Man Dragged off United Flight
- Thread starter Bonanzaman
- Start date
bike21
9-5 Ruins Lives
Yep, wrong way to go about this @MikeD nailed it. Wonder if they stopped at $800 for volunteers? Everyone has their price, just eat it and don't allow crap like this to happen. How about this?
"Why Delta Air Lines Paid Me $11,000 Not To Fly To Florida This Weekend"
https://www.forbes.com/sites/laurab...-to-fly-to-florida-this-weekend/#21a169f24de1
And no, this isn't 'my airline is better than yours' comment - literally don't care about that stuff we all can learn from each other as we've all had our moments.
"Why Delta Air Lines Paid Me $11,000 Not To Fly To Florida This Weekend"
https://www.forbes.com/sites/laurab...-to-fly-to-florida-this-weekend/#21a169f24de1
And no, this isn't 'my airline is better than yours' comment - literally don't care about that stuff we all can learn from each other as we've all had our moments.
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Even if tomorrow's flight takes a delay or gets cancelled; that's the airline's problem that they need to figure out.
Once LE was informed of the situation, a little bit of digging would be in order. Why is he being removed from the plane? Well, due to an overbooking situation. Ok....help me understand....if he's being removed due to an overbooking situation, how is it that he's onboard the aircraft already and seated in what we've been able to confirm is his legitimate seat assignment, as printed on his boarding pass that's in his possession, that he paid for and that you issued him?
Well, the overbooking situation occurred after all the pax were boarded and we need to get extra crew onboard and didn't get enough volunteers of the pax already onboard, to leave. So we selected some pax at random and he's refusing to get off.
Doesn't sound like an LE matter to me. Sounds like an administrative and customer service matter for you, airline rep. Best figure out a way to make that happen, as it sounds like all reasonable means regarding pax have been exhausted. Beyond this point, becomes unreasonable means. Good day and good luck.
Murdoughnut
Well sized member
Bonanzaman
Well-Known Member
Probably went,
"We have an unruly passenger who is refusing to get off the plane."
"Let's roll!"
Nick
Well-Known Member
I really doubt this deters business.
If I were looking for flights online and United had a competitive airfare at the time I needed to go on the route I wanted, I wouldn't be wondering to myself, "I hope I don't end up being dragged off their plane..." Why? Because I'm not going to get myself into that ridiculous situation and neither is the extreme majority of the traveling public.
When a gate agent comes to your seat you can moan and come up with reasons [legitimate or not] that you ought to be left on the airplane and not be involuntarily forced to another flight. Anyone would.
When the agent then goes to call the police down, it's time to think about the next step. You have five minutes...
[I guess I'll just start yelling and try to wiggle away if they scooch me out of my seat...yeah, that'll be what I do . . . ok guys c'mon where are you . . . ]
When the police actually show up to walk you off the airplane, turns out the next step was not to refuse and scream and squirm around.
It appears quite clearly in the clip that he flailed his own face right into that empty seat across the aisle and busted his own lip.
United or their outsourced operation might have not handled this ideally, but if that flailing, screaming man-baby had been my doctor appointment the next day, he'd have some time freed up in his schedule after all while I go find someone else.
If I were looking for flights online and United had a competitive airfare at the time I needed to go on the route I wanted, I wouldn't be wondering to myself, "I hope I don't end up being dragged off their plane..." Why? Because I'm not going to get myself into that ridiculous situation and neither is the extreme majority of the traveling public.
When a gate agent comes to your seat you can moan and come up with reasons [legitimate or not] that you ought to be left on the airplane and not be involuntarily forced to another flight. Anyone would.
When the agent then goes to call the police down, it's time to think about the next step. You have five minutes...
[I guess I'll just start yelling and try to wiggle away if they scooch me out of my seat...yeah, that'll be what I do . . . ok guys c'mon where are you . . . ]
When the police actually show up to walk you off the airplane, turns out the next step was not to refuse and scream and squirm around.
It appears quite clearly in the clip that he flailed his own face right into that empty seat across the aisle and busted his own lip.
United or their outsourced operation might have not handled this ideally, but if that flailing, screaming man-baby had been my doctor appointment the next day, he'd have some time freed up in his schedule after all while I go find someone else.
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Could be initially. But some gathering of facts, along with the initial demeanor of the passenger, should paint a fairly accurate picture of what is going on and why. For the airline, as mentioned already in the thread, perception is indeed reality.
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
How common is it today to have oversold flights? I ask because I have flown more commercial legs the last two years than probably the rest of my life put together, and I've not seen them ask for volunteers once, even though probably 80% of those flights have been slam full. OTOH when I used to go to and from college on another AAirline, it seemed like they were looking for volunteers about half the time. Is it an airline/region thing, or with tech advances like online check-in etc have they just gotten better at optimizing load factors without overselling?
bike21
9-5 Ruins Lives
Seasonally I think there is an uptick, I noticed a lot more oversells the last few weeks during spring break for instance. Gate agents loathe working those flights and rightfully so. Though some as I overheard the other day are like a mix between auctioneers & comedians and seem to get volunteers right quick. Attitude is key in resolving these issues.
BigZ
Well-Known Member
Oh I'm totally with you on that.
The "choices choices" thing was sarcasm.
Clear up Oscar's schedule, get him, that pax and few cameras on a business jet, record a friendly conversation about how the farmers almanac didn't predict the end of the spring break travel date right this year, throw in flow from Delta pax this weekend, promise extra customer service training for the gate agents and apologise for miscommunication with LE and it's all good.
Waving the fine print is akin to having the Polaris posters all over the ORD.
ppragman
FLIPY FLAPS!
Depends on the leg I think - honestly, the last 3 flights I've been on have been over booked, and the last time I tried to non-rev I good booted after getting a confirmed seat.
With regard to this incident, there are two problems - one, United had a crappy plan (well if no-one will get off, I'll just pick 4 people!) - that's dumb and they'll pay for it in bad press and maybe a lawsuit If they were smart they would have kept upping the money until they got the 4 volunteers they needed, poor planning on United's part should screw up this guys day, he's the customer. This whole thing is crappy customer service. The second problem is that the guy didn't follow crewmember instructions because he was pissed. That's him being a jackass and thinking flying is a right. That fellow is a fool...but he's not really wrong to be pissed off, just don't get the cops involved.
Ecl!pse
Well-Known Member
Just to play devil's advocate here, I don't think check-in times would necessarily solve this issue either. What about the scenario where a passenger checked-in last, well ahead of any "minimum" check-in time, but paid the highest fare of all the passengers on the flight. Why should they be bumped? That's perhaps an easy/quick way to lose a valuable business customer.
This is just one of those ugly situations where there's no good answer, short of a "no overselling" policy which also has it's own quirks. And while United should be taking heat for it's processes on involuntary denied boardings, I highly doubt that United asked the LEO's to cause a knockout-dragout scene to remove the gentlemen from the flight.
Like so many other things in our business, this looks like it was a "perfect storm" of chain events -- there was no one single glaring mistake that caused this - rather, a continuing series of small mistakes that culminated in this gruesome scene. Hopefully this is a very real learning moment for the industry as a whole - better educating passengers on carriage contracts, improving passenger communications when situations are unfolding at the gate (note: not just limited to oversold flights, but weather, maintenance, and others), better boarding processes to ensure customers aren't fully seated before they are removed, etc.
BigZ
Well-Known Member
At the end of the day, screaming and kicking pax that's being dragged off is going to gain more than the one muttering "never again" as he voluntarily deplanes and goes to get a travel voucher.
Roger Roger
Bottom of the list
Yeah, if I hadn't been on so many planes that had every single seat filled I would have chocked it up to just not flying busy routes. I just thought it was interesting having been on so many packed planes and (apparently anyway) none of them being oversold.
bike21
9-5 Ruins Lives
It's crazy how it can go from oversold to having seats open. This week being an outlier on the SJI side, but my commute home yesterday on an oversold flight I ended up with an exit row to myself. Fine way to start 3 weeks off
BigZ
Well-Known Member
It's crazy how it can go from oversold to having seats open. This week being an outlier on the SJI side, but my commute home yesterday on an oversold flight I ended up with an exit row to myself. Fine way to start 3 weeks off
Yup.
Disregard. Tried to upload a photo of my six exit row seats on an oversold flight, but photo upload noworky for some reason
Cptnchia
Dissatisfied Customer
Doesn't matter at all. Once a passenger is asked to deplane, for whatever reason, their refusal to do so now makes them a trespasser. It's not LE's role to determine if the reason is valid or not. The lawful owner of the property has asked for them to be removed.
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