History of the No Furlough Clause

Trip7

Well-Known Member
I keep hearing that every "no furlough clause" in the history of the airline business has been broken. Im looking for examples. Also, only ones that didnt involve a bankruptcy judge. Thanks!
 
I keep hearing that every "no furlough clause" in the history of the airline business has been broken. Im looking for examples. Also, only ones that didnt involve a bankruptcy judge. Thanks!

Getting worried are we? :)
 
Sun Country had a contract that pretty much didn't allow for furloughs. That was changed, not necessarily good for business.
 
Sun Country had a contract that pretty much didn't allow for furloughs. That was changed, not necessarily good for business.

That's my thinking.... Even with it they could furlough, you all file a grevience... By the time its heard, if its heard, you all will be back. Daddy DELTA is sure wanting to chop chop chop.... :(
 
Fly now, Grieve later!


I hate this mindset. As professionals we always try to "Get the job done", but there are times where something is a BLATANT disregard for a contract and we get told to "fly now, grieve later". I know at 9E this happens all the time, then the grievance gets denied (regardless of how clear the violation is) and we have soo many grievances to take to appeal/system board that many people "fly now, grieve later" and all they did was help the company and got the shaft.:dunno:
 
:rotfl:

Marcus, have you asked your LEC/MEC leadership about this? They'll be able to point you in the right direction. Although, they might just not want to answer it.

Yup. Union is telling everyone the company will have to file bankruptcy before furloughing another. Thats why im trying to see if there has been any case in History where a no furlough contract was broken without bankruptcy.

PGT: Sun Country went bankrupt so that doesnt count
 
APA didn't have a no furlough clause but they did have a pilot floor that AMR couldn't go below. Guess what AMR is below that number now and an arbitrator ruled it is OK.
 
DL had a no furlough clause in 2001. Need I say more?

Need not Denny. Fact of the matter is if they need to cut cost and furlough they are going to. Period. Regardless of what the contract says.... And I have a feeling the senior union leadership (whom jobs would be safe), would much rather that then the company reducing their hours, money in their bank, etc.... Or at least thats the mind set I've been seeing lately. I've got mine so screw you mentality that MUST stop. But I hate to say it, but if ASA management determinds they need to furlough more, including those "protected", I see it happening. Perhaps not a furlough, but a FORCED leave of absense? Make a play on words.
 
Yup. Union is telling everyone the company will have to file bankruptcy before furloughing another. Thats why im trying to see if there has been any case in History where a no furlough contract was broken without bankruptcy.

PGT: Sun Country went bankrupt so that doesnt count
they could furlough all they wanted, and just hope for a sympathetic arbitrator a year or so from now. That was SOP at Mesa wrt contract violations
 
DL had a no furlough clause in 2001. Need I say more?

Yup, Bankruptcy. Now enough said:)

Need not Denny. Fact of the matter is if they need to cut cost and furlough they are going to. Period. Regardless of what the contract says.... And I have a feeling the senior union leadership (whom jobs would be safe), would much rather that then the company reducing their hours, money in their bank, etc.... Or at least thats the mind set I've been seeing lately. I've got mine so screw you mentality that MUST stop. But I hate to say it, but if ASA management determinds they need to furlough more, including those "protected", I see it happening. Perhaps not a furlough, but a FORCED leave of absense? Make a play on words.

I agree. Technically, the "no-furlough clause" has worked. If there was no clause I'm absolutely sure they would have furloughed past 56, which is just a weird number to furlough. Lots of people around the crew room say the company can do whatever they want. Well if they could, why didn't they furlough past the protected list then? We're definitely still overstaffed.

I'm sure though if the overstaffing starts to get rediculous(losing 20 200s in the spring) that the no furlough clause will be renegiotated. Just doesn't make any business sense to be that overstaffed. But so far looks like the clause has been worth more than the paper its on.
 
Yup, Bankruptcy. Now enough said:)


2001. Don't think they filed bankruptcy till about 2005. The money they got from the government post-9/11 was enough to keep them out. I think enough was said earlier.

Even then, here's the point: what's the penalty to ASA if they furlough? Money? Fines? Slap on the wrist? Odds are good if they need it done to save $$$, they'll furlough now and pay for it later....maybe. Worst case scenario, when it finally makes it out of the grievance process and legal system 4-5 years from now, they'll be forced to re-call those the furloughed.
 
No point in a No Furlough Clause....screw the bottom 100 pilots, who cares. Seems to be the name of the game right? Get on top as fast as you can.
 
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