Spirit Airbus Near Mid-Air Collision with Skydive Plane

TCAS, while not an exact science is a great tool to have in your SA bag. I've never used it to decrease separation I've used it to increase it. Today as a matter a fact. Going into SUN, we'd been following a CE-650 for the past 20 mins or so and he was always about 2-3,000ft lower and about 15 miles as we were descending. I heard him cancel through 18k and we did the same a min or two later. I could tell we had been slowly creeping up on them, so I slowed a bit squared the turn a little more than normal across the valley. Picked him up visually when we were on a high downwind and he was on a mile and a half final. It worked out perfect. He was taxiing in back as we were landing. Did it relieve me of looking out for him or other traffic out the window? No, not at all, again it's just another piece of the bigger SA picture. I'm definitely no Chuck Yeager (heard he was an ass any way) and some days it's amazing I even know how to start the thing, but its the little techniques that can make everyone's job a little bit easier. :)
 
Meh.

400 feet and 1.6 miles separation? I have come much closer and didn't dive down like a little girl. It definitely would have made me put my coffee down and pay attention though. Hell, I probably would have muted my music even.

Am I incorrect to think they were obliged to respond to the RA? I didn't read the article but if Spirit was in the climb and now they have to descend at xxx ft/minute wouldn't that thrust pax into the overhead? If anyone is at fault it is ATC. Like that's never happened....


One time, at 15,ooo in a T210, I had to....
 
Yes, RA's are highly recommended to be responded too, however you are allowed to override their logic, should you deem it necessary.

There is a video we watch every year in recurrent about a bad RA between Air Canada and PSA I think. It would have caused one of them to climb into the other. Freak scenario.
 
Yes, RA's are highly recommended to be responded too, however you are allowed to override their logic, should you deem it necessary.

There is a video we watch every year in recurrent about a bad RA between Air Canada and PSA I think. It would have caused one of them to climb into the other. Freak scenario.

Are they only recommended for all operators? I was under the impression that some operators required compliance with an RA, even if traffic was in sight.

This.

Traffic in sight or traffic NOT in sight.

Sorry to dig this up from several pages ago, but I would love to here more use of the established phraseology:

"Traffic in sight"

or

"Negative contact"

Saying "traffic not in sight" often sounds like "traffic *static* in sight" over the radio.
 
Am I incorrect to think they were obliged to respond to the RA? I didn't read the article but if Spirit was in the climb and now they have to descend at xxx ft/minute wouldn't that thrust pax into the overhead? If anyone is at fault it is ATC. Like that's never happened....


One time, at 15,ooo in a T210, I had to....

Depends on the company.

I'm too lazy to dig it out, but if we have visual with the traffic we have some leeway in how we respond. If we don't, you must follow the guidance.

But don't quote me on that.

However if I don't have the traffic in sight and the situation devolves into an RA, I'm going to follow the RA guidance because I have no clue where the other aircraft is, what he's doing, what his trends are and where he's headed.

And if I've got to spill some coffee and bump some heads, well, sure beats this:

psacrash.jpg


HOPEFULLY, you've got the correct traffic 'on the fishfinder' or you're really good at figuring out what the vector is on the other airplane.
 
Our book says, "Compliance with TCAS Resolution Advisories (RAs) is mandatory unless the Captain determines
that doing so would jeopardize the safe operation of the flight"
 
There was an incident where ATC gave traffic avoidance instructions as did TCAS but the pilot chose ATC and collided with the other aircraft. I cant recall the incident. It was an Air Crash Investigation episode I believe.
I was actually just looking that up. It was a Russian Tu-154 vs. a DHL 757. The lone Swiss ATC contract controller gave the Russians an instruction to descend while the DHL 757 was responding to the RA by descending. The Russians ignored the RA and went with ATC. One of the craziest parts was the Russian father of one of the deceased kids stabbed the Swiss controller to death. He was later acquitted.

If I remember correctly TCAS II with change 7.1 (I think currently available but has 2015 date of compliance) provides a course reversal RA in cases like the DHL accident. If both aircraft remain within 100ft vertically it will command one to reverse course.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2002_Überlingen_Mid-Air_Collision

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Traffic_collision_avoidance_system

I know it's wiki but there's some pretty good info.
 
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