Disgust with Mangement

JumpWake

JumpWake

Well-Known Member
I got my latest edition of the ALPA magazine a couple days ago and was absolutely shocked, saddened, sickened, and disgusted when I read a story in there about a Trans States mechanic.

It's on page 36 of the ALPA magazine, but I'll summarize. Mechanic Matthew Walsh was working late at STL on Labor Day 2008. He was returning home after a long shift to his wife and 6 month-old daughter. For unknown reasons, he was shot and killed outside his home by unknown persons. What is unique here is that Matt was only 23 hours from being eligible for TSA's emplyee life insurance. 23 hours. You would think a mere 23 hours, the company would do something, anything to help the family out, after such a tragic loss. To date, the company has done nothing to help the family. The article says the company didn't even offer condolences to the family.


Contrast that to what I read today in the ALPA FastRead about a Pinnacle CA and his daughter who needed a liver transplant.

FedEx Helps Out Pinnacle Pilot Family Member in Need

Friday the 13th may be considered an “unlucky” day for some, but for little Grace Patterson, Friday, February 13, turned out to be the first day of the rest of her life when she received the call about her long-awaited liver transplant.

At 13 days old, Gracie, the daughter of Memphis-based Pinnacle Airlines Capt. David Patterson and his wife, Rachel, was diagnosed with Maple Syrup Urine Disease (MSUD), a life-long, and potentially life-threatening metabolic disease that inhibits the breakdown of three of the amino acids in protein.

Gracie’s diagnosis led the Pattersons to the University of Pittsburgh Hospital, a renowned transplant and MSUD research facility. Dave and Rachel were able to control Gracie’s response to the disease by monitoring her amino acid levels and keeping her on a very restricted diet. While there is no cure for this genetic condition, the Pattersons were told a liver transplant would cure Gracie of the metabolic condition related to her disease and give her the best chance at a normal life without the life-altering risks associated with MSUD.

On Friday, February 13, at 3:40 p.m. (ET) in the middle of a trip, Capt. Patterson received a message from his wife that a compatible liver had been found, and the long-awaited liver transplant was immediately scheduled. From Oakland, Tennessee, Rachel and Grace, now 2, had only four and a half hours to get to the doors of Children’s Hospital of Pittsburgh.

Calling on his resources at Pinnacle, Capt. Patterson soon realized that Pinnacle’s commercial flights out of Memphis and into Pittsburgh would not meet their immediate needs, and Pinnacle did not have a spare aircraft that could be used for the urgent trip. Capt. Patterson then called Carl Evans, managing director of the Corporate Aviation Division of FedEx, with whom he had spoken earlier that week to discuss his time-sensitive need for air travel from Memphis to Pittsburgh. In the time it took Rachel and Grace to arrive at the FedEx corporate hangar, Evans had arranged everything, including transportation from PIT airport to the hospital. Due to Evans’s quick response and consummate professionalism, Grace made it to the hospital within the time required.

Gracie is in recovery at the Children’s Hospital of Pittsburgh, a recovery that will be long and arduous for a 2-year-old. Dave, Rachel, and older brother Noah are confident, because of their faith and the doctors who are treating Grace, that she will have the best possible outcome.
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Now, I realize it's a different kind of situation, but still, it shows just what kind of good management can actually do in these times. There is no excuse for TSA management to react the way they did to a slaying of one of our own, especially at a company as small as we are. It's just sickening and disheartening to see our company treat our employees like this, but I guess it's nothing new for us. Kudos to Pinnacle for trying, and to FEDEX for actually making it happen and giving this little girl and her family a chance.
 
What do you expect TSA to do? Unless TSA self-insures, the insurance company controls all of that. I make the assumption that the premiums that the insurance company charges TSA are based on certain conditions (e.g. length of employment, position held, I don't know what). Those conditions weren't satsfied. It's a tragedy, but how is it TSA's fault?

I suppose TSA could write a check in place of the insurance company, but then that sets a precedent.

I asked this question before. Why do people think that the burden's people experience in their private lives should be placed on their employer?
 
Plus, where do you draw the line? 23 hours? 1 day? 2 days? 1 month? Business is in the business to make money. If the guy had a wife and child depending on his income surely he had personal life insurance. If he didn't he was a damn fool. What kind of man builds a family and then doesn't ensure their safety and financial well-being?
 
skydog said:
What do you expect TSA to do? Unless TSA self-insures, the insurance company controls all of that. I make the assumption that the premiums that the insurance company charges TSA are based on certain conditions (e.g. length of employment, position held, I don't know what). Those conditions weren't satsfied. It's a tragedy, but how is it TSA's fault?

I suppose TSA could write a check in place of the insurance company, but then that sets a precedent.

I asked this question before. Why do people think that the burden's people experience in their private lives should be placed on their employer?
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I never said TSA was at fault...just something, anything to acknowledge the fact that one of their own was murdered. Even if the company did something to help out the family, instead of having to have the pilots mobilize a fundraiser for the family, would be a step in the right direction. The fact that the company did nothing and continues to do nothing speaks volumes about how they value their employees...anyone who currently works or has worked here knows what I'm talking about.
 
JetsGoWhee said:
I never said TSA was at fault...just something, anything to acknowledge the fact that one of their own was murdered. Even if the company did something to help out the family, instead of having to have the pilots mobilize a fundraiser for the family, would be a step in the right direction. The fact that the company did nothing and continues to do nothing speaks volumes about how they value their employees...anyone who currently works or has worked here knows what I'm talking about.
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I have worked at TSA(1993-94, non-pilot). And I share your opinion about the company and HK regarding the value they place on the employees. But I don't expect such things from my employer. The only expectation I have is that I will be paid, on time, and at the agreed upon rate, for the services I provide.

I think it's a little #####ty that the company didn't even send flowers, but what are you gonna do? It is what it is. No point in getting upset over it.

I suspect that HK holds the majority of his employees in the same regard as you and I would of any stranger. In a way, I can even understand it. Would YOU want to be close with someone you may one day have to furlough, discipline, or fire?
 
Well yeah. If you don't care for your employees how can you expect them to care about you or your company? It's a two way street!
 
skydog said:
I have worked at TSA(1993-94, non-pilot). And I share your opinion about the company and HK regarding the value they place on the employees. But I don't expect such things from my employer. The only expectation I have is that I will be paid, on time, and at the agreed upon rate, for the services I provide.
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What did you do @ TSA? Maybe I'm an optimist, but I expect an employer to take care of their employees and treat them with at least the tiniest hint of respect and gratitude. As opposed to none.

I think it's a little #####ty that the company didn't even send flowers, but what are you gonna do? It is what it is. No point in getting upset over it.
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See below.

Rocketman99 said:
Well yeah. If you don't care for your employees how can you expect them to care about you or your company? It's a two way street!
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BINGO.
 
I'm surprised that anyone would be surprised to find out management ( or an insurance company) sees employees as nothing more than another "cost center". There are no ethics in this deal; ethics are for Boy Scouts. Nothing personal...just business.

( Yes, I know there is the occasional exception. There is ALWAYS an exception but that won't disprove the broader facts. )

Now you have been warned so you can plan accordingly. All mistakes affecting your well being from this point forward will be yours.

Sorry to bring you such bad news. :(:(
 
I know how management is, I was just trying to make a point showing both the good and the bad. Neglecting a murder, or providing an aircraft so that an employees daughter can get her liver transplant.
 
JetsGoWhee said:
What did you do @ TSA? Maybe I'm an optimist, but I expect an employer to take care of their employees and treat them with at least the tiniest hint of respect and gratitude. As opposed to none.
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I was a crew scheduler, my first airline job.

I'm an optimist as well, but I have no illusions about how an employer should or will treat me. They need a service done, I perform the service in exchange for payment. It's really no different than when you go buy a Big Mac at McDonald's. You're the customer, you want your needs satisfied. It's the same thing with working. Your employer is the customer. They expect satisfaction for their money. It's up to you to provide it.

I don't expect my employer to "take care of me." It's my job to take care of myself. I do that by recognizing that my well being, as guaranteed by my job and salary, requires me to take care of my employer. Therefore I always strive to do the best job I can. I guess my attitude is, while I recognize that what's good for my employer may not necessarily be good for me, what is bad for my employer IS ultimately going to be bad for me.

Outside of that, all I expect of any employer, or anyone, is that they treat me with the respect and courtesy that one human being owes another. Gratitude? I'd rather have the paycheck. I'll fulfill Maslow's need of love and acceptance in other ways thank you very much.

My opinion? Put these notions aside and place responsibility for your happiness and well being on your own shoulders, where it belongs. You will live a much better and more satisfying life.
 
Rocketman99 said:
Well yeah. If you don't care for your employees how can you expect them to care about you or your company? It's a two way street!
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Agreed I am living that life. But what can you do?:(

You try to help your company and they treat you like crap.:(

So I am just returning the favor. NOw I just go to work, do the tasks and go home. THat's it. :)
 
CrippleHawk said:
Agreed I am living that life. But what can you do?:(
You try to help your company and they treat you like crap.:(
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CH,

To answer your question: not much. Don't be mad, be prepared and take care of yourself and family. If that means moving on to what you see as better circumstances, then do that when you can.

And...leave having earned a good recommendation from the people who mistreated you. You are the least of their worries but they are not the least of yours, at least until you are firmly in the next job.

Don't let 'em surprise you. :D
 
skydog said:
What do you expect TSA to do?
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Cut the family a decent check and set up a fund so fellow employees can contribute. The company could then agree to match all contributions to encourage even more giving by fellow employees.

I suppose TSA could write a check in place of the insurance company, but then that sets a precedent.
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Yes, heaven forbid that a precedent of compassion and humanity be set. :rolleyes:

Capt. Caucasian said:
All benefits should start Day 1, regardless. None of this "six month wait" BS.
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Exactly.
 
The key is to get benefits that start on Day One. This needs to be a focus.

TSA is kind of stuck in this case. If they cut a check to the family, they are setting a precedent. What happens to the next time a person without coverage dies? They would almost be obligated to do the same or perhaps face legal action for not doing so. Even if they wanted to do something, they would be hard pressed to do it. The best alternative for the company and for the employees is for benefits starting day one.
 
And here comes my old friend PCL...

OK, so TSA cuts a check to the guy's widow. What happens when something tragic happens to the next employee? Cut a check? Start a fund? How about the next guy? Same thing? The guy after that? When does it stop?

Compassion and humanity are wonderful things. As human beings, we should be compassionate and empathetic towards our fellow man. But there is limit to what one can do. These ideas you have, while nice thoughts, all cost money. Once the precedent is set, employees will be looking to their employer everytime there is a misfortune. Where do you draw the line? Where does it stop? Best not to open the barn door in the first place.

While only 1 in 10, or 100, or 1000, experience a personal tragedgy like this, what happens when that is multiplied across a company of a thousand, ten thousand, or a hundred thousand employees? Should it be done for all of them? What situation qualifies? Death of a loved one? Loss of a license? When your employer is bankrupt from all these expenses and everyone is out of work, will you still think it was a good idea?

Again, it's this question of where did the expectation that employers should bear the burdens of their employees private lives come from?

Your better off expecting and planning to take care of your own needs, rather than relying on someone else, which is essentially what you advocate.

Three years ago, my father died enexpectedly. Because I had taken that responsibility for myself and my family, I had money in the bank, and a lot of accumulated personal time. My employer did the only thing it reasonably could do: relax their personal time-off use policies so that I could take some time off and not lose pay. I was able to do this because I had prepared for the unexpected.

I bet your pardon for bringing politics into this, but it's no surprise to me that you are such an Obama supporter. You seem to have this touchy-feely sense of social justice and equity; a need to displace your troubles onto someone else's shoulders, that he plays right into. It's a nice thought. But the world doesn't work that way.
 
skydog said:
OK, so TSA cuts a check to the guy's widow. What happens when something tragic happens to the next employee? Cut a check? Start a fund? How about the next guy? Same thing? The guy after that? When does it stop?
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Why should it stop? The company should be providing insurance from day one for every employee.
 
skydog said:
And here comes my old friend PCL...

OK, so TSA cuts a check to the guy's widow. What happens when something tragic happens to the next employee? Cut a check? Start a fund? How about the next guy? Same thing? The guy after that? When does it stop?

Compassion and humanity are wonderful things. As human beings, we should be compassionate and empathetic towards our fellow man. But there is limit to what one can do. These ideas you have, while nice thoughts, all cost money. Once the precedent is set, employees will be looking to their employer everytime there is a misfortune. Where do you draw the line? Where does it stop? Best not to open the barn door in the first place.

While only 1 in 10, or 100, or 1000, experience a personal tragedgy like this, what happens when that is multiplied across a company of a thousand, ten thousand, or a hundred thousand employees? Should it be done for all of them? What situation qualifies? Death of a loved one? Loss of a license? When your employer is bankrupt from all these expenses and everyone is out of work, will you still think it was a good idea?

Again, it's this question of where did the expectation that employers should bear the burdens of their employees private lives come from?

Your better off expecting and planning to take care of your own needs, rather than relying on someone else, which is essentially what you advocate.

Three years ago, my father died enexpectedly. Because I had taken that responsibility for myself and my family, I had money in the bank, and a lot of accumulated personal time. My employer did the only thing it reasonably could do: relax their personal time-off use policies so that I could take some time off and not lose pay. I was able to do this because I had prepared for the unexpected.

I bet your pardon for bringing politics into this, but it's no surprise to me that you are such an Obama supporter. You seem to have this touchy-feely sense of social justice and equity; a need to displace your troubles onto someone else's shoulders, that he plays right into. It's a nice thought. But the world doesn't work that way.
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A crew scheduler, what a surprise. What's the matter, been called names one too many times? I love how you're using this poor guys case because it's obvious that you do not care at all other than to spread you agenda that employees are minions with no rights. Yes the company can't be doing favors but as you've said for a 1 in a millionth case? Yes it can, when was the last time something like this has happened to TSA? Nobody is expecting anything out of Hulas other than a "fair" and equal contract like any other regional out there. Did you know that TSA is one of the lowest contracts out there? If an owner can't provide for his employees then they shouldn't be in business. TSA pilots deserve to get everything and more. We're not talking about politics here, this is another case of hard working people that are being paid under a substandard contract.
 
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