Pilatus with 7 Aboard Down Off The Coast of NC

NTSB Docket - Docket Management System

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New information with complete cockpit transposition from the voice recorder. I'm not a pilot but this hit close to home so I am interested on what happened.

I'm not a pilot but it is obvious a lack of pre flight route planning caused major issues. They tried to enter the route while airborne and when they couldn't get the nav system to work like they wanted it resulted in a lot of confusion and 'flying by the seat of your pants' He even admits in the transcript he is way behind the 8 ball as he put it.

I am having a little bit of a problem figuring out the last 3 minutes or so. They go into an ascent and get into stall condition but it isn't really clear to me why so I came here to get some expert opinions. Could it be while climbing to 1900 he wasn't paying attention and the plane kept ascending and got into a runaway trim scenario? Or he became disoriented and panicked?

The transcript is a tough read and this accident seems 100% avoidable. They do note he appeared to have a cold or something and back pain so maybe those factors combined and somehow clouded his judgement. Just seems an awfully unorganized flight plan for someone with that experience. Maybe it was just complacency.

Looking forward to reading your opinions!
 
No absolutely not. I've actually been following this thread a long time since it started but I saw no one had posted the new info yet so I decided to join. As I said this hit close to home as I knew several of the people onboard. Definitely not a lawyer nor work for a paper. The lawsuit has already been settled. Just have an interest in learning why things like this happen and figured some experts could offer insight.
 
Beep said:
@notapilot

I have some questions too…

Are you a AI bot?

What is the name of the newspaper, or law firm that you work for?

Are you an interested party involved in a lawsuit over this accident?

This seems like an odd first post for a new member.
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Pretty sure the wrongful death lawsuits were settled for this crash.
 
notapilot said:
No absolutely not. I've actually been following this thread a long time since it started but I saw no one had posted the new info yet so I decided to join. As I said this hit close to home as I knew several of the people onboard. Definitely not a lawyer nor work for a paper. The lawsuit has already been settled. Just have an interest in learning why things like this happen and figured some experts could offer insight.
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Are you from Carteret County by any chance?
 
notapilot said:
Yes I am. Downeast Carteret County.
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But I guess I misread the room. I thought people here kept up with this kind of stuff and discussed it my fault. I have an investigative mind I guess you can say. I watch the shows Air Disasters, Disasters at Sea, and dig into missing persons cases. I just want answers for stuff like this it's the way my brain is wired.

Feel free to delete any of my posts. Sorry for wasting anyone's time.
 
From reading that cvr I would never know that either of them had ever flown an NG before. That was beyond confusion. That Honeywell Apex system is a little counterintuitive but once you figure out the particulars its not a bad system.
 
It is not wasting anyone's time, it's just that speculating on crashes, especially about a pilot's actions or state of mind, is considered to be distasteful.

The NTSB professionals issued their report - that should carry a lot more weight than some pilots on an Internet forum.
 
Fixtur said:
It is not wasting anyone's time, it's just that speculating on crashes, especially about a pilot's actions or state of mind, is considered to be distasteful.

The NTSB professionals issued their report - that should carry a lot more weight than some pilots on an Internet forum.
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The whole thread is full of speculation but ok. They haven't released the final report yet but I guess they will have answers on why they think the stall happened. Thanks anyways.
 
That CVR is a very scary and disheartening read. They sounded completely clueless. The auto pilot disconnect chime being repeated so many times gives me an impression that no one was flying, only trying to repeatedly engage the ap. What a cluster.
 
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Itchy said:
That CVR is a very scary and disheartening read. They sounded completely clueless. The auto pilot disconnect chime being repeated so many times gives me an impression that no one was flying, only trying to repeatedly engage the ap. What a cluster.
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Agreed that was very mind-blowing to me. The co-pilot didn't surprise me as he didn't really have seat time in a NG. Apparently the pilot had a decent amount of experience with this aircraft but I wouldn't have guessed after that.
 
Itchy said:
That CVR is a very scary and disheartening read. They sounded completely clueless. The auto pilot disconnect chime being repeated so many times gives me an impression that no one was flying, only trying to repeatedly engage the ap. What a cluster.
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That whole sequence from first stall indication to hitting the water was almost 2.5-minutes. That, deciding on the ground wasn't the better time to try and program the FMS, and the PC12's apparent lack of need for checklists were what surprised me most.
 
But thanks for the insight I was curious why the autopilot disconnect kept engaging. So he was trying to climb while also trying to fumble with the AP. He loses track of his rate of ascent and speed which results in a stall condition. He is disoriented because he was paying more attention to the AP so panic ensues and it goes all wrong from there.

Yes this is speculation on my part and I'm sorry I won't speculate anymore but you guys have cleared up a couple of things for me.
 
That CVR is a •show. Nobody up front had any clue what was going on, and couldn’t/wouldn’t fall back on navigating via the moving map and the heading bug.
 
notapilot said:
But thanks for the insight I was curious why the autopilot disconnect kept engaging. So he was trying to climb while also trying to fumble with the AP. He loses track of his rate of ascent and speed which results in a stall condition. He is disoriented because he was paying more attention to the AP so panic ensues and it goes all wrong from there.

Yes this is speculation on my part and I'm sorry I won't speculate anymore but you guys have cleared up a couple of things for me.
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Unless he didn’t cancel the warning? I don’t know the system.

Reading the CVR transcript, holy lack of situational awareness. And what’s a 20 hour ’student‘ pilot going to do? Help you out of a bind? You’re not even in full control of the aircraft and too busy pushing buttons
 
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