saying. I'm not trying to convince you or anyone to do something you don't wanna do. There is something for everyone in aviation.
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That's why I love this career and can't imagine having the type of jobs some family members and friends have. I have worked as a pilot only in my hometown because I don't want to move, but if I wanted I could move anywhere in the country. I could go fly for the airlines, carry freight, charter, corporate, air ambulance, there's lots of very different jobs with different duties and schedules and I can pretty much pick whichever one gels with me.

I can't imagine going back to working in an office.
 
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