The slowly death of General Aviation in the U.S.

Cost, simple as that. I'm very grateful that I get to fly for a living, because if I wasn't, I wouldn't be flying. I love meeting people at different airports who actually fly their own, old airplanes. But the majority of people I run across are wealthy businessmen flying brand new Cessna's, Cirrus' and the like. I know ALL of you have probably had friends say "Hey, how much would it cost to take us to [insert destination here] for the weekend?" And I know ALL of you have seen their jaws hit the floor when you tell them how much it'll actually cost. When I can grab a JetBlue ticket for $150 and go to FLL roundtrip, there's no contest.

Many flight schools also have a minimum hour policy if you take their plane for the entire day. While training I got to know everyone at the FBO, and the manager (my old boss now) let me take an airplane all day to Block Island a couple times without charging me a minimum rental time. If I wasn't a regular, it would have cost me at least $550 just for the plane because of that rule. For that much money, I'd rather drive and catch the ferry.

To compare hobbies, this past year I've taken up riding the track with my motorcycle, and while still more expensive than some hobbies, it still doesn't compare to aviation. I bought a used leather suit for $400 that will now last me until I either get fat, or crash. Then it's $200/day to ride a track event, and that's a full day of riding. Even my gf understands that $200/day is a heck of a deal compared to nearly $200hr just to rent an airplane, and it's an absolute blast to do. I'm at the point where I'd much rather go to the track than go to the airport and burn my entire days budget in an hour and a half.
 
Used lance $80k, new 172 $300k. Hmmmmm

Can take my whole gaggle of kids in the Lance, two trips in the 172.

Who the heck is buying the new Cessna other than flight schools
 
jafra98 said:
So it's a combination of different things. I thought the sport pilot rules was going to help the industry but if you see what they are charging for a LSA this days is insane. In the 60's, 70's and early 80's a common person with a decent job could buy an airplane, now with a Cessna starting at almost $300,000 only for the airplane is unthinkable for the average guy to just think about it...............
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I think the biggest obstacle to most sport and recreational pilots is not being able to rent aircraft from most places. My school doesn't even offer sport and recreational ratings unless the pilot has their own airplane because our insurance won't let them rent from us. Part of the problem to me is the certification process that most manufacturers have to go through with the FAA to sell aircraft and aircraft parts. It simply costs too much and has become prohibitive. They are basically shooting themselves in the foot in the long run.
 
$50 in 1990 is ~ $85 today. Considering insurance and fuels have gone up then paying ~100-120 today an hour is reasonable.
 
fuel cost is a small part, the cost of mx and even purchasing a new aircraft is the big part.

200k + for a new 172 and they wonder why nobody is flying. It's basically worth 80k tops not counting whatever avionics package is in it but people sued the daylights out of companies every time their moron husband killed himself because he didn't maintain anything so here we are! A 12 cent part is now 100 $ just to get that little FAA approved sticker on it!
 
PGT said:
200+? Try $300k for a brand new 172. http://textron.vo.llnwd.net/o25/CES...ingle_engine/skyhawk/skyhawksp_pricesheet.pdf

Cirrus SR20? 299k http://www.cirrusaircraft.com/media/pricesheets/sr20.pdf
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Waste of money. You can get more aircraft at a cheaper price buying use. I think if someone is serious about getting into the industry to serious consider buying a C172 M,N,P aircraft. It will be far cheaper in the log run and you will lear your Instrument Rating on the six pack and not glass. The cost of descent 172 is 30K-60K.
 
Insurance is the killer. Not renter's insurance, or owner's insurance, but commercial insurance of all kinds. It went into orbit after 9/11 and NEVER came back down. Call your insurance company. Get a quote on a 172 that just you fly. Then get a quote on a 172 that you want to rent or instruct in.

The guy that makes the bolts for the carb or fuel injection system has to pass his insurance costs on to the company that puts the carb or fuel injection system together. They have to add it to their price, PLUS add some for their own insurance when they sell to Lyc or CMI. Lyc or CMI has to pass that on to whoever they sell their engine to, PLUS add a percentage to cover their own. It's a compounding problem, and by the time you get to the end of the supply chain, you're looking at a 3 or 4 fold increase in what the cost of the item SHOULD be.

Throw in a PMA approval process that's best measured in geologic time and you get the picture.

But it's not just the parts and the manufacturers. The FBO has to cover themselves. The school that subleases space has to pay that, plus add some for their own insurance. The maintenence shop has their own costs.

Etc, etc, etc.

There are ways to drive your costs down, but you need to be extremely pro-active, and quite honestly, people these days don't have that kind of patience.

Richman
 
Bandit_Driver said:
Waste of money. You can get more aircraft at a cheaper price buying use. I think if someone is serious about getting into the industry to serious consider buying a C172 M,N,P aircraft. It will be far cheaper in the log run and you will lear your Instrument Rating on the six pack and not glass. The cost of descent 172 is 30K-60K.
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I'll sell you my 1975 172M right now, seriously.
 
Bandit_Driver said:
Waste of money. You can get more aircraft at a cheaper price buying use. I think if someone is serious about getting into the industry to serious consider buying a C172 M,N,P aircraft. It will be far cheaper in the log run and you will lear your Instrument Rating on the six pack and not glass. The cost of descent 172 is 30K-60K.
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I'll sell you my 1975 172M right now, seriously.
 
KSCessnaDriver said:
Hard to find in the cities. Go to the airports 20-30 miles out of the city. I picked up a hangar in Kansas for $83/month
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This is the only time I wish I was back in SoCal. Seems everyone around me has a waiting list a mile long for hangars, some places for hangars waiting to be built. Found a few that would lease the land and build your own, and I suppose if I built a four place hangar I could rent it, but with a dual career family and moving every few years I just don't want to take that chance.

A few of us have been looking for a Bonanza or Lance / Saratoga in a quarter share a piece deal. If we find a good one at least there will be others paying in so I don't mind building one then. Would prefer to have one on an airport with at least one instrument approach. Not a fan of ILS into GRR and scud running to destination. ;)
 
"The slowly death" :p

I don't know about you fellas, but I still hear congested frequencies at uncontrolled fields on the weekends. I've been flying since 2000 and I haven't seen a perceptible drop in GA activity. As far as I've seen, there are still plenty of private pilots trying to kill me when I enter the pattern. Maybe there's some statistic or chart that proves otherwise, but 12 years of flying and 5 of them being directly involved with FBOs, I just have not seen an appreciable decline.
 
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