Late night flight with a strange request...
- Thread starter derg
- Start date
G
Guest
Guest
No. They can wait until we've arrived at the destination. The aircraft is not a mosque.
flyifrvfr
New Member
[ QUOTE ]
Would tell someone that Jesus has no place on your airplane too?
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I think someone took my attmept at humor as a hatefull statement. I siad I would tell them Allah has no place on my plane, seriously...... This means all statements prior to the word seriously, was in jest.. I am not a hatefull person, I think....
Would tell someone that Jesus has no place on your airplane too?
[/ QUOTE ]
I think someone took my attmept at humor as a hatefull statement. I siad I would tell them Allah has no place on my plane, seriously...... This means all statements prior to the word seriously, was in jest.. I am not a hatefull person, I think....
GrantHubbell
New Member
Doug, i know this forun is dead, but has that question ever been asked to you? If so what did you say?
I_Money
Moderator
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Couldn't he pray earlier or later? I mean, it's not like God or Allah or whoever, is going anyplace
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Two reaons why praying on planes is good:
1) You are closer to God at that point.
2) If you know any pilots, definately good reason to pray.
Now on the later point just do not get to know any doctors - there stories are far more scary!
Couldn't he pray earlier or later? I mean, it's not like God or Allah or whoever, is going anyplace
[/ QUOTE ]
Two reaons why praying on planes is good:
1) You are closer to God at that point.
2) If you know any pilots, definately good reason to pray.
Now on the later point just do not get to know any doctors - there stories are far more scary!
embryriddlepilot
New Member
I was reading the responses and an idea came to my head- I'm no expert in Islam, but I am sure I am right when I say that Islamic people are required to pray at some point in the morning and also in the afternoon. You said that this is a late night flight, so I would assume that this prayer would not be a required one for their religious beliefs. If they were saying that it was, I would probably be a little wary at the least. So the answer would be a big hells no. Better safe than sorry, even if some feelings get hurt in the process.
Athena
New Member
I have a few muslim friends and aquaintances. The rules on prayer are pretty set. There are cleanliness standards that must be met. (since I myself am not muslim I could be a bit off on the specifics) These include washing the hands and feet and the prayers are 5 times daily. I am not sure if the times are specific, but I believe there are provisions in the rules for when one cannot due to circumstances pray in the 'proper' way.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
[ QUOTE ]
but I am sure I am right when I say that Islamic people are required to pray at some point in the morning and also in the afternoon. You said that this is a late night flight, so I would assume that this prayer would not be a required one for their religious beliefs. If they were saying that it was, I would probably be a little wary at the least.
[/ QUOTE ]
Two words: Time Zones.
but I am sure I am right when I say that Islamic people are required to pray at some point in the morning and also in the afternoon. You said that this is a late night flight, so I would assume that this prayer would not be a required one for their religious beliefs. If they were saying that it was, I would probably be a little wary at the least.
[/ QUOTE ]
Two words: Time Zones.
Mr_Creepy
Well-Known Member
Sorry Kell that doesn't fly (lol!)
The Koran doesn't specify a time zone, it specifies the position of the sun to determine the "9 hrs of the day." Actually, the old testament did it first and Mohammed stole it
I'm not sure but I believe the Koran specifies praying on the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th and 9th hour - 1st being sunrise and 9th being sunset.
Check me on this.
The Koran doesn't specify a time zone, it specifies the position of the sun to determine the "9 hrs of the day." Actually, the old testament did it first and Mohammed stole it
I'm not sure but I believe the Koran specifies praying on the 1st, 3rd, 5th, 7th and 9th hour - 1st being sunrise and 9th being sunset.
Check me on this.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
Well, if ya wanna get technical......
Most of the Muslims Muhammad converted were of Christian or Jewish faith and were already praying toward Jerusalem. They started praying towards Mecca as a break from their former faith. And if you wanna talk religions "stealing" from other religions, read the Epic of Gilgamesh. You'll find a lot of similarities between that one and another reiligion.
Most of the Muslims Muhammad converted were of Christian or Jewish faith and were already praying toward Jerusalem. They started praying towards Mecca as a break from their former faith. And if you wanna talk religions "stealing" from other religions, read the Epic of Gilgamesh. You'll find a lot of similarities between that one and another reiligion.
Pooch
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Well, if ya wanna get technical......
Most of the Muslims Muhammad converted were of Christian or Jewish faith and were already praying toward Jerusalem. They started praying towards Mecca as a break from their former faith. And if you wanna talk religions "stealing" from other religions, read the Epic of Gilgamesh. You'll find a lot of similarities between that one and another reiligion.
[/ QUOTE ]
I just read a synopsis of 'Gilgamesh' and aside from a story about a flood, I don't see any major similarities to any big religions, Christianity included (that was your implication, right?) Maybe you can enlighten us non-epic reading folks (no sarcasm meant; I really am interested).
As far as Mohammed goes, I have no problem with people choosing to worship anyone...whether it's a wife-beating, 'infidel'-killing pedophile (it's all in the Koran folks!) or not. As I recall, though, he couldn't convert Christians and Jews (most, anyway), resulting in his writing in the Koran that the 'infidels' should be killed. And he shamelessly stole ideas from both religions to combine them to his liking (true, not very original). He did get the idea for praying towards Mecca from Jews praying towards Jerusalem, but not because of laziness after their conversion. He chatted it up a lot with the local infidels before trying to convert them (and eventually butcher them) and that's where he got his idea from.
Of course, this all happened 1400 years ago and I wasn't there.
Well, if ya wanna get technical......
Most of the Muslims Muhammad converted were of Christian or Jewish faith and were already praying toward Jerusalem. They started praying towards Mecca as a break from their former faith. And if you wanna talk religions "stealing" from other religions, read the Epic of Gilgamesh. You'll find a lot of similarities between that one and another reiligion.
[/ QUOTE ]
I just read a synopsis of 'Gilgamesh' and aside from a story about a flood, I don't see any major similarities to any big religions, Christianity included (that was your implication, right?) Maybe you can enlighten us non-epic reading folks (no sarcasm meant; I really am interested).
As far as Mohammed goes, I have no problem with people choosing to worship anyone...whether it's a wife-beating, 'infidel'-killing pedophile (it's all in the Koran folks!) or not. As I recall, though, he couldn't convert Christians and Jews (most, anyway), resulting in his writing in the Koran that the 'infidels' should be killed. And he shamelessly stole ideas from both religions to combine them to his liking (true, not very original). He did get the idea for praying towards Mecca from Jews praying towards Jerusalem, but not because of laziness after their conversion. He chatted it up a lot with the local infidels before trying to convert them (and eventually butcher them) and that's where he got his idea from.
Of course, this all happened 1400 years ago and I wasn't there.
kellwolf
Piece of Trash
[ QUOTE ]
I just read a synopsis of 'Gilgamesh' and aside from a story about a flood, I don't see any major similarities to any big religions, Christianity included (that was your implication, right?) Maybe you can enlighten us non-epic reading folks (no sarcasm meant; I really am interested).
[/ QUOTE ]
The flood was in fact my main point. Gilgamesh himself has a lot of Christ-like qualities. Then again there are multiple examples of flood stories (or generally wipe the slate clean stories) in religions pre-dating Christianity. The resurrection is a straight copy of Wiccan beliefs that the goddess dies every winter to rise again in the spring. Timing of Easter isn't an accident either. It's about the same time as the summer solstice, the time the goddess is believed to be re-born. Even the virgin birth is taken from older religions. When you get right down to it, none of the religions are really original.
[ QUOTE ]
I have no problem with people choosing to worship anyone...whether it's a wife-beating, 'infidel'-killing pedophile (it's all in the Koran folks!)
[/ QUOTE ]
Like it or not, it's all in the Bible, too. Read the Old Testament and you'll see a lot of that stuff.
[ QUOTE ]
As I recall, though, he couldn't convert Christians and Jews (most, anyway), resulting in his writing in the Koran that the 'infidels' should be killed.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sure, if you just focus on radical Islam. That's like calling are Christians butchers because they bomb abortion clinics. Islam is the most peaceful religion, while at the same time it is the most violent. It depends on the specific person's interpretation of the Koran, much like it depends on the person's interpretation of the Bible.
[ QUOTE ]
He did get the idea for praying towards Mecca from Jews praying towards Jerusalem, but not because of laziness after their conversion. He chatted it up a lot with the local infidels before trying to convert them (and eventually butcher them) and that's where he got his idea from.
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't really reacall Muhammed "butchering" Jews or Christians. Drug into war with them, maybe. But not "butchering." In fact, if you look back through history, Muslims have generally been very tolerant of Christians and Jews. When the Muslims took control of Jerusalem, they agreed to let the Christians and Jews continue to practice their religions openly. In fact, some of the Muslim shrines in Jerusalem are actually to Moses and Abraham. Now, if you wanna talk the Crusades, then we can go Christians and Muslims butchering each other in an all out holy war, and we can also go into who started it. After that, we can talk about the Inquisition. I never said that praying towards Mecca instead of Jerusalem was due to "laziness after their conversion." I said he did that to try to ease converting them. Mecca happened to be the number one holy city in the Muslim faith. Jerusalem is number three.
I just read a synopsis of 'Gilgamesh' and aside from a story about a flood, I don't see any major similarities to any big religions, Christianity included (that was your implication, right?) Maybe you can enlighten us non-epic reading folks (no sarcasm meant; I really am interested).
[/ QUOTE ]
The flood was in fact my main point. Gilgamesh himself has a lot of Christ-like qualities. Then again there are multiple examples of flood stories (or generally wipe the slate clean stories) in religions pre-dating Christianity. The resurrection is a straight copy of Wiccan beliefs that the goddess dies every winter to rise again in the spring. Timing of Easter isn't an accident either. It's about the same time as the summer solstice, the time the goddess is believed to be re-born. Even the virgin birth is taken from older religions. When you get right down to it, none of the religions are really original.
[ QUOTE ]
I have no problem with people choosing to worship anyone...whether it's a wife-beating, 'infidel'-killing pedophile (it's all in the Koran folks!)
[/ QUOTE ]
Like it or not, it's all in the Bible, too. Read the Old Testament and you'll see a lot of that stuff.
[ QUOTE ]
As I recall, though, he couldn't convert Christians and Jews (most, anyway), resulting in his writing in the Koran that the 'infidels' should be killed.
[/ QUOTE ]
Sure, if you just focus on radical Islam. That's like calling are Christians butchers because they bomb abortion clinics. Islam is the most peaceful religion, while at the same time it is the most violent. It depends on the specific person's interpretation of the Koran, much like it depends on the person's interpretation of the Bible.
[ QUOTE ]
He did get the idea for praying towards Mecca from Jews praying towards Jerusalem, but not because of laziness after their conversion. He chatted it up a lot with the local infidels before trying to convert them (and eventually butcher them) and that's where he got his idea from.
[/ QUOTE ]
Don't really reacall Muhammed "butchering" Jews or Christians. Drug into war with them, maybe. But not "butchering." In fact, if you look back through history, Muslims have generally been very tolerant of Christians and Jews. When the Muslims took control of Jerusalem, they agreed to let the Christians and Jews continue to practice their religions openly. In fact, some of the Muslim shrines in Jerusalem are actually to Moses and Abraham. Now, if you wanna talk the Crusades, then we can go Christians and Muslims butchering each other in an all out holy war, and we can also go into who started it. After that, we can talk about the Inquisition. I never said that praying towards Mecca instead of Jerusalem was due to "laziness after their conversion." I said he did that to try to ease converting them. Mecca happened to be the number one holy city in the Muslim faith. Jerusalem is number three.
Cherokee_Cruiser
Bronteroc
Thank you Kellwolf, that was a very nice post to oppose what Pooch said.
To answer the main question about muslims praying, I say let anyone, be it Christians, Jews, Muslims, [insert any other religion], pray. Just as long as they don't create a safety hazard, I'd be fine with it. Standing in the aisles, I think, would create a safety problem.
I wouldn't care if you pray in your own seat, go right ahead! That goes for all religions.
To answer the main question about muslims praying, I say let anyone, be it Christians, Jews, Muslims, [insert any other religion], pray. Just as long as they don't create a safety hazard, I'd be fine with it. Standing in the aisles, I think, would create a safety problem.
I wouldn't care if you pray in your own seat, go right ahead! That goes for all religions.
Pooch
Well-Known Member
Some good points, Kellwolf. This probably isn't the best place for some semi-religious discussion, but I enjoy a debate (if that's what this is) once in a while and I am always up for learning something. And although you may not be able to tell from my previous post, I am relatively open-minded about Islam (although admittedly less so since 9/11). And I'm really not a mean person. I just don't see a lot of evidence of tolerance/peace/open-mindedness on their part, and I do keep up with (and do a lot of research on) current events.
Just for discussion's sake, though:
[ QUOTE ]
Like it or not, it's all in the Bible, too. Read the Old Testament and you'll see a lot of that stuff.
[/ QUOTE ]
You don't see Jesus doing any of that in the New Testament.
[ QUOTE ]
Sure, if you just focus on radical Islam. That's like calling are Christians butchers because they bomb abortion clinics. Islam is the most peaceful religion, while at the same time it is the most violent. It depends on the specific person's interpretation of the Koran, much like it depends on the person's interpretation of the Bible.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not just focusing on the radicals. Mohammed (along with his army) killed 900 Jews at one time for just being Jewish; that's butchering in my book, and this is from a couple different sources. 'Kill' and 'fight' are in the Koran more than the word 'pray'. These 'radical' Islamic schools are predominate in much of the Middle East, and they are teaching kids from before they can even read to hate Christians and Jews. It seems like every terrorist attack (bombs, murders, kidnappings, etc.) in the world in the last 20 years (excluding a couple by the IRA in the UK) have been done by them. Chechnya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Phillipines, USA, India, Israel, Africa, the list goes on...'Radical' Muslims have killed 15,000 people in recent years, and I can count on three fingers the number of mullahs I've read about/ heard of that condemn violence against us 'infidels.' And yes, there are Christians who are bad. No one denies this. But overall, we're talking about a few bad apples, not a large part of the religion (Respectfully--and I've read a bunch of your posts, and DO respect your opinion--you're in denial if you think they're teaching tolerance and peace with the West in some mosque in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia or Indonesia). This is a way of life for a LOT of them.
And yes, I've had Muslim friends, and they're not ALL of that mindset...
[ QUOTE ]
In fact, if you look back through history, Muslims have generally been very tolerant of Christians and Jews...
Now, if you wanna talk the Crusades, then we can go Christians and Muslims butchering each other in an all out holy war, and we can also go into who started it. After that, we can talk about the Inquisition.
[/ QUOTE ]
Disagree, again respectfully. It is in the Koran for them to kill infidels, and I've seen plenty of evidence to back up the fact that a whole lot of them take that literally. Of course, as with anything, there are exceptions.
The 'infidels' were invaded and slaughtered by Muslims, and the Crusades were the Christians taking their land back (and probably doing some slaughtering in return).
As for the Inquisition, I am going to do more research before I make any comments on it.
Good chatting with you.
Just for discussion's sake, though:
[ QUOTE ]
Like it or not, it's all in the Bible, too. Read the Old Testament and you'll see a lot of that stuff.
[/ QUOTE ]
You don't see Jesus doing any of that in the New Testament.
[ QUOTE ]
Sure, if you just focus on radical Islam. That's like calling are Christians butchers because they bomb abortion clinics. Islam is the most peaceful religion, while at the same time it is the most violent. It depends on the specific person's interpretation of the Koran, much like it depends on the person's interpretation of the Bible.
[/ QUOTE ]
I'm not just focusing on the radicals. Mohammed (along with his army) killed 900 Jews at one time for just being Jewish; that's butchering in my book, and this is from a couple different sources. 'Kill' and 'fight' are in the Koran more than the word 'pray'. These 'radical' Islamic schools are predominate in much of the Middle East, and they are teaching kids from before they can even read to hate Christians and Jews. It seems like every terrorist attack (bombs, murders, kidnappings, etc.) in the world in the last 20 years (excluding a couple by the IRA in the UK) have been done by them. Chechnya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Phillipines, USA, India, Israel, Africa, the list goes on...'Radical' Muslims have killed 15,000 people in recent years, and I can count on three fingers the number of mullahs I've read about/ heard of that condemn violence against us 'infidels.' And yes, there are Christians who are bad. No one denies this. But overall, we're talking about a few bad apples, not a large part of the religion (Respectfully--and I've read a bunch of your posts, and DO respect your opinion--you're in denial if you think they're teaching tolerance and peace with the West in some mosque in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia or Indonesia). This is a way of life for a LOT of them.
And yes, I've had Muslim friends, and they're not ALL of that mindset...
[ QUOTE ]
In fact, if you look back through history, Muslims have generally been very tolerant of Christians and Jews...
Now, if you wanna talk the Crusades, then we can go Christians and Muslims butchering each other in an all out holy war, and we can also go into who started it. After that, we can talk about the Inquisition.
[/ QUOTE ]
Disagree, again respectfully. It is in the Koran for them to kill infidels, and I've seen plenty of evidence to back up the fact that a whole lot of them take that literally. Of course, as with anything, there are exceptions.
The 'infidels' were invaded and slaughtered by Muslims, and the Crusades were the Christians taking their land back (and probably doing some slaughtering in return).
As for the Inquisition, I am going to do more research before I make any comments on it.
Good chatting with you.