SWA vs UAL... FIGHT

[JEP]

Velo says “you’re off mah jumpseat!!”

Only the real OG's recognize that name...

 

[SteveC]

Another…

 

[CFI A&P]

I think people should throttle back. First, no one ACTUALLY knows what went down other than the company and the three pilots involved and they're probably not talking outside of the union and themselves.

If the story is accurate, SWA and UAL need to handle it through the respective unions, but I'm super reluctant in the age of social media and OpenAI to get too trigger happy when there's a saucy story. I know, it's super boring and unsatisfying waiting for the facts.

Hell, I had to wait a year to talk about the "FFDO vs the Airbus Captain", it sucked as I didn't even talk to my wife about it, but NDA's and confidential information at the time, well, my hands were tied both professionally and ethically but once it hit the media, SHAWWWWSHANNNNNNK!

Wait, you mean people are jumping the gun on ‘due process’ with pitchforks out? Now way….

In what I’ve seen on this story, the same people doxing the alleged jumpseater are also actively screaming “it’s a witch hunt” about another person in the news. Funny how that works.

 

[MikeD]

Never let a good jumpseat war opportunity go to waste.

 

[arkflyr]

Never let a good jumpseat war opportunity go to waste.

There is no jumpseat war, just a bunch of funny memes. The SWAPA president said everything is taken care of, and don't deny jumpseats to anyone on the first day this broke. Go look at my post earlier in this thread.

 

[MikeD]

There is no jumpseat war, just a bunch of funny memes. The SWAPA president said everything is taken care of, and don't deny jumpseats to anyone on the first day this broke. Go look at my post earlier in this thread.

I saw. Just making a general quippy statement regarding those with the pitchforks

 

[derg]

There is no jumpseat war, just a bunch of funny memes. The SWAPA president said everything is taken care of, and don't deny jumpseats to anyone on the first day this broke. Go look at my post earlier in this thread.

It seemed like the only people screaming “jumpseat war, NAO!” were at carriers that weren’t even involved.

Man, if the internet doxed the wrong person, and whoever is identifiable, I’d heavily suggest they look at “Charlie Cook vs Dan Gryder”

 

[SurferLucas]

Only the real OG's recognize that name...

Not that we want to…what an absolute, grade A jackass that guy is

 

[arkflyr]

It seemed like the only people screaming “jumpseat war, NAO!” were at carriers that weren’t even involved.

Man, if the internet doxed the wrong person, and whoever is identifiable, I’d heavily suggest they look at “Charlie Cook vs Dan Gryder”

No kidding, it reminds of the days of the vaccine mandate that coincided with the Columbus Day Massacre in October '21. My phone exploded with people that I hadn't heard from in years going wild over the idea that we were going on strike over it the common thread being that none of them worked where I did. While in reality it was just a breakdown in the failing crew support IT and a preview of what was to become the Christmas Flightmare of 2022. None of them wanted to hear that though, I may as well have been talking to fencepost as their mind was already made up and they were all just fishing around for me to confirm what they already believed.

Oh boy that really rubbed me the wrong way, and is probably why I'm speaking up now.

Plus I used to rely on UAL jumpseats back in my commuting days, and still use them often to visit family. And the last thing I need is someone's stupid jumpseat war screwing up my time.

 

[derg]

No kidding, it reminds of the days of the vaccine mandate that coincided with the Columbus Day Massacre in October '21. My phone exploded with people that I hadn't heard from in years going wild over the idea that we were going on strike over it the common thread being that none of them worked where I did. While in reality it was just a breakdown in the failing crew support IT and a preview of what was to become the Christmas Flightmare of 2022. None of them wanted to hear that though, I may as well have been talking to fencepost as their mind was already made up and they were all just fishing around for me to confirm what they already believed.

Oh boy that really rubbed me the wrong way, and is probably why I'm speaking up now.

Plus I used to rely on UAL jumpseats back in my commuting days, and still use them often to visit family. And the last thing I need is someone's stupid jumpseat war screwing up my time.

There’s part of the human psyche that loves being part of a team.

And when that ‘team’ forms, in this care the “Columbus Day Massa’cree” (I love saying massa-CREE instead of massaKER) the team had already formed, opinions solidified and that feel-good shot of dopamine of being part of something bigger, it was too late.

“People are quitting! People are getting fired! Onward, into the foggy abyss of WAR!” As their dopamine spikes.

 

[MikeD]

No kidding, it reminds of the days of the vaccine mandate that coincided with the Columbus Day Massacre in October '21. My phone exploded with people that I hadn't heard from in years going wild over the idea that we were going on strike over it the common thread being that none of them worked where I did. While in reality it was just a breakdown in the failing crew support IT and a preview of what was to become the Christmas Flightmare of 2022. None of them wanted to hear that though, I may as well have been talking to fencepost as their mind was already made up and they were all just fishing around for me to confirm what they already believed.

Oh boy that really rubbed me the wrong way, and is probably why I'm speaking up now.

Plus I used to rely on UAL jumpseats back in my commuting days, and still use them often to visit family. And the last thing I need is someone's stupid jumpseat war screwing up my time.

Because prematurely overreacting to incomplete or early info is always what people want to default to, over waiting until factual info makes its way into the open. Patience seemingly isn’t a virtue these days.

 

[derg]

Because prematurely overreacting to incomplete or early info is always what people want to default to, over waiting until factual info makes its way into the open. Patience seemingly isn’t a virtue these days.

Misinformation, both intentional and unintentional, fueled by AI is the new threat in my opinion. Clickbait factories (Hello, Daily Mail!) is going to swiftly discover that micro-niches such as the airline pilot world is high income and can drive a focused, high-yield PPC (massive potential profits) and is going to produce profitable content and augment user-driven content (“OpenAI, draw me a picture of a pilot, on a Boeing jumpseat, making a telephone call to the FAA, make it look like a Pixar cartoon”)

We’re already at the point where we don’t know what’s real anymore or even care as long as we get that warm spike of dopamine,

The next decade is going to be absolutely bonkers.

 

[derg]

Gosh dang it, I was just kidding about OpenAI, opened up Facebook and BOOM the algorithm got me by showing this post on a ‘friends’ page:



Nevermind if the story is true or not, someone felt ‘good’ by using generative AI, felt “good” by sharing it and FB’s algorithm was able to show me content they assumed I’d want to see highlighted from jumpstreet.

Neither of these people work for either of the airlines, but are name-dropping and assuming the information they have is factual.

This is why trying to figure out what drives a person, then providing that content without regard to accuracy, while simultaneously disavowing any responsibility for the content, it’s mega profitable for those that use the technology.

 

[MikeD]

Misinformation, both intentional and unintentional, fueled by AI is the new threat in my opinion. Clickbait factories (Hello, Daily Mail!) is going to swiftly discover that micro-niches such as the airline pilot world is high income and can drive a focused, high-yield PPC (massive potential profits) and is going to produce profitable content and augment user-driven content (“OpenAI, draw me a picture of a pilot, on a Boeing jumpseat, making a telephone call to the FAA, make it look like a Pixar cartoon”)

We’re already at the point where we don’t know what’s real anymore or even care as long as we get that warm spike of dopamine,

The next decade is going to be absolutely bonkers.

Absolutely. We need to be even more careful overall these days, as it comes to any number of things that pop up as breaking news or similar. What used to be crafty editing or photoshop, has morphed into completely fake stories that can easily manipulate and have stakes that can easily get out of control and not be able to be turned off, if we aren’t careful. Fake news really is a thing these days, no matter who creates it for whatever reason.

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Never let a good jumpseat war opportunity go to waste.

Imma jumpseat on your airline and then call the Feds for you using flaps 2

 

[Cherokee_Cruiser]

Misinformation, both intentional and unintentional, fueled by AI is the new threat in my opinion. Clickbait factories (Hello, Daily Mail!) is going to swiftly discover that micro-niches such as the airline pilot world is high income and can drive a focused, high-yield PPC (massive potential profits) and is going to produce profitable content and augment user-driven content (“OpenAI, draw me a picture of a pilot, on a Boeing jumpseat, making a telephone call to the FAA, make it look like a Pixar cartoon”)

We’re already at the point where we don’t know what’s real anymore or even care as long as we get that warm spike of dopamine,

The next decade is going to be absolutely bonkers.

I agree. I don’t think the world is ready for AI. A few higher ups have raised the alarm. And I don’t just mean the job loss due to replacement by AI.


Look at the country I’m from. There’s blasphemy laws there, punishable by (up to) death penalty. Can you imagine rivals that want to eliminate the other get their hands on deep fake software? Apparently all you need is a speech sample that uses all vowels and about half the consonants. Viola. You can now “create” their voice and make a recording them of saying literally anything. How about a comment against the Prophet and Islam? Or even a video that shows their face and mouth while overlaying the fake voice? In a third world country, that victim would be done for.

 

[T/O w/FSII]

FWIW, no one doxxed the wrong person, reading the union presidents statement between the lines it’s obviously the person in question. Just a bunch of virologists that are now experts in defamation law overnight.

Passing around a name and using the public FAA website to find her data to keep her off a JS isn’t doxxing. No one is trying to get her arrested, and no crime was committed on either end not to mention the whole JS is a privilege and scab lists exist thing.

Everyone just added her name to a mental list and made some memes. Her fault.

 

[killbilly]

It seemed like the only people screaming “jumpseat war, NAO!” were at carriers that weren’t even involved.

Man, if the internet doxed the wrong person, and whoever is identifiable, I’d heavily suggest they look at “Charlie Cook vs Dan Gryder”

Because prematurely overreacting to incomplete or early info is always what people want to default to, over waiting until factual info makes its way into the open. Patience seemingly isn’t a virtue these days.

Remember how we were talking about empathy in the TMAAT-Captain-mentoring thread? I feel like this is a great opportunity for that.

It just doesn't make sense for a pilot to rat out another crew based on a non-event. As bits and pieces are coming out to the non-UAL pilot community, it seems that there is quite a bit more to the initial story; and that the FO in question may not have been the one to place the actual phone call. Nature abhors a vacuum, bad information certainly fills one. I can't not think about the pink elephants they've just told me not to think about, so here we are, and I'd like to try and be the person that I hope to be here.

I believe in giving people the benefit of the doubt, especially in circumstances that, as presented, strain credibility. Maybe it's just because I want to believe this particular narrative, whatever - the fact stands that she is being pilloried and it doesn't quite seem as clear cut as originally presented.

If this is the case - if her significant other did it, it raises other questions - did he overstep or did she know? And the more I think about it (after all, I am sitting in a crashpad with ample idle time) the more I realize that I do not want to know who she is. I trust in UAL's jumpseat team to regulate its own and I'm certain the frothing "BURN THE WITCH!" crowd will settle down soon enough.

If she made a terrible mistake, she's certainly going to pay for it over years. And if she didn't, but her S/O overstepped and she pays the price, well, that goes into the realm of tragedy. Just my .02.

 

[derg]

Remember how we were talking about empathy in the TMAAT-Captain-mentoring thread? I feel like this is a great opportunity for that.

It just doesn't make sense for a pilot to rat out another crew based on a non-event. As bits and pieces are coming out to the non-UAL pilot community, it seems that there is quite a bit more to the initial story; and that the FO in question may not have been the one to place the actual phone call. Nature abhors a vacuum, bad information certainly fills one. I can't not think about the pink elephants they've just told me not to think about, so here we are, and I'd like to try and be the person that I hope to be here.

I tend to try and give people the benefit of the doubt, especially in circumstances that, as presented, strain credibility. Maybe it's just because I want to believe this particular narrative, whatever - the fact stands that she is being pilloried and it doesn't quite seem as clear cut as originally presented.

If this is the case - if her significant other did it, it raises other questions - did he overstep or did she know? And the more I think about it (after all, I am sitting in a crashpad with ample idle time) the more I realize that I do not want to know who she is. I trust in UAL's jumpseat team to regulate its own and I'm certain the frothing "BURN THE WITCH!" crowd will settle down soon enough.

If she made a terrible mistake, she's certainly going to pay for it over years. And if she didn't, but her S/O overstepped and she pays the price, well, that goes into the realm of tragedy. Just my .02.

I always figure, lets start with facts.

What "key facts" do we have? Not "a friend of a friend", "I heard someone say" or "the company intranet says" but some "Hi, my name is Ted. I am with Pacific Southern Airlines, this case came across my desk and here are the facts" type stuff?

Not directly asking you, but just the internet in general.

 

[JEP]

I always figure, lets start with facts.

What "key facts" do we have? Not "a friend of a friend", "I heard someone say" or "the company intranet says" but some "Hi, my name is Ted. I am with Pacific Southern Airlines, this case came across my desk and here are the facts" type stuff?

Not directly asking you, but just the internet in general.

My sisters, brothers, friend knows someone that heard about......