No more Brasilias at SkyWest...

Seggy said:
'Spreading the pain' isn't a reason.
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The fact you say it's a "pain" shows enough to reason to do so. It shouldn't be a pain. And despite your/ATN's) insistence that reserve would only get worse if it was a rotating schedule like Emirates, I'd be willing to bet that it would actually get better once every pilot was affected. That's part of the reason things like first year pay get tossed aside in negotiations is because "it's only temporary 12 months" so we shouldn't spend capital here. It's still somebody's QOL for those 12 months, but they want better changes for the senior.
 
Seggy said:
'Spreading the pain' isn't a reason.
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Technically it IS a reason.

Whether it is a good reason or not is the debate I guess. Although I really haven't read this thread close enough to know if there is actual trading of ideas going on or just the more usual "No WAY"..."Yes WAY!"..."Poopy-head" kind of 'conversation'.
 
SteveC said:
Technically it IS a reason.

Whether it is a good reason or not is the debate I guess. Although I really haven't read this thread close enough to know if there is actual trading of ideas going on or just the more usual "No WAY"..."Yes WAY!"..."Poopy-head" kind of 'conversation'.
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I said that schedules would improve over all, and that reserve would likely improve since more people would have an interest in improving it. Plus reserve doesn't have to be horrible. Plenty of senior guys bid reserve here.
 
You boys ought to just mud wrestle for superiority because clearly your measuring contest isn't working. You're both coming off like snotty sorority girls who think they're the smartest people in the room.
 
ZapBrannigan said:
You boys ought to just mud wrestle for superiority because clearly your measuring contest isn't working. You're both coming off like snotty sorority girls who think they're the smartest people in the room.
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SteveC said:
Technically it IS a reason.
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I would love to be in the room of pilots when that statement you are calling a 'reason' is presented for the pilots to vote on in a contract.

Whether it is a good reason or not is the debate I guess.
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There is no guessing. It isn't.

Although I really haven't read this thread close enough to know if there is actual trading of ideas going on or just the more usual "No WAY"..."Yes WAY!"..."Poopy-head" kind of 'conversation'.
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Why don't you look at the thread then? I clearly stated my points which were very specific.
 
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Cherokee_Cruiser said:
The fact you say it's a "pain" shows enough to reason to do so. It shouldn't be a pain. And despite your/ATN's) insistence that reserve would only get worse if it was a rotating schedule like Emirates, I'd be willing to bet that it would actually get better once every pilot was affected. That's part of the reason things like first year pay get tossed aside in negotiations is because "it's only temporary 12 months" so we shouldn't spend capital here. It's still somebody's QOL for those 12 months, but they want better changes for the senior.
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Notice how I put 'spreading the pain' in ''? That was for a reason.
 
PhilosopherPilot said:
I said that schedules would improve over all, and that reserve would likely improve since more people would have an interest in improving it. Plus reserve doesn't have to be horrible. Plenty of senior guys bid reserve here.
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How would schedules improve over all if there are folks purposely bidding reserve and that is giving junior folks lines? Let me post this AGAIN...

It is also a very narrow minded misconception to think that if you rotate folks you are 'spreading the pain'. For example, I am purposely bidding reserve in November/December to be off Thanksgiving and Christmas even though I can hold a line. Someone junior to me is getting a line that may have wanted one but wasn't expecting to get one because they were below the line holder line here. If they are a commuter being a line holder vs. reserve is very beneficial to them. Furthermore, at my place, @@Derg, and @@Autothrust Blue father is at you have folks who bid aircraft based on a lifestyle. They mainly bid the wide-bodies, bid reserve purposely, and go months without flying (if they were line holders they would fly 9 days a month but fly less than that on reserve). As a matter of fact, reserve on our wide bodies go REALLY REALLY REALLY senior. Would it be 'fair' to 'spread the pain' and have them fly if they don't want to? Or would it be better to allow their seniority to hold reserve and not fly?

Those two concepts, the fact that there are senior line holders who will bid reserve in months like November and December AND the fact that there are 'life style' pilots who will bid reserve purposely are the driving forces that create good reserve language (as I said invest in the system). 'Spreading the pain' between everyone once every 12 months will actually put you at a negotiating disadvantage because folks will say, 'well why invest in the reserve rules if I only need to do it once a year for 30 days? I will just take my vacation weeks the reserve month I am assigned.'

Investing in good reserve rules that make it attractive for guys/gals like myself and life style pilots purposely bid reserve when they can be line holders is the key to moving the junior guys from reserve to line holders.
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Finally, y'all are starting with a blank sheet at your place. If you feel so strongly about it, why don't you propose it to your MEC to discuss for contract talks?
 
Seggy said:
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Why don't you look at the thread then? I clearly stated my points which were very specific.
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No thanks. Not really interested in the topic, just making a drive-by commentary on some of the non-productive posts that caught my attention as I skimmed. I can't even tell you off the top of my head who made those posts. Discerning members will review their own posting history here and can decide for themselves if it applies to them. The ones that can't be self-critical enough tend to undermine their own validity without my help.
 
Seggy said:
How would schedules improve over all if there are folks purposely bidding reserve and that is giving junior folks lines? Let me post this AGAIN...



Finally, y'all are starting with a blank sheet at your place. If you feel so strongly about it, why don't you propose it to your MEC to discuss for contract talks?
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Well, it's not REALLY a blank slate. We have systems and procedures in place that will serve as the starting point, I'm sure.

I've got no problem suggesting it however. I think it would improve QOL for the group. We all know most of the senior guys won't have any of it though. They "got theirs" and screw those below them.

Overall, we need some improvements to our scheduling rules, not just reserve. But truly they aren't that bad. I would be happy to bid reserve one month out of a year if it meant the overall QOL for the pilot group went up. That's what unions are all about right? Greatest good for the greatest number? Right? Right?
 
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