The pilot shortage is over?

[knot4u]

That’s a separate topic entirely.

My opinion or your opinion? I'm confused.

 

[derg]

HR Training sucks. No doubt. But…

In the olden times men treated women in the workplace like property, playthings, or children. Sure it was fun… for the misogynistic men of the time. Men actually had to be told to treat women like people. I know, crazy sounding but true. So training was developed and things improved a little bit. Unfortunately, people still have trouble treating people like humans these days thus the training remains.

I would like it very much if humans (mostly male humans if I’m being honest), stopped treating others like objects because like you said, the training really sucks.

People keep doing and saying profoundly idiotic things and it exposes a multi-billion dollar corporation to liability.

Thus, HR training.

Like the FARs are written in blood, HR training is written from the ink from the legal notepads of attorneys during depositions.

I tell my coworkers “Hate HR training? Learn to leave your kink and non-work related opinions at home”

 

[Ian_J]

People keep doing and saying profoundly idiotic things and it exposes a multi-billion dollar corporation to liability.

Thus, HR training.

Like the FARs are written in blood, HR training is written from the ink from the legal notepads of attorneys during depositions.

I tell my coworkers “Hate HR training? Learn to leave your kink and non-work related opinions at home”

Oh, damn you for coming up with the FARs are written in blood analogy. That’s really good and I wish I thought of it first.

 

[USMCmech]

People keep doing and saying profoundly idiotic things and it exposes a multi-billion dollar corporation to liability.

Thus, HR training.

Like the FARs are written in blood, HR training is written from the ink from the legal notepads of attorneys during depositions.

I tell my coworkers “Hate HR training? Learn to leave your kink and non-work related opinions at home”

I agree but just like "safety" training, manuals, and programs, you can never overcome human nature.

Stupid people are going to be reckless despite every effort of the safety department, and jerks are going to be jackasses despite the best efforts of the HR people.

 

[trafficinsight]

HR Training sucks. No doubt. But…

In the olden times men treated women in the workplace like property, playthings, or children. Sure it was fun… for the misogynistic men of the time. Men actually had to be told to treat women like people. I know, crazy sounding but true. So training was developed and things improved a little bit. Unfortunately, people still have trouble treating people like humans these days thus the training remains.

I would like it very much if humans (mostly male humans if I’m being honest), stopped treating others like objects because like you said, the training really sucks.

You can tell someone's attitude toward the people by their attitude toward the training, for the most part.

 

[Ian_J]

You can tell someone's attitude toward the people by their attitude toward the training, for the most part.

I get that, but at the same time I’m resentful of the training because I don’t need the training. It feels like mass punishment issued to all because a few can’t be adults.

 

[trafficinsight]

I get that, but at the same time I’m resentful of the training because I don’t need the training. It feels like mass punishment issued to all because a few can’t be adults.

Sure, and I don't just mean "Man this training is boring" of course...

 

[poser765]

I agree but just like "safety" training, manuals, and programs, you can never overcome human nature.

Stupid people are going to be reckless despite every effort of the safety department, and jerks are going to be jackasses despite the best efforts of the HR people.

So I think a-holes are going to do stupid things regardless of training. There are a lot stupid people that aren’t really stupid… just ignorant. There’s definitely a large number of people that just don’t know what their doing is inappropriate. The training is for them.

 

[Beaker]

I don't see much point, though. I wouldn't change a single thing I said or did, anything about how I was dressed or how I presented myself. If they don't want me, they clearly don't want me.

I would not give the hiring process that much credit. While I am not at the airlines, I have been on both sides of the interview table several times over the past 15 years in another profession. During that time I have seen management slow roll offers to candidates who would have been perfect and I have seen the inevitable jackwagon slip through the cracks and join the team. Ideally, we would have an omniscient understanding of who applicants are and what we are looking for in an employee. Reality is far cry from that and the blanks get filled in with guesswork and randomness. A different day with a different interview panel could very well lead to different results, even if you are the same person you've always been.

(Of course understanding all that doesn't make the inexplicable rejection any less infuriating when it's happening to you.)

 

[tcco94]

Did you read the article before choosing the thread title?

The first paragraph says that reason isn’t a surplus of pilots, it is weak performance and P&W engine issues.

All the other airlines are still hiring and holding indoc classes. The last sentence even mentions Frontier.

Yeah I am just lost why every bad article on an airline somehow has something to do with pilot shortage? Spirit is in a bad financial position. ULCC model is struggling. There’s problems with engines forcing airplanes on the ground.


PILOT SHORTAGE

Assumed that’d be a Todd title…

 

[tcco94]

So you think the frenzy hasn’t even started yet? I’m just curious, because it seems the only major with the peak of retirements ahead of us is American. I believe Delta and United have already peaked, granted the numbers remain high on a slight down slope for the next 5-7 years.

Peaked? The average is 500 a year here at SJI for the next 9 years. This is just the beginning. It doesn’t start a downslope until 2034. There was no peak, we just got here and it’s only going to get worse from here on out.

 

[Bob Ridpath]

Not a pilot and no real expertise in the area; still, as an old guy with lots of experience I'd note that there are ups and downs but nothing is really "over" till you're dead. Plan as best you can, accordingly.

 

[BEEF SUPREME]

Not a pilot and no real expertise in the area; still, as an old guy with lots of experience I'd note that there are ups and downs but nothing is really "over" till you're dead. Plan as best you can, accordingly.

Never give up! Never surrender!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[///AMG]

I would not give the hiring process that much credit. While I am not at the airlines, I have been on both sides of the interview table several times over the past 15 years in another profession. During that time I have seen management slow roll offers to candidates who would have been perfect and I have seen the inevitable jackwagon slip through the cracks and join the team. Ideally, we would have an omniscient understanding of who applicants are and what we are looking for in an employee. Reality is far cry from that and the blanks get filled in with guesswork and randomness. A different day with a different interview panel could very well lead to different results, even if you are the same person you've always been.

(Of course understanding all that doesn't make the inexplicable rejection any less infuriating when it's happening to you.)

Where I work, our team conducts all the interviews personally, and we have been fortunate enough to hire only people we personally know already. Not everywhere can be like this, but I would highly recommend, 10/10 if you can

 

[Beaker]

Where I work, our team conducts all the interviews personally, and we have been fortunate enough to hire only people we personally know already. Not everywhere can be like this, but I would highly recommend, 10/10 if you can

Oh 100%. It works out well for both parties whenever you can bring in a buddy that you have already worked with. Too bad it doesn't scale

 

[Autothrust Blue]

Sure, and I don't just mean "Man this training is boring" of course...

Some just can’t use the crayons to scribble apparently.

 

[phill1174]

Peaked? The average is 500 a year here at SJI for the next 9 years. This is just the beginning. It doesn’t start a downslope until 2034. There was no peak, we just got here and it’s only going to get worse from here on out.

Shhh the kids that only spent a year on the ERJ and turn their nose up at the CRJ said it’s peaked for SJI because they can’t retire as #1 on the A350A in ATL.

 

[Max Power]

If I want to keep paying for hotels and bashing my heart against the process, taking rejection after rejection while people who were driving C-172s twelve months ago start class, yea. Assuming they invite me to do so a third time.

I don't see much point, though. I wouldn't change a single thing I said or did, anything about how I was dressed or how I presented myself. If they don't want me, they clearly don't want me. I talked with the other applicants, and I know the records for some of the folks who got CJOs, and ... man, if they'd rather hire those people than me, I've gotta believe they just don't like my kind.

It absolutely sucks, the treadmill of interviewing and failing. I am(even with prep and coaching) apparently not great at interviewing. From August to November of 2021 interviewed with one carrier every month, on the phone, in person or Zoom (including some ACMI) except Delta and Frontier and was turned down. I didn't even get the CJO from AA on the day I interviewed and that 2.5 hour home was hard to deal with. Then a week later, I turned my phone on after a flight to find "Welcome to AA" emails. Somehow, something I said or did changed in that interview that I wasn't aware of or somehow I earned someone's pity or respect or a combination thereof. Or they needed a quota of off the street hires. Something happened/changed and I have no idea what it was This was a long way to say keep trying, because all the strife and anguish have proved worth it.

 

[Fixtur]

Ya'll getting interviews? What's your secret?

 

[knot4u]

So I think a-holes are going to do stupid things regardless of training. There are a lot stupid people that aren’t really stupid… just ignorant. There’s definitely a large number of people that just don’t know what their doing is inappropriate. The training is for them.

This is a misconception. Your employer does not want to pay for the training and pay you to attend the training, it reduces their bottom line. Being able to have some sort of defense in any number of possible lawsuits is potentially cheaper. The employers don't care, it's all about the bottom line. I've seen/heard of some fairly egregious examples of this behavior, all of those individuals had taken the training. In one specific case an employee got aggressive with a customers employee, I know the company got sued and I don't know the outcome, but it's pretty obvious the training isn't working.