In-house Delta Job Fair, October 20/21 2017

mastermags said:
Theres no excuse for being a dumbass, especially when the other alternative is, literally, don't do anything.
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Not saying there is. Some folks just handle rejection and being told that they're not worthy of a mainline gig better than others.
 
Cptnchia said:
If a person's reaction to being rejected for a job is asshattery, seems like the not hired decision was a correct one.
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Nailed it.

One of the worst things you can do when you get turned down for a job is to go do something idiotic.

This is probably the best graphical representation of the recruitment "social circles" amongst the various pilot selection teams. If you left a lasting negative impression at one airline, rest assured it's going to get around with catlike quickness.

Screen Shot 2017-09-01 at 1029.43.png
 
JetDoc said:
Not saying there is. Some folks just handle rejection and being told that they're not worthy of a mainline gig better than others.
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Cptnchia said:
If a person's reaction to being rejected for a job is asshattery, seems like the not hired decision was a correct one.
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I think their biggest beef is, okay you're not gonna hire me to fly Delta passenger on widget jets. So now I go back to flying Delta passengers on widget express jets. The details matter. Delta website, Delta tickets, Delta service, Delta jets. Just because they are cheap outsourced operations still doesn't change that they represent Delta's image, brand, and provide them customer service as expected per Delta standards. On one hand, they're not deemed good enough to fly Delta jets and pax. But on the cheaper outsourced side, they continue flying the same brand and pax on the (many) same routes/hubs/cities.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying I can understand their beef.

I also get that regional operations are different, there tend to be more d-bags compared to mainline (partially due to younger crowd (though not all young ones of course), partially due to very minimal hiring standards, etc). And that at mainline you are flying longer flights, longer trips, and could be stuck with a • for a full 14 day trip to Asia. That can't be fun. So I get why Delta (or any legacy) can turn down why their own Express/Connection carrier pilot.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
I think their biggest beef is, okay you're not gonna hire me to fly Delta passenger on widget jets. So now I go back to flying Delta passengers on widget express jets. The details matter. Delta website, Delta tickets, Delta service, Delta jets. Just because they are cheap outsourced operations still doesn't change that they represent Delta's image, brand, and provide them customer service as expected per Delta standards. On one hand, they're not deemed good enough to fly Delta jets and pax. But on the cheaper outsourced side, they continue flying the same brand and pax on the (many) same routes/hubs/cities.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying I can understand their beef.

I also get that regional operations are different, there tend to be more d-bags compared to mainline (partially due to younger crowd (though not all young ones of course), partially due to very minimal hiring standards, etc). And that at mainline you are flying longer flights, longer trips, and could be stuck with a for a full 14 day trip to Asia. That can't be fun. So I get why Delta (or any legacy) can turn down why their own Express/Connection carrier pilot.
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You're on the right track. They're not turned down because they aren't good enough to fly Delta passengers on mainline, they're turned down because they showed some part of themselves that indicated that they wouldn't be pleasant to work with.

Anyone can fly an airplane. I just don't want to spend my time cooped up with some d-bag.
 
Cherokee_Cruiser said:
I think their biggest beef is, okay you're not gonna hire me to fly Delta passenger on widget jets. So now I go back to flying Delta passengers on widget express jets. The details matter. Delta website, Delta tickets, Delta service, Delta jets. Just because they are cheap outsourced operations still doesn't change that they represent Delta's image, brand, and provide them customer service as expected per Delta standards. On one hand, they're not deemed good enough to fly Delta jets and pax. But on the cheaper outsourced side, they continue flying the same brand and pax on the (many) same routes/hubs/cities.

I'm not saying it's right. I'm just saying I can understand their beef.

I also get that regional operations are different, there tend to be more d-bags compared to mainline (partially due to younger crowd (though not all young ones of course), partially due to very minimal hiring standards, etc). And that at mainline you are flying longer flights, longer trips, and could be stuck with a for a full 14 day trip to Asia. That can't be fun. So I get why Delta (or any legacy) can turn down why their own Express/Connection carrier pilot.
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If you're not a good fit for the companies corporate culture, you're not a good fit. Skyway, however, may love you.

They're not looking to hire button pushers, they're trying to hire people that are going to dissolve into the corporate fabric and a vast majority of people applying can fly airplanes, but not all of them are both going to be happy with the way they do business.

Think of it like this. A Michelin-star chef might drop by McDonald's for a Big Mac, but it doesn't necessarily mean the worker that assembled the Big Mac is going to fit in th chefs kitchen.
 
Derg said:
Think of it like this. A Michelin-star chef might drop by McDonald's for a Big Mac, but it doesn't necessarily mean the worker that assembled the Big Mac is going to fit in th chefs kitchen.
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I don't understand this analogy.
Are you saying that delta pilots are Michelin star chefs and regional pilots are like McDonald's workers?

The other interpretation doesn't make sense to me either, because passengers think they are flying Delta when on the regionals. People don't think they are eating at a five star restaurant when at mcdonalds.
 
slough said:
I don't understand this analogy.
Are you saying that delta pilots are Michelin star chefs and regional pilots are like McDonald's workers?

The other interpretation doesn't make sense to me either, because passengers think they are flying Delta when on the regionals. People don't think they are eating at a five star restaurant when at mcdonalds.
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I don't think he's comparing pilots to chefs or McDonald's cooks... He's saying the the two are different environment wise. Just because someone can make food at a burger place doesn't mean they would fit in with the environment of a upscale kitchen.

Don't read more into.
 
poser765 said:
I don't think he's comparing pilots to chefs or McDonald's cooks... He's saying the the two are different environment wise. Just because someone can make food at a burger place doesn't mean they would fit in with the environment of a upscale kitchen.

Don't read more into.
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Gotcha. Still a little confusing but I'm following what you are saying.
 
slough said:
Gotcha. Still a little confusing but I'm following what you are saying.
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Try it this way.

Delta requires a certain level of compliance with company policy and a willingness to go above and beyond your job description that may be lacking at certain other shops.

Some guys may have an issue with wearing a hat, going down on the ramp to retrieve a stroller, helping a passenger get to their next gate.

We all know someone like that. They may be ace if the base, but if their interpersonal/ customer service skills are lacking or non existent, they're not gonna be a happy camper at Delta.
 
Cptnchia said:
Try it this way.

Delta requires a certain level of compliance with company policy and a willingness to go above and beyond your job description that may be lacking at certain other shops.

Some guys may have an issue with wearing a hat, going down on the ramp to retrieve a stroller, helping a passenger get to their next gate.

We all know someone like that. They may be ace if the base, but if their interpersonal/ customer service skills are lacking or non existent, they're not gonna be a happy camper at Delta.
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But it's OK to lack those "interpersonal/ customer service skills" at a delta regional as long as those people are earning pennies on the the dollar and subsidizing your pay? OK, gotcha. FWIW, I wear my hat, been toe to toe with a ramp supervisor over a miss-tagged stroller and won and I have got down on my hands and knees to tie the laces of an elderly gentleman's shoes so he wouldn't trip and fall walking up the jetway, all while representing the "delta brand". Not because I felt I had to but because I wanted to and it was the right thing to do. I can't even begin to count the amount of mainline deadheads I have been on when the cabin is not even half empty while deplaning and both frick and frack are both long gone and the cockpit is dark but I suppose one of you will try and justify that away too.
 
JetDoc said:
But it's OK to lack those "interpersonal/ customer service skills" at a delta regional as long as those people are earning pennies on the the dollar and subsidizing your pay? OK, gotcha. FWIW, I wear my hat, been toe to toe with a ramp supervisor over a miss-tagged stroller and won and I have got down on my hands and knees to tie the laces of an elderly gentleman's shoes so he wouldn't trip and fall walking up the jetway, all while representing the "delta brand". Not because I felt I had to but because I wanted to and it was the right thing to do. I can't even begin to count the amount of mainline deadheads I have been on when the cabin is not even half empty while deplaning and both frick and frack are both long gone and the cockpit is dark but I suppose one of you will try and justify that away too.
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That's cool.

But if you want the job, you have to play the game.

When I applied for the Naval Academy in high school, I thought it was preposterous that I was deemed a "less than competitive" applicant because I didn't have a "varsity sport", had a high GPA in advanced studies with AP Calculus, AP Physics and AP English.

But if I wanted to get into the Naval Academy, I had to set some time out of my studies and be a badass Badminton player because I didn't have a chance in the world at Football or Baseball because I wasn't sports-oriented.

It was part of the game that I would have to play if I wanted to reach that goal and I decided it wasn't worth it and never really mentioned this in the last 29 years.

Why did the Naval Academy require varsity sports? I literally had no idea, but they did and I'm sure they had their reasons. The Coast Guard Academy and the Merchant Marine Academy (as far as I remember) didn't, but those were two organizations I didn't have any interest in and felt like a consolation.

On second thought, I probably should have told my story about getting a CFI and my disdain of Lazy-8s which literally made no friggen sense to me why I had to master teaching those when I'd literally never do them in the real world.
 
JetDoc said:
But it's OK to lack those "interpersonal/ customer service skills" at a delta regional as long as those people are earning pennies on the the dollar and subsidizing your pay? OK, gotcha. FWIW, I wear my hat, been toe to toe with a ramp supervisor over a miss-tagged stroller and won and I have got down on my hands and knees to tie the laces of an elderly gentleman's shoes so he wouldn't trip and fall walking up the jetway, all while representing the "delta brand". Not because I felt I had to but because I wanted to and it was the right thing to do. I can't even begin to count the amount of mainline deadheads I have been on when the cabin is not even half empty while deplaning and both frick and frack are both long gone and the cockpit is dark but I suppose one of you will try and justify that away too.
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No it's not OK to lack those skills but what skills your employer requires is between you and them. Does Delta subcontract? Unfortunately yes. Prior management made that bad bet. Present management is slowly working to reduce the reliance on regionals.

Reading your past post history, it sounds like you didn't fully understand the regional relationship. It's not symbiotic and never was. It has always been about the lowest subcontractor. Truthfully, I think there is an entire huge group of regional pilots who were sold a lie and didn't do their due diligence during the rapid regional growth after 9/11. The writing was on the wall for contraction of the regionals back then.

Fact is, only about a small percentage of high school players will make it all the way to the NFL. Same with pilots starting out with a fresh commercial. Of course, if regionals didn't exist, there'd be more jobs at the top level.
 
Cptnchia said:
Fact is, only about a small percentage of high school players will make it all the way to the NFL. Same with pilots starting out with a fresh commercial. Of course, if regionals didn't exist, there'd be more jobs at the top level.
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Wait, Top level as in Mainline or top level as in Widebodies? Some airlines are just reshifting their focus on outsourcing a different end of the pay scale lately.

I am excited to see the supposed renaissance of the pacific though.
 
Cptnchia said:
Fact is, only about a small percentage of high school players will make it all the way to the NFL
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And eventually those high school players are forced to accept that they peaked far too early and will never turn pro; they take a jobs at Best Buy, frustrated, selling TV's to their classmates, watching as their jr teammates play on the 60 inch flatscreen on the display wall.
 
Derg said:
That's cool.

But if you want the job, you have to play the game.

When I applied for the Naval Academy in high school, I thought it was preposterous that I was deemed a "less than competitive" applicant because I didn't have a "varsity sport", had a high GPA in advanced studies with AP Calculus, AP Physics and AP English.

But if I wanted to get into the Naval Academy, I had to set some time out of my studies and be a badass Badminton player because I didn't have a chance in the world at Football or Baseball because I wasn't sports-oriented.

It was part of the game that I would have to play if I wanted to reach that goal and I decided it wasn't worth it and never really mentioned this in the last 29 years.

Why did the Naval Academy require varsity sports? I literally had no idea, but they did and I'm sure they had their reasons. The Coast Guard Academy and the Merchant Marine Academy (as far as I remember) didn't, but those were two organizations I didn't have any interest in and felt like a consolation.

On second thought, I probably should have told my story about getting a CFI and my disdain of Lazy-8s which literally made no friggen sense to me why I had to master teaching those when I'd literally never do them in the real world.
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For the record, the lazy 8 is one of the few remaining maneuvers that require much in the way of stick and rudder skills to do correctly. I actually enjoyed teaching them, but I'm weird.
 
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