What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio?

Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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Maybe of all regional pilots just stopped working for a few weeks.......that might send the message.



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Yeah...maybe we should..that'll bring the wages up..of course, it won't affect your pay any......but, you couldn't be bothered with regional pilot pay anyway, because apparently when you (MikeD) were born a pilot the pay was alot better, we just ruined it for you so you chose another route
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Ruined it for me? I have nothing to do with the regionals and won't have anything to do with them. So I have no personal dog in this fight. I have no use nor need for the regionals.

If YOU want to work for crap wages because that's all you feel you're worth, then go on living on Top Ramen all you want. It's no skin off my hide, slappy.

I guess you feel that making the same wages as a McDonalds manager, while having 500 times the responsibility, is fine with you.

Maybe if you really read what I was saying, you'd see I was on the side of the pilots, and speaking against regional airline management.

Because these days, regional pilot responsibility, qualification, training, and equipment is very nearly equal to the majors. So why is there a pay disparity? It's because of all the starry-eyed, I've-got-my-white-shirt-and-three-stripes, which-I'd-do-even-for-free mentality people like you.

Nitwit.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

O.K. I've never posted here before, but felt compelled. I have lurked here for a while, and feel I know most of you personally ( I actually do know some of you). My personal circumstances are a litlle different, and will not be discussed in this forum, but there are some things that need to be said. If you want to be an Airline Pilot, there are many paths that lead to that. If you want to cut your teeth flying scary Barons in scary weather, then go do it. If you are one of the lucky few who fall into a good Pt. 91 or 135 flying job, best of luck. The "good ones" are hard to come by, and you should jump all over it. For some of us, we chose the Flight Instruction route. It has been said that you never actually know anything until you have taught it. That may or may not be true, but it has certainly honed my knowledge. DCA placed nearly 120 Instructors at Airlines in 2004. This number equals 100% of the instructors that had the initiative to complete what they signed up for. Many of these were not hired on their first attempt, but continued to get the assistance of the Academy, long after their "guaranteed" interview was taken. I'll be the first to tell you that we have problems at the Academy. We are scrambling to fix things that have been broken for a while. That is not good business. However, the system works. Just ask 120 FO's. Granted they won't make great money this year, but it will get better. If anyone gets into flying thinking that they are doing it for the money, then they haven't done ANY research. We do it because we love it. Having the opportunity to eventually make great money is a perk. School teachers make terrible money, but love their jobs. Every option has pros and cons. You have to make the decision to accept the bad to achieve your goal. No other Flight School can mathc DCA's placement numbers, so think before you decide that it is a bad place to be.
Sorry so long winded. Got the most out of my first post.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

"No other Flight School can mathc DCA's placement numbers"

I think you meant to say match. Anyhow, far more pilots get on at regionals from the multitudes of smaller flight school programs than from DCA. If DCA placed 120 pilots in a year and 2400 pilots got hired at the regionals last year, that would be 5% from DCA. Hardly an impressive number after you view the DCA website and marketing, which makes the newbie masses believe that DCA is the only way to an airline seat. After all, being owned by Delta gives you THE connections.

If you want to fix something, fix the marketing so that it doesn't give heartburn to people who have been in the business a while.

Welcome to jetcareers.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

Regional Airline Pay is horrible, however i guess since coming out of the high cost training at DCA it doesnt bother me and others and we are willing to accept the crappy pay because we know after being hired we can get trained and type rated in a Jet for free
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. I personally only want to fly for the airlines for the flight privealages, i think youd be insane to get in this for the money. My best friend works for a Tugboat company, no degree, he just turned 21 and is making over 50 thousand a year. More than any FO at any regional. Hes not even a pilot or captain, he just loads and unloads, and i dont think he is over paid i think airline pilots are underpaid and i dont see how anyone could argue. On another note, i think CFI pay is ridiculous too, i mean we CFIs work hard, long hours and most of us are fortunate to only pay the bills, maybe we CFIs made more we wouldnt be so quik to go to accept the low pay at the regionals
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Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

There are thousands of Flight Schools in the country. If all of them put one instructor in the airlines last year, and DCA put 120, you would have your 2400. Don't forget that many of the "new hires" by Regionals last year were furloughed 121 pilots, and many more were 135 pilots, you only leave a portion of them coming from flight schools. My point was that no other flight school can say that they placed 120 of their instructors at Regional Airlines last year, or that 100% of their instructors WERE hired.
As far as the marketing is concerned, what company doesn't stress the good and down play bad in their Marketing? I'm not saying that it is right, but it is business. Do you really believe that "White Strips" will make your teeth white in just 3 applications? Of course not. For a few people tested, it only took 3 applications, but for most, it took many more, which cost more. Honesty in advertising is a pipe dream. Let's be realistic.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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If YOU want to work for crap wages because that's all you feel you're worth, then go on living on Top Ramen all you want. It's no skin off my hide, slappy.


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I don't think anyone WANTS to work for crap wages, but coming from driving a logging truck down the highway in a snowstorm with 160,000 lbs. strapped to my back for $10/hour carries a little responsibility as well.....Some would view this as a step in the right direction!

Maybe I am a part of the cancer in the system that keeps us working for low wages (I'm sure farewars and fuel costs might play a little part as well) but, my smalltown - doesn't need $200,000 a year to have a life - perspective, gives me hope for the future and keeps me happy.

P.S.- Sorry about the personal attack earlier, just shot from the hip on that one
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Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

ATP has placed 51 instructors with airlines already this year. That beats DCA.... and for half the money...and with better equipment.... Next...
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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If YOU want to work for crap wages because that's all you feel you're worth, then go on living on Top Ramen all you want. It's no skin off my hide, slappy.


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I don't think anyone WANTS to work for crap wages, but coming from driving a logging truck down the highway in a snowstorm with 160,000 lbs. strapped to my back for $10/hour carries a little responsibility as well.....Some would view this as a step in the right direction!

Maybe I am a part of the cancer in the system that keeps us working for low wages (I'm sure farewars and fuel costs might play a little part as well) but, my smalltown - doesn't need $200,000 a year to have a life - perspective, gives me hope for the future and keeps me happy.

P.S.- Sorry about the personal attack earlier, just shot from the hip on that one
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No problem. Heck, I fully agree that a logging truck driver should make more than $10 per hour. The point I'm attempting to make is not so much the "what's the lowest wage I make a living on," but the concept of airline CEOs that will take and take and take, thinking that pilots are dime-a-dozen drones, and require no more trainning than a customer-service rep. I'm not saying pilots should be able to finanacially rape the company, but let's talk some decent wages for the training, responsibility, and daily work of these guys. We're a little more than just an expensive insurance policy (how some people see firefighters...until they need them!). That's my only point. The over-saturation of the industry is a big problem, and not one easily solved.....that is, too many pilots looking for too few available slots; kind of tough to convince people of solidarity there, and not too good of a bargaining position against these CEOs, when there's Joe and John just-met-the-mins-for-hiring pilot just waiting to work for a lower wage..
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Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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ATP has placed 51 instructors with airlines already this year. That beats DCA.... and for half the money...and with better equipment.... Next...

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I was about to point that out - I'm even less of a fan of ATP than DCA but if placement is your goal, ATP is getting more pilots hired and faster than DCA. It's hard to beat that much multi time on your resume!
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

"ATP has placed 51 instructors with airlines already this year. That beats DCA.... and for half the money...and with better equipment.... Next..."

Yeah, I figured more guys got hired out of ATP. The quoted 120 figure being the best doesn't sound right to me. Sounds like more marketing hype.

Highflyr....if you got quote from the DCA website, I wouldn't believe it anymore than the rest of the "it's just business" stuff.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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DCA placed nearly 120 Instructors at Airlines in 2004

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Out of how many enrolled into the program? (that was my original question that began this 10 page behemoth of a thread)
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

Sorry, I was one of the mouths that hijacked your thread.....and I don't have the answer to your question..... I just know that I enrolled and I got hired.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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. My point was that no other flight school can say that they placed 120 of their instructors at Regional Airlines last year,

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Only 120? How many students enrol every month. About 40-50. That leaves a percentage LARGE not making it! Of course by the time they find out, it is already too late. Their money has been taken.

That's why I got out and went to an FBO. And got hired by an airline. As did most, if not all, of the other instructors that worked there.

Next.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

The current count for DCA this year is over 60, i saw the list today and know most of the guys personally. Cost etc. might be more, the multi time might be more, I won't, and can't argue those points, but sheer numbers of guys getting hired is apparently better here if jaxpilot's numbers are correct. Just wanted to make sure everyone had the right numbers...

No, I am not going to list the names or anything like that as proof. I am sure I would get in loads of trouble for that. You will all have to trust me as a semi-frequent, always honest, contributor to this thread that I know what I am talking about.
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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Will this thread EVER DIE?
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It's been dead for a month...but congradulations DOCTOR...you just brought her back to life
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Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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"No other Flight School can mathc DCA's placement numbers"

If DCA placed 120 pilots in a year and 2400 pilots got hired at the regionals last year, that would be 5% from DCA. Hardly an impressive number after you view the DCA website and marketing, which makes the newbie masses believe that DCA is the only way to an airline seat. After all, being owned by Delta gives you THE connections.

I

Welcome to jetcareers.

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Well, I feel that with the vast number of flight schools in the country, 5% is quite an accomplished number. Especially when you consider those coming from part 135 jobs, furloughed high-timers, and part 91 charters. For one school to have 120 of its people hired by an airline in one year is a figure I have not seen at any other flight school. If there is one out there that matches, I would love to know of it.

Also, we must take into account the period of time somebody can go from 0 time to right seat. I know it's longer than marketing projects, but it is still impressive. Everybody these days wants their cake and they want it NOW! Nobody is willing to be patient anymore for what they aspire to be. I have friends fresh out of college whining and moaning because they are not making $50,000. COME ON! Give me a break! A wise ex-girlfriend told me once that "Patience is a Virtue", though I didn't listen to her then, I believe that I do now.

Anyways, I know I'll catch major flak for the above comments, so batter up!


"White people hate Wayne Brady....Because....He makes Brian Gumble....Look like Malcom X"
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

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"White people hate Wayne Brady....Because....He makes Brian Gumble....Look like Malcom X"

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WOW, I can't even make my own joke work right!

"White people LOVE Wayne Brady...."

Damnit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

Montana!

As far as I know, people drop out in the first three courses. Private, Instrument and Commercial...

My PP class had 14 people enrolled. 4 people quit in the very first two weeks. One got so sick on the airplane that she decided it wasn't for her. Others simply were not expecting to have to do so much work.

I was shocked when I became an instructor to the amount of people that do not take the program seriously enough. From trying to use old take-off data cards ,to not being ready for flight lessons and even brag about being stoned on a cross country... you name it and people will try to get away with it. For those in that category I have no compassion whatsoever.

Of Course there are people that got the short end of the stick and it was not deserved, but those are few and they fall in the statistics of any service business.

Some of the guys complaining here I know personally and I know their story, the one they won't tell here. And they better not, for their own pride.

If you are not ready to give it all you got, and study real hard, get ready to be posting here in the future, whining about how life and DCA are unfair...

And for those that say that my situation is different... I was a regular instructor when I started, just like you. A little positive attitude and motivation go a long way.



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Re: What is the Enrollment vs actually Hired ratio

I think Pan Am Academy will come close or even beat DCA's hire numbers. On their web site, they claim to have over 20 students hired at the same regional airline during one month alone. You have to dig into the "news release" section to find the facts.
 
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