Furlough Estimates

jynxyjoe said:
I love watching military guys mouths drop when they find out what insurance costs in the real world. 3x now ive been priveledged to mutter exasperatedly, "yeah thats what that whole public health option debate is about"
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This is true. One of the main reasons I stuck with the reserves when I quit. Tricare isn't perfect, but it is the best bargain around. I will say my employer offers BCBS packages that are pretty competitive with tricare reserve select (what I have now), but I am well aware that isn't the norm. Other thing that makes mil guys jaw drop is the tax burden you assume once off active duty. We still paid fed taxes on active duty (at least when not deployed to a combat tax exclusion area), but the taxable income was significantly less than gross. It is eye opening to see 24+ % of your total pay go to the gubmint.
 
Flyinthrew said:
I just had a conversation today with a friend who made a clean break after 10 years to go fly corporate. He said his only regret is the healthcare stuff. Still though, it’s just a part of the retirement benefits package. Taxpayer funded yes, but so is literally every dime I’ve earned in my entire career. It’s basically a contract between DOD and it’s workers. That’s a big difference from a social program.

Now, there is definitely merit to scaling it up for the “citizens benefits package” but there needs to be quite a bit of evolution in both the healthcare industry and the tax base.


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Yeah but I'm not saying mil guys don't deserve it, just saying peoples politics derive from places other than where they get fed, that isn't new or surprising, so people should stop being surprised when they don't "vote their interest" or whatever the buzz word is. Mil guys are a good example of arch conservative, who literally feed off the government teet. They clearly don't vote their interest, and their politics aren't derived from sucking on that sweet sweet gubbmint teet.
 
///AMG said:
This is true. One of the main reasons I stuck with the reserves when I quit. Tricare isn't perfect, but it is the best bargain around. I will say my employer offers BCBS packages that are pretty competitive with tricare reserve select (what I have now), but I am well aware that isn't the norm. Other thing that makes mil guys jaw drop is the tax burden you assume once off active duty. We still paid fed taxes on active duty (at least when not deployed to a combat tax exclusion area), but the taxable income was significantly less than gross. It is eye opening to see 24+ % of your total pay go to the gubmint.
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IDK man, 24% is a pretty good deal. Even if that's your effective tax rate after the year is done and you get back or pay in whatever is owed that's a good deal.

80 grand, single bread winner, child and a wife with somewhat normal health issues and between taxes and health costs (total health costs including going to the doc) I was losing 40 something percent of my check. That's why a lot of middle class families say "F it, instead of giving it to Cigna i'll give it to the gubbmint and I hope they all go bankrupt and CEO's throw themselves off those buildings they made headfirst."

I still say that single, divorced, and doing the single dad thing with help from grandparents. *shrug* Healthcare costs are whack yo.
 
///AMG said:
I think you would be surprised to see what the actual cross section of military members identify as. Personally, I am far from "arch conservative". I'm very much not the only one.
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Eh, I can't speak for all Mil, just the ones I run across now, and the ones I ran across in the technician world (DOD crap).
 
///AMG said:
This is true. One of the main reasons I stuck with the reserves when I quit. Tricare isn't perfect, but it is the best bargain around. I will say my employer offers BCBS packages that are pretty competitive with tricare reserve select (what I have now), but I am well aware that isn't the norm. Other thing that makes mil guys jaw drop is the tax burden you assume once off active duty. We still paid fed taxes on active duty (at least when not deployed to a combat tax exclusion area), but the taxable income was significantly less than gross. It is eye opening to see 24+ % of your total pay go to the gubmint.
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Someone’s gotta pay the MIL guys, after all, right?

(though, mostly, LockMart, and not the guys flying LockMart)
 
jynxyjoe said:
IDK man, 24% is a pretty good deal. Even if that's your effective tax rate after the year is done and you get back or pay in whatever is owed that's a good deal.
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I also didn't mention I am a resident of a no income tax state. Which obviously helps a great deal. And I have a wife, 2 kids, so the basic everyday person tax credits are in my favor.
 
jynxyjoe said:
Yeah but I'm not saying mil guys don't deserve it, just saying peoples politics derive from places other than where they get fed, that isn't new or surprising, so people should stop being surprised when they don't "vote their interest" or whatever the buzz word is. Mil guys are a good example of arch conservative, who literally feed off the government teet. They clearly don't vote their interest, and their politics aren't derived from sucking on that sweet sweet gubbmint teet.
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Ah, I see now. I'm not an arch conservative, and many in my peer group are not, but your generalization is close enough.
 
///AMG said:
Not lost on me, even whilst active duty. But it has been interesting to see just what that burden equates to in civilian life.
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Yep. And that’s not to say you don’t deserve it.

But god almighty the people who built the machines you fly get a pretty penny premium for ‘em - and that premium is quite probably not justified.
 
///AMG said:
I also didn't mention I am a resident of a no income tax state. Which obviously helps a great deal. And I have a wife, 2 kids, so the basic everyday person tax credits are in my favor.
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My experience of living in a no income tax state was when you could still write off the income tax from the state into your federal tax. I haven't seen what the new tax code offers for no income tax states yet. I need to spend some time shooting with the accountant sometime and see where all that stuff lands.
 
Flyinthrew said:
Ah, I see now. I'm not an arch conservative, and many in my peer group are not, but your generalization is close enough.
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Yeah, in my life I don't run across many super hard core guys except the mil guys so it's the one that sticks out the most. Not all mil guys are hardcore conservative, but enough that it sticks out.
 
jynxyjoe said:
My experience of living in a no income tax state was when you could still write off the income tax from the state into your federal tax. I haven't seen what the new tax code offers for no income tax states yet. I need to spend some time shooting with the accountant sometime and see where all that stuff lands.
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That was done specifically to flip the bird at the blue states, who dare to offer services with their tax monies, as I’m sure you’re well aware.
 
jynxyjoe said:
Yeah, in my life I don't run across many super hard core guys except the mil guys so it's the one that sticks out the most. Not all mil guys are hardcore conservative, but enough that it sticks out.
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This is an interesting perspective. I would honestly say my experience has been the exact opposite. Most of the frothiest at the mouth conservatives I've run across have been lifelong civilians. There are also very significant differences in demographics within the military, so the ones you know may be very different than the ones I know. There is certainly a solid population in the mil that could be described as arch conservative, I won't dispute that.
 
jynxyjoe said:
My experience of living in a no income tax state was when you could still write off the income tax from the state into your federal tax. I haven't seen what the new tax code offers for no income tax states yet. I need to spend some time shooting with the accountant sometime and see where all that stuff lands.
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Fair enough. When I was active, my home state was an income tax place. But I was exempt from paying as long as I didn't reside there (I didn't). So for the last 12 years, I haven't had to worry about it. Long story short, I don't remember what the tax situation was before that, and I was making too little for it to really matter anyway at that time.
 
///AMG said:
This is an interesting perspective. I would honestly say my experience has been the exact opposite. Most of the frothiest at the mouth conservatives I've run across have been lifelong civilians. There are also very significant differences in demographics within the military, so the ones you know may be very different than the ones I know. There is certainly a solid population in the mil that could be described as arch conservative, I won't dispute that.
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I've lived in 9 different states, 14 different cities, certainly haven't lived any ONE place long enough to get a perfect sounding of all people. I did like gun clubs and I drift to the conservative side no matter where I live, so my guess would be my circles are conservative anyway, some of them are arch conservative, some of those are also mil or ex mil. But as for work, I don't find myself to the right of most of my coworkers historically if it comes up. When it comes up it's usually that "feeling out period" of trying to get conversation going for someone who enjoys politics but doesn't wanna fight in a cockpit (which, like, thumbs up to that).
 
Yeah, mil culture, at least at work, is *should* be largely apolitical. That might be the thing I see......most of us are used to biting our tongue and venting in private rather than in the workplace (or god forbid on social media). I've lived in 8 states......you are right, they are all very different in their own way.
 
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