Is it just a little boy's dream or a real job?

There is no reason to moan and groan if your a low time pilot working at a regional. You are lucky to be there. My uncle worked for free to build time when he started, Im lucky enough to have some connections and might get a job flying a metro for 20k a year. A lot of people refuse to take jobs that are not local or dont pay well simply because they think its beneath them.

Think of getting your ratings as finishing high school and working at a regional or instructing as college. Do your time and eventually you will get the good paying job.

I see where you're coming from. In fact if you do a search of my threads from about 2-3 years ago you'll see that I had the same philosophy. 20 months at the regionals have changed my view though. Just because people in the past weren't paid well, doesn't mean that we should accept low pay now. I'm probably going to be stuck at my current airline for at least a few more years. I'd venture to say that a large percentage of pilot's won't be able to make the jump to a major. I really don't mind flying the Saab for the duration. I'm about as senior as you can get as an FO right now so I can't complain about my schedule. I sure can complain about money though.

There's something wrong with the mentality that it's ok to pay someone 20,000 a year that's the number 2 person in charge of 34 people's lives. Most people that make 20,000 a year don't worry about much more than where they're going to buy a quarter of weed this weekend. They don't worry about things like passing their next PC, getting ramp checked by the FAA, passing a stringent medical exam every year, being subjected to random drug tests, conforming to grooming standards, commuting, missing important family events. Or the biggest one, if the decision they make will cause the death of 37 people's lives (their own included).

I also don't see why no one sees our low pay as a security/financial risk. At every job I've had in the past where people weren't paid appropriately there were employees that took it upon themselves to redistribute profits. Everything from theft to simple loafing. I haven't seen theft for the most part. However, I have seen many instances where employees make decisions that affect their own bottom line more than the companies. Everything from fuel decisions to pushing to finish a flight before the crew times out. By screwing us the airlines are screwing themselves.

My Dad is a pilot at SWA and I talked to him about this. He said that this doesn't happen at SWA. Simply because the pilot's there know that by being among the highest paid in the industry they have a responsibility to make the company profitable.
 
There is no reason to moan and groan if your a low time pilot working at a regional. You are lucky to be there.

This is probably how the company execs think of us as a pilot group. Hence, the low pay.

Greaper is right, there is something wrong with the its okay to work for 20,000yr. I would even argue we fly with 50-70 people for those rates. we are our own worse enemies in this case.
 
It's wrong to work for 20k a year but you're all doing it anyway? Why?

Oh! No! They are not. They all started out with 200K jobs going straight to the left seat.

It takes no more effort beyond a big wallet (or credit) to become a airline pilot. A few months ago airlines hired 300 hour ATP graduates into a right seat because they did not (and could not) ask for any money. They drooled over this right seat and the great opportunity so heavily that the "drool towel" was swung several times. While the nature of the operation required that right seat to be occupied (not in any realistic function) by regulation the airlines looked and found a way of hiring Chinese labor right within the U.S.

The trend will continue. No worries.
 
Call me crazy but if regionals were to raise their mins up to 1500-2500TT and 500-1000ME I think we would see a definite drop in those pursuing the airline occupation.

Like in 1996? When the minimums for most regionals were better than 1500TT and 500 ME AND they still required a $10,000 "investment" in training?

Nope. There will always be people willing to do what it takes to fly for a living because the alternative is finding a real job. ;)
 
Why do I do it? Because I love it. Is it my childhood dream? Yep. Do I want to do anything else? Nope. Even if the money was dangled in front of me, I love flying for a living.
 
So people expect to hop into a regional at 500 hour or less and make big bucks? Are you kidding me?

Im perfectly fine with making 20k a year for the first year of flying.

Now if im making 20k a year after 4-5 years flying and over 2000 hours then yes there will be a problem but ill cross that bridge when the time comes.
 
Now if im making 20k a year after 4-5 years flying and over 2000 hours then yes there will be a problem but ill cross that bridge when the time comes.

And that, my young padiwan, is the crux of it. When you're in your mid-30s, closing on 10,000 hours TT, and all of the sudden you need to start over, at the bottom of the seniority list (again in some cases) making $20,000...

...then you wonder if Skid's question has merit.
 
If your taking a job at a regional as an experianced pilot with 10000TT then that is your mistake right there.

Assuming most of those hours were airline hours, you could easily get a job making pretty good money. Maybe not in the USA but in Asia, Europe or even Africa. Even in the USA, with 10000 you could get a job at a lot of places and make decent money. World Airways is looking for MD-11 FO's right now and you will start at 60k a year.

Starting over sucks in the USA but its the nature of the business here. If you dont want to start over as an FO you could always go abroad where a lot of companies will hire captains from the street and then you will make Captains pay from day 1. Ive watched my uncle go from 150k a year to 40k a year, then back up to over 100k just to watch him get laid off again and start over at 50k at world. Now hes a captain at world making 160k a year. Its up and down.
 
Another cool thread, Skidz. Yeah it is a little boy's dream, and cubicles tend to deplete dreams. Come to think of it, little boys are pretty smart. They tend to want cool jobs, like Fireman, Pilot, Soldier, or Tyrannosaurus Rex.

How many 20-something Assistant Regional Paperclip Coordinator II's would consider whether they're living out their dreams. No, it's more like, "achieving progressively responsible career goals within my skill set."

Despite the difficulties many folks are having right now, the state of affairs at the moment shouldn't deter the serious dreamers. Presumably, chasing an intangible "dream" is to be able to weather pitfalls, and appreciate small, gradual steps.

"Hold fast to dreams, for if dreams die, Life is a broken-winged bird that cannot fly,
Hold fast to dreams, for if dreams go, life is a barren field, frozen with snow." - Langston Hughes
 
If your taking a job at a regional as an experianced pilot with 10000TT then that is your mistake right there.

Assuming most of those hours were airline hours, you could easily get a job making pretty good money. Maybe not in the USA but in Asia, Europe or even Africa. Even in the USA, with 10000 you could get a job at a lot of places and make decent money.

Spoken like a kid without a family. I had about 7000 TT when I went to Comair after a couple of furloughs. Not everyone can pack up their lives and move to another continent.

Do it while you're young, because when you get older life happens.
 
One comment and one question:

Comment: Zap is extraordinarily experienced in these things. Were I a pro-pilot wanna-be I'd hang on his every word.

Question: Why do pilots always think the opposite of a flying job is a cubicle job?
 
Another cool thread, Skidz. Yeah it is a little boy's dream, and cubicles tend to deplete dreams. Come to think of it, little boys are pretty smart. They tend to want cool jobs, like Fireman, Pilot, Soldier, or Tyrannosaurus Rex.

Sorry, one more comment: that was funny as hell. Reminds me of a Calvin and Hobbes strip!:yup:
 
Comment: Zap is extraordinarily experienced in these things. Were I a pro-pilot wanna-be I'd hang on his every word.

It's not my experience in being furloughed so much. If this guy wants to traipse all over the planet chasing an elusive pilot "career" then the more power to him. For me, the choice was different. Family comes first.
 
Its funny hearing people talking about having to move all over the world just to work a "dream job". That sounds like a nightmare to me. Its bad enough commuting working for a regional in the USA.

Zap is right, unless your a serial-single guy and don't care about your friends, family, personal life moving all over the world is not a good option. But hey, its a "dream-job" right? Now that's what I call sacrificing for a dream! :sarcasm:
 
Now that's what I call sacrificing for a dream! :sarcasm:

And how!

But somebody on here will just tell me I didn't love it enough, or want it bad enough. :banghead:

Why is it on a board like this where those have been there share info with those who haven't, we are chastised for telling the truth. Well guys, sometimes in this profession the truth isn't as good as we hoped it might be. Wouldn't you rather be prepared then to go blissfully ignorant into the unknown?

Perhaps some of us seem negative, but rest assured we're trying to HELP you here. Honest.
 
I did not say you HAD to move all over the world. I said there is money if that is an option for you. If you absolutly must stay in the US then your gonna have to lump it and start over like everyone else when you get layed off and make 50-60k a year. Which honestly is not THAT bad. If you cant find a job with 10000 hours making that kind of money then you might wanna think about a career change.

I know a lot of career pilots and Ive watched them get furloughed and then start over. This has been the way aviation has been for a long time its not just the current market.
 
Well guys, sometimes in this profession the truth isn't as good as we hoped it might be. Wouldn't you rather be prepared then to go blissfully ignorant into the unknown?
Yup ZaP, I guess all we can do as good citizen's of this planet is to pass on the experience and knowledge we have. But hey, its hard to get people to understand what its actually like when your competing against flashy ads and the "dream" everyone believes exist.

I understand what your saying 3enginejock and agree with what your saying also. Its an individual choice to make those large moves. But, its a sad statement on an industry when you have to leave your home and move half a world away just to keep doing the job you love...
 
Back
Top