Another Cape Air question

[CD427]

How does Cape Air determine if they will allow a passenger to sit in the front seat with the Captain? In what scenario do they decide that the FO is not necessary? Just curious. I want to become a Cape Air FO to kick off my time building (post flight instructing) and I'm wondering under what circumstances would I be booted from my right seat for a passenger to sit up there.

 

[msmspilot]

Does the passenger have the $$ to buy the seat? You're off the flight.

With that said, some ops require an FO. High mins captain on an IFR flight plan or autopilot deferred. Then you're on no matter what.

 

[CD427]

oh okay, good to know. I figured it had to be a VFR day or something like that. Did you have to fly with pax in your right seat much during your time there?

 

[milleR]

If she was cute the seat was open. Otherwise I needed that space for the can, my headset case, a bottle of water, paperwork ...

 

[dasleben]

If she was cute the seat was open. Otherwise I needed that space for the can, my headset case, a bottle of water, paperwork ...

I would "like" this 10 times if I could. Also good to add ballast to allow the cute girls to sit up front.

 

[CFI A&P]

Check the other forums about some shady employment contracts before you go to Cape.


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[msmspilot]

oh okay, good to know. I figured it had to be a VFR day or something like that. Did you have to fly with pax in your right seat much during your time there?

It varied. Sometimes I had 9 pax every leg and sometimes it was always empty. It also depended on the route. In the Caribbean, it was pretty common. In Montana, not so much.

 

[tlove482]

It varied. Sometimes I had 9 pax every leg and sometimes it was always empty. It also depended on the route. In the Caribbean, it was pretty common. In Montana, not so much.

You must not have done the Sidney route. It was always full. That might have changed with the low oil prices though.

 

[CD427]

I know about the 30k training contract bc I read it on this site thankfully. I asked my recruiter about it and he confirmed it. The confusing part is that he originally said, "you will be under contract for one year after you make captain." So I asked, okay so I'm not obligated until I make Captain, and he said no your obligated when you sign the contract during training. So that's a little bit of grey area in my opinion. I feel like they want you to think you're under contract right away, but you're really not...?
However, I only have 650TT with 55 multi, so flying for Cape sounds better to me than getting the rest of my hours instructing. I'm currently instructing and working on my CFII. I've applied at Boutique, and Plane Sense, and Air Associates and they all seemed uninterested at the moment.

 

[milleR]

I would "like" this 10 times if I could. Also good to add ballast to allow the cute girls to sit up front.

Yup.

"Need 50 lbs in aft B"
"But you've only got two pax...?"
"Need 50 lbs in aft B"
*lightbulb comes on* "of course, just bring it back"
"Rogaahh"

 

[CFI A&P]

I know about the 30k training contract bc I read it on this site thankfully. I asked my recruiter about it and he confirmed it. The confusing part is that he originally said, "you will be under contract for one year after you make captain." So I asked, okay so I'm not obligated until I make Captain, and he said no your obligated when you sign the contract during training. So that's a little bit of grey area in my opinion. I feel like they want you to think you're under contract right away, but you're really not...?
However, I only have 650TT with 55 multi, so flying for Cape sounds better to me than getting the rest of my hours instructing. I'm currently instructing and working on my CFII. I've applied at Boutique, and Plane Sense, and Air Associates and they all seemed uninterested at the moment.

You're more useful to them as a pilot once you become a captain, hence the contract.

 

[CD427]

Yeah, and I totally understand that. So in your opinion do you think you truly are committed once you start training or do you think you're just frowned upon if you leave before making Captain? I think the only reason I would possibly want out would be if I couldn't stand living where they based me. But.... From what I'm told you won't know where you're based until after you sign the training contract. Regardless, it's a risk I'm willing to take at this point.

 

[msmspilot]

You must not have done the Sidney route. It was always full. That might have changed with the low oil prices though.

That's true. Sydney was always full. I did Sydney some, but OLF was most of my Montana flying.

 

[bimmerphile]

When I interviewed with them about a year ago, they didn't mention anything about $30k contract, but they did expect a 1 year commitment if you got your ATP and upgraded to PIC. The way they had worded it, and the way you are explaining the current situation, makes it sound like you're free to leave before you upgrade. It sounds like you and the recruiter were talking past each other, since you're obligated when you sign the contract, but you wouldn't have to pay up if you don't upgrade.
@raph12 care to comment?

 

[Plata]

. . . your [sic] obligated when you sign the contract during training.

There is nothing gray about this at all.

 

[CoffeeIcePapers]

They're locking people into long term contracts instead of improving working conditions to retain pilots. Usually, this isn't a good sign.

 

[Tyler Pinkerton]

I know about the 30k training contract bc I read it on this site thankfully. I asked my recruiter about it and he confirmed it. The confusing part is that he originally said, "you will be under contract for one year after you make captain." So I asked, okay so I'm not obligated until I make Captain, and he said no your obligated when you sign the contract during training. So that's a little bit of grey area in my opinion. I feel like they want you to think you're under contract right away, but you're really not...?
However, I only have 650TT with 55 multi, so flying for Cape sounds better to me than getting the rest of my hours instructing. I'm currently instructing and working on my CFII. I've applied at Boutique, and Plane Sense, and Air Associates and they all seemed uninterested at the moment.

You are under contract right away, its not that hard. You are signing to stay at least 1 year after upgrading from the day you signed, not the day you upgrade to captain. Otherwise, you owe 30K if you leave 364 days into that year as it is non pro-rated.

They really do not need an SIC except for a few occasions.

When I interviewed with them about a year ago, they didn't mention anything about $30k contract, but they did expect a 1 year commitment if you got your ATP and upgraded to PIC. The way they had worded it, and the way you are explaining the current situation, makes it sound like you're free to leave before you upgrade. It sounds like you and the recruiter were talking past each other, since you're obligated when you sign the contract, but you wouldn't have to pay up if you don't upgrade.
@raph12 care to comment?

I think there had always been a gentlemen's agreement between pilots and the company for length of employment and when they left they were not going after people, but due to the amount of FO's leaving more recently because of company culture, they are now forcing this on everyone.

Pilots leaving because of conditions and new pilots now having a pilot contract... gee that sounds awfully familiar.

 

[tlove482]

They're locking people into long term contracts instead of improving working conditions to retain pilots. Usually, this isn't a good sign.

A year is long term? You'll be in training for 2 months so it's really only 10 months.

 

[msmspilot]

A year is long term? You'll be in training for 2 months so it's really only 10 months.

It's a year after your checkride.

 

[tlove482]

It's a year after your checkride.

Ah, OK. Couldn't remember when the clock started.

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