Southwest is even more toxic than I’ve always said

SlumTodd_Millionaire said:
Harboring, aiding, and abetting sexually harassing dirtbags in their little cowboy good ole boys club. God, that place is toxic.

sarahammel.substack.com

Two More Southwest Pilots Named in Sexual Assault, Retaliation Lawsuit

BREAKING: In defaming a fellow pilot, Michael Hawkes and David Newton became links in a chain of events leading to her assault, lawsuit says
sarahammel.substack.com sarahammel.substack.com
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I don’t think this type of behavior is limited to SW.. we just had a check airmen resign.. let’s just say, the sign off sheet had more requirements for females.
 
Doug Masters said:
Sad but not surprising. This is an industry wide issue and the amount of BS women have to put up with is insane. I certainly couldn't do it.
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But you have to.

Even the crap I put up with from people as a person of color in the airline business would scare most people off and wonder why I haven't sued multiple individuals.

But if you quit or avoid the business, the bad guys win. And propagate.
 
I'm at an airline that has a much higher than average number if female and minority pilots, but there are still issues here too. I've flown with several female ROs who have mentioned calling in sick instead of flying with specific captains. The worst was being on my break in business class on a flight and having the RO come back when she took a bathroom break and beg me to come back up so she wasn't alone with the captain. Ended up convincing the guy that I was wide awake and he could start his rest break early. That one went to pro standards.
 
HJB said:
I don’t think this type of behavior is limited to SW.. we just had a check airmen resign.. let’s just say, the sign off sheet had more requirements for females.
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Resign from the position or the company?
 
BobDDuck said:
I'm at an airline that has a much higher than average number if female and minority pilots, but there are still issues here too. I've flown with several female ROs who have mentioned calling in sick instead of flying with specific captains. The worst was being on my break in business class on a flight and having the RO come back when she took a bathroom break and beg me to come back up so she wasn't alone with the captain. Ended up convincing the guy that I was wide awake and he could start his rest break early. That one went to pro standards.
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And pro standards predicably either did nothing or blamed the JR pilot and then did nothing about that. My experience with pro standards was extremely disappointing to say the least.

At some point there is behavior out there that does not deserve professional discretion.
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
At some point there is behavior out there that does not deserve professional discretion.
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Correct.

I've only made one call to professional standards and the person in question was even an (expletive deleted) to the chairman as well.

Next time and especially other pilots that ask for me for advice about this particular person, straight up the totem pole. Next time I'd leave him at the gate, take everyone's coffee orders and be the first one at the conference.
 
It’s definitely strange how some of these people act, and how entitled they become. On my last trip, I was flying with a newer FO still on probation. Very motivated and great attitude.

We had a scheduled jumpseater that I sort of know, and he’s an older CA that complains about everything. As expected, non-stop whining the whole flight. When we deplaned, one of the oncoming crew had a mask and of course he had to make a stupid comment afterwards “He must be a democrat!”

After ridding ourselves of him, I apologized to the FO and explained it’s getting better but we still have idiots like that around.

As Zap alluded to earlier, that kind of behavior is absolutely not tolerated in any other professional environment that I’ve ever been a part of. I don’t know why we’re so backwards in that respect.
 
Oh look, an industry that egoes itself on job fairs, networking, ass kissing, 20+ recommendations, selling your left nut to “make it” ends up being a a boys club with immature idiot man children?


You don’t say.


Want to know the real problem? Look in the mirror. These man children were once in their 20s, 30s, 40s and this behavior didn’t just manifest itself in the last 5 yrs. They were always like this. Unchecked. Looked over. Made excuses for. Protected. Ignored.


And here we are today.
 
BEEF SUPREME said:
And pro standards predicably either did nothing or blamed the JR pilot and then did nothing about that. My experience with pro standards was extremely disappointing to say the least.

At some point there is behavior out there that does not deserve professional discretion.
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Same. There’s a guy who is on everyone’s no fly list at my old job. Their response when I called: “we’ve tried counseling him, but he won’t listen. He’s going to retire soon.”
I was pretty shocked.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
Oh look, an industry that egoes itself on job fairs, networking, ass kissing, 20+ recommendations, selling your left nut to “make it” ends up being a a boys club with immature idiot man children?


You don’t say.


Want to know the real problem? Look in the mirror. These man children were once in their 20s, 30s, 40s and this behavior didn’t just manifest itself in the last 5 yrs. They were always like this. Unchecked. Looked over. Made excuses for. Protected. Ignored.


And here we are today.
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Sorry man.. but wtf do job fairs , and ass kissing have to do with anything? I’d say this type of behavior is rampant in every industry. At least with ours, there’s no corporate ladder to climb per se. An FOs promotion has nothing to do with what a CA or upper management think of her. Number comes up, and boom there’s the promotion.
 
HJB said:
Sorry man.. but wtf do job fairs , and ass kissing have to do with anything? I’d say this type of behavior is rampant in every industry. At least with ours, there’s no corporate ladder to climb per se. An FOs promotion has nothing to do with what a CA or upper management think of her. Number comes up, and boom there’s the promotion.
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No it isn’t. Our job is unique in that regard.

Show me doctors standing in a line 600 long like at OBAP. All waiting to see recruiters, all looking the same, with the same quals and hours (mostly). All willing to kiss ass and play the game just to get an interview.


Pilots? Zero effs given for your work ethic, quality, skill. As long as you pass, you’re good. That’s why there are a-holes here and the reason “the stuff wouldn’t be tolerated in other jobs.”


If we had balls, we’d fire pilots a whooooole lot more than we do. But we don’t. We coddle them. The problem children.
 
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