PSA CRJ-700 AA midair collision

[drunkenbeagle]

Last I checked, there aren't VFR corridors taking Cessnas 200ft past runways at major airports.

How do you think we fly near KMIA or KFLL? Take a look at the terminal area chart down there. Below 400' is pretty normal following the shoreline by FLL. And that feels to high if you are paying attention.

 

[drunkenbeagle]

We have been trying to get the B lowered to 1400’ (currently 3000) west of CDW and north of TEB to protect the TEB 19 final for decades but always told no. The amount of VFR’s who cut through TEB’s final at 2,000 is ridiculous and we have very very little room to manuever around them because EWR is above at 3k and LGA/HPN traffic is just east of TEB. I’m honestly amazed nothing has happened there yet.

The Bravo around here goes down to 1200'. And, in theory, we aren't supposed to be below 1000' where those sectional charts are yellow, so... yeah.

Making the airspace more restrictive would be fine in theory, but approach doesn't have the staffing to deal with the traffic that's currently using the Bravo around here as it is. And as much as AOPA might complain, the Coast Guard and Air Force would probably be even less happy here.

 

[pwttogfk]

I wonder what the normal rate/year of RA’s in the radius of an airport?

But at home point, it appears either that corridor needs to be adjusted or the CTL needs to go away.

I agree. I’m also concerned that that’s all that will happen. DCA was where it finally happened but there have been more than enough close calls nationwide to show that this isn’t an isolated issue. Right now the airspace system is trying to cram 10 gallons of (stuff) into a 5 gallon bucket. Solving the final hole in the cheese and ignoring everything leading up to it is convenient and will cause this to happen again.

 

[GolfChuck]

How do you think we fly near KMIA or KFLL? Take a look at the terminal area chart down there. Below 400' is pretty normal following the shoreline by FLL. And that feels to high if you are paying attention.

Or JFK, LGA, and TEB. The VFR routes around NYC seem to me to be pretty well organized and very safe. Without them, the area would be oversaturated by VFR requests. Occasionally while landing the 31s at JFK that beach transition traffic will cause a TCAS alert that will trigger certain carriers to go around, but so far that hasn't made the news. Most carriers are fine with a cautionary. In the 18 years I have been paying attention I can only remember 3 high-profile incidents involving the VFR corridors around NYC and only one involving a mid-air (between a PA32 and a climbing helicopter). That is fairly impressinve considering the volume. After the midair they changed the rules to segregate the helos and fixed wing aircraft. Cory Lidle and an instructor hit a manhattan high rise trying to turn a cirrus around in the east river corridor. That resulted in a ban of fixed wings not alighting on the east river without an ATC clearance from LGA. The only other one I can think of was a tour helicopter whose passenger pulled the fuel cuttoff.

Has anyone ever flown in the vicinity of Niagra Falls VFR? That is a place I am surprised hasn't made the news. The point is, flying VFR is still very safe, even in congested areas. When stuff happens it is usually due to someone not abiding the rules or following directions. Those causes apply to all aviation equally.

 

[NovemberEcho]

After the midair they changed the rules to segregate the helos and fixed wing aircraft.

They’re not really separated though unless you are in the bravo Skyline route. In the SFRA it’s all still self report with fixed wing and helo traffic mixed in.

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I agree. I’m also concerned that that’s all that will happen. DCA was where it finally happened but there have been more than enough close calls nationwide to show that this isn’t an isolated issue. Right now the airspace system is trying to cram 10 gallons of (stuff) into a 5 gallon bucket. Solving the final hole in the cheese and ignoring everything leading up to it is convenient and will cause this to happen again.

This wasn’t the “thing” I thought we would have, air-traffic wise (I thought it would have been a runway incursion, honestly). But I agree.

 

[NovemberEcho]

This wasn’t the “thing” I thought we would have, air-traffic wise (I thought it would have been a runway incursion, honestly). But I agree.

I expected it in my airspace after losing radios and/or radar

 

[CFI A&P]

below 1000' where those sectional charts are yellow

Just looked up the chart user's guide. That's a change I didn't realize happened. For years the yellow was depicted as an area of prominent lighting at night (city lights) but wasn't specifically called populated as it is today, however the font and size of the city name has always been correlated to city size. It was ambiguous by design, and felt barnstormer-ish recognizing city lights as part of pilotage, the FAA never used density to define population to the benefit of airmen, but now makes me wonder when the change occurred - maybe due to some high profile incidents with bush pilots?

 

[Autothrust Blue]

I expected it in my airspace after losing radios and/or radar

Miles O’Brien did a segment not long before the Washington smash where he was like “the whole system is sort of flashing yellow right now,” which I thought prescient.

 

[roundout]

Miles O’Brien did a segment not long before the Washington smash where he was like “the whole system is sort of flashing yellow right now,” which I thought prescient.

Link?