Another unresponsive plane over the Atlantic-TBM 700
- Thread starter Champcar
- Start date
Mark815
Well-Known Member
Isn't this the 2nd in 2 weeks? What the heck is going on out there?
TUC at 28,000 is roughly around 2-4min if I remember the books correctly, however that's at a normal breathing rate. Throw in panic breathing if there's something seriously wrong and those numbers could be less than 60 seconds. Slow pressure losses are also possible, which is where the hypoxia comes in. By the time someone notices the cabin has climbed to a dangerous level, it may very well be too late. There's some pretty interesting videos of altitude chamber demos where the person in the chamber can't even perform a basic task once hypoxia sets in.
TUC at 28,000 is roughly around 2-4min if I remember the books correctly, however that's at a normal breathing rate. Throw in panic breathing if there's something seriously wrong and those numbers could be less than 60 seconds. Slow pressure losses are also possible, which is where the hypoxia comes in. By the time someone notices the cabin has climbed to a dangerous level, it may very well be too late. There's some pretty interesting videos of altitude chamber demos where the person in the chamber can't even perform a basic task once hypoxia sets in.
juxtapilot
Snowflake
Thought the same thing...
Hacker15e
Who am I? Where are my pants?
Yep, I remember reading his Bermuda Triangle book as a kid.
kiloalpha
Well-Known Member
TBM... most likely an owner pilot that transition from a Cirrus. As a former TBM pilot myself, I always made sure those masks worked before takeoff. If the valve was off at the bottle, it would be a red annunciator on the Garmin CAS. O2 pressure is displayed right above it, however if the crew switch was off, the masks wouldn't work. Passenger mask would auto deploy at 14,000 provided you had pressure in your bottle. Now back to my owner pilot statement. I've seen these guys go and get their O2 from the local welder's shop and top off their TBM. I was told "it's all the same stuff" by one of them once. My jaw nearly hit the floor in disbelief. But I couldn't argue with the guy. He has one of those 'I'm always right' type personalities, so I told his partner (airplane ownership) not to use the O2 stored in the hangar and get it serviced every time you go get the oil changed.
You talking in general about owner operators of TBMs, or of this particular pilot/crew?
kiloalpha
Well-Known Member
In general about owner operators of TBMs.
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
I would agree, it's all the same stuff.
Do you think suppliers of o2 keep three different tanks, welders, medical and aviation? They have one tank of liquid oxygen and everything comes from that.
kiloalpha
Well-Known Member
Any breathing oxygen is stored in a tank that has been vacuum cleaned before hand, welders O2 may come from a bottle that once held acetylene. I doubt you want to breath that. And medical grade oxygen has a higher water content which could cause freezing in the lines.
Yeah, that's unfortunate. There are things one can "go the cheap" on, and things one can't or shouldn't. If this is the case with this particular operator, I imagine that will surface as at least a finding in the investigation. Whether or not a causal finding, would have to be then determined.
smt6
Well-Known Member
Guy was the president of TBMOPA. You can take that for what it worth, but this isn't a guy that jumped from a Cirrus yesterday. Previously owned a 700, and the 900 had less then probably 25 hours on it. Give it some time...
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
No, acetylene tanks and oxygen tanks are of completely different construction inside and out. You can't even put an acetylene regulator on an oxygen bottle, the threads are reversed and one is male, the other female.
Liquid oxygen is as pure as it gets and free of moisture. You can't get better aviation oxygen.
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kiloalpha
Well-Known Member
Andrew Knott? Wow didn't know that!
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
Laurence and Jane Glazer killed as plane crashes in Jamaica
http://www.rbj.net/article.asp?aID=210489#.VAoTEMhzRCs.twitter
Bogey
Well-Known Member
From AOPA http://www.aopa.org/Pilot-Resources...d-Passenger-Physiology/Oxygen-Use-in-Aviation
TL;DR All O2 comes from the same place. Industrial O2 isnt tested. Medical O2 has been tested for impurities. Aviation O2 is further tested for moisture.
TL;DR All O2 comes from the same place. Industrial O2 isnt tested. Medical O2 has been tested for impurities. Aviation O2 is further tested for moisture.
fholbert
Mod's - Please don't edit my posts!
Here is an article worth reading: http://www.avweb.com/news/pelican/182079-1.html?redirected=1
Having problems finding Aviator's Breathing Oxygen to refill your bottle? Upset about the rip-off prices some FBOs charge for an O2 fill? Don't put up with it, says AVweb's John Deakin, who explains why it's perfectly safe — and perfectly legal — to use cheap welder's oxygen, and tells you exactly what you need to know to buy it in bulk and do your own refills.
